AR - Josh Duggar Admits Molesting Girls As A Teenager - #3

[wenwe4]

Can I please come visit you?

I have never been to AU and I am very tidy and as a houseguest, offer to shop for and cook meals.

I will bring MalloMars.

With love,
ellie

Ha ha
OT I took peanut butter M&M's cuz they can't get them in Ireland

 

[LisaB]

Oh, I'm sorry you have struggled with some of this. I hope that you have not misread my post to mean I don't think it is sexual abuse. I'm pretty sure you are saying that the posts validates that it was.

It's definitely sexual abuse, even if it felt good or wasn't terrifying. This is crucial. Just like rape is still rape if the victim has an orgasm. That does happen and it's incredibly traumatic and that itself can have horrible ramifications for healthy sexuality later in life.

I think this is what keep my daughter from dealing with having been molested by her stepfather. She told me later that, at the time, she had no idea it was "a sex thing". I saw transcripts of her statement to CPS regarding orgasms so that applies, but he was a 37 year old man who weighed 2 to 4 times what she did. I was working to support her and her evil stepfather, so she enjoyed having someone spend hours on end hanging out with her.

She was 8 when it started and has a long way go.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Can I please come visit you?

I have never been to AU and I am very tidy and as a houseguest, offer to shop for and cook meals.

I will bring MalloMars.

With love,
ellie

LOL!!! Just bring a bike, we'll go touring xo

 

[K_Z]

Given the interest in midwifery by women with young families, the distance delivery combined with monthly seminars seems the most logical way for a student to complete the theoretical side of her education. Apprenticeships, which is what her assistant position really is, IMO, used to be a common method of training in many professions. Now, employers tend to prefer that employees do that in post-secondary institutions. So, Jill, it seems, is doing a demanding juggling of academic and practical education requirements as well as the demands of her children, husband, and family.

In the case of the Mercy In Action College of Midwifery, the organization claims that it prepares students to take nationally recognized exams. It, itself, is not a certificate granting body.

http://www.mercyinaction.com/college-of-midwifery/

Information on other programs may be found at sites such as:
https://homsgroup.wordpress.com/midwifery-schools/
http://www.socalbirth.org/pathways/study.htm
http://www.midwife.org/Education-Programs-Directory
http://www.mothering.com/forum/1693...s-midwifery-training-program-experiences.html

I'd be interested to hear what Joypath or K_Z have to say about distance learning programs in the field of midwifery.

Well, for me, it depends on the overall quality of the program, and rigor and quality of the preceptorship requirements-- along with state law. I think distance learning for some of the didactic component of some programs is reasonable-- even many "traditional" university settings and programs use self-directed internet based learning modules. But I am not willing to put a blanket stamp of approval on all programs that include distance learning. One of the things that concerns me about some of the distance based programs is the rigor of the science/ biology/ physiology component-- which can be lacking as a foundation in many "religious" home school high school curriculums, that conclude with a GED.

Admittedly, I am certainly more open minded toward direct entry midwives than many of my traditionally educated colleagues in the health sciences. As long as I can appreciate and observe that there is a strong component of didactic scientific knowledge, coupled with a strong basis of experiential apprenticeship, as well as a willingness to educate to "when" to refer to a higher level of care, then I can support home birth and community based midwifery for the right (healthy) candidates, delivered from the "right" kind of educated and trained direct entry midwife.

One of the things I have noticed is that NARM (North American Registry of Midwives) has done (they are the main provider of education and licensure exams for direct entry midwives) is that they have stopped counting out of country (overseas) experiences as valid for their initial certification evaluation. That means that "mission trips" to foreign countries no longer "count" for preceptorship experience for initial certification. I think that is a very good thing, as some marginally educated/ marginally qualified individuals have attempted to use a couple of mission trips to fulfill their homebirth preceptorships.

We also have to acknowledge that a significant proportion of those who are not formally trained or certified, but self-identify as "midwives" in religious communities, are NOT formally educated, or have completed supervised preceptorships. Many (ok, most) of these individuals are very informally trained, with extremely limited knowledge and abilities for competent midwifery care.

Most home schooled GED holders are not qualified for baccalaureate study for general admission to science based majors at traditional universities-- it is the rare home school student who is well-educated in the sciences. That does NOT mean home school students cannot achieve admission to traditional universities-- but just that those who have completed a primarily religious based homeschool education face a particular set of challenges to compete for health care and science based majors.

Twenty six states are willing to license direct entry (not formally educated in traditional universities) midwives. All of the 26 that I'm aware of use the NARM criteria. I have personally examined the NARM criteria, and believe it is sound for what they are proposing for client population and scope of practice-- and I have personally arranged and completed a home birth for me with a certified professional midwife (quite controversial among my colleagues).

The bigger issue, as I see it, is "what" is the curriculum proposed by the distance education provider, and what part does the preceptorship play in the process.

A bunch of links to further explain!

http://meacschools.org/

http://meacschools.org/member-school-directory/

http://narm.org/certification/

http://narm.org/entry-level-applicants/

http://narm.org/preceptors/

http://narm.org/preceptors/narm-policy-on-preceptorapprentice-relationships/

http://narm.org/news/revised-policies-ooc/

http://cfmidwifery.org/mmoc/define.aspx

 

[Donjeta]

CARSON CITY, Nev., June 11, 2015 /PRNewswire/ -- The world famous Moonlite Bunny Ranch, famed legal brothel that has been featured on HBO's smash hit series "Cathouse", has taken the extraordinary step of banning TLC's "19 And Counting" star Josh Duggar from entering any of their properties, citing concerns for the safety of the 500 legal prostitutes that are employed there.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...ety-of-their-legal-prostitutes-300097228.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/chelsea-stone/no-they-didnt-do-the-same_b_7563758.html

No, They Didn't Do the Same Thing: Why It's Dangerous to Compare Josh Duggar and Lena Dunham

Lena Dunham and Josh Duggar did different things. Lena Dunham, at the age of 7, asked her mother if her 1-year-old little sister had a vagina like hers. A few days later, she looked -- yes, in fact, her little sister did have a smaller version of the same vagina.

This is not a perversion. This is not sexual. Genitalia is not and should not be inherently sexual. This is anatomical curiosity, from a young child, that involved no sexual touching and no sexual pleasure. Developmental psychologist Ritch Savin-Williams, director of the Sex and Gender Lab at Cornell University, told Slate, "This is clearly not a case of abuse. Children have been doing this stuff forever and ever and ever and ever, and they will do it forever and ever and ever."

Admittedly, Dunham writes about another experience with her little sister in which she tried to bribe her with candy and tried "anything a sexual predator might do to woo a small suburban girl." While this is a joke in poor taste, and has been criticized as demonstrative of Dunham's privilege, it's a joke made precisely because she wasn't a sexual predator -- she was a little girl.

Josh Duggar has admitted to molesting five girls, including four of his sisters.

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/06/sar...e-scandal-with-bogus-lena-dunham-comparisons/

...Palin suggested he had suffered enough.

“Well, I think Josh right now is certainly being punished in the court of public opinion,” she said.

She suggested that he might leverage his newfound infamy to help others, although he’s given no such indication at this point.

“Not a whole lot of people had heard of him before this, but he, though, perhaps now being able to use these very, very less than ideal circumstances, turning them into maybe a format that he could use to educate others and help others get through some really tough situations,” Palin said. “Perhaps that is part of the redemption that he would capitalize on and ultimately help society.”

 

[Donjeta]

And in the "Is There a Gigantic Pedophile Ring in Arkansas?" category:



http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczy...f-child-molest?utm_term=.wfyGR1XkB#.bbkKzvk00

They seem to be dropping out of every tree that shakes but he seems to be from Tennessee.

 

[JenniferTx]

I have zero sympathy for Josh or his googly eyed wife but I do truly feel really sorry for their kids. Those kids will be tormented because of their dads past.

 

[Donjeta]

http://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity...a-role-model-amid-molestation-scandal-2015126

Jana's turn to prop up Michelle's ego. Mostly worth reading for the comments... "How did the girls even think that that would make the situation look any better?

Oh Joshy was fine but we locked our doors to prevent him from molesting us. I can't wait to do that in my home!!"

 

[CHICANA]

That's not entirely true. DHS can check on the welfare of a child or enter the hme with a court order (not the same as a warrant.) If they had a court order, the cops could arrest the parents for not allowing DHS to investigate. The fact that the cops were called, leads me to believe they had a court order.

I could be wrong but I think a court order would be for a removal, I don't think you have to let any government agency in your home without a warrant.

 

[JerseyGirl]

http://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity...a-role-model-amid-molestation-scandal-2015126

Jana's turn to prop up Michelle's ego. Mostly worth reading for the comments... "How did the girls even think that that would make the situation look any better?

Oh Joshy was fine but we locked our doors to prevent him from molesting us. I can't wait to do that in my home!!"

Sometimes I wish that is Michelle posting as "Jana".

I can dream.

 

[Donjeta]

Sometimes I wish that is Michelle posting as "Jana".

I can dream.

idk but someone in the comments is saying that Jana didn't used to have an account. It looks like it's the "official duggar page" posting so it could be a PR guy for all we know.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Dear Duggar critics: You can stop pretending to care about the victims now

https://www.lifesitenews.com/blogs/...stop-pretending-to-care-about-the-victims-now

Let us be clear: It’s not that Josh’s crimes were not horrific (the sisters were very clear that what he did was evil and inexcusable). And it’s not that there may not be room for criticizing certain aspects of and learning important lessons from Jim-Bob or Michelle’s handling of the case. But when our reaction to the pleas from the victims themselves to respect their legal right to privacy, and to explain that they were not "scarred for life," that they have received counseling, healed, forgiven, and put the past behind them, is outrage, then the time has come to ask ourselves what, precisely, is fueling this anger of ours.

In some cases, this anger perhaps stems from our own personal wounds: for many of us are deeply wounded when it comes to matters of sexuality, and this emotional case may have understandably touched those wounds. In others, however, it is quite transparently the desire for blood. But in either case, it is obviously time to stop pretending that it is borne of concern for the victims. In their interview on Friday, Jessa and Jill firmly took that fig leaf away from us.

 

[JerseyGirl]

idk but someone in the comments is saying that Jana didn't used to have an account. It looks like it's the "official duggar page" posting so it could be a PR guy for all we know.

Exactly. Jana doesn't have an account, only the married girls, Josh, and Josiah - who signed up the day he became betrothed.

According to Duggar rules, they do not get access to social media until they become betrothed. Janna is not betrothed so someone posting is Janna is either Michelle or the PR guy. If it is Jana, then all hope is lost.

 

[Donjeta]

It's just sad that there doesn't seem to be any way to protect the victims' privacy without enabling the child molester who got away with it.

How about the other victims, the ones who were awake at the time? Are they all lovey dovey with Josh now too?

 

[wenwe4]

from the link above "we love each other like crazy" . . . . yup.

Crazy love with each other we like . . . and will defend our right to allow physical and sexual abuse to happen (and continue) in our home under whichever amendment we can find that might fit and twist scripture to back it up. (IMO)

 

[blue22]

I could be wrong but I think a court order would be for a removal, I don't think you have to let any government agency in your home without a warrant.

I don't know specifically about Arkansas, but in my state, if a court order states that they may enter your home...you have to let them in.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I don't know specifically about Arkansas, but in my state, if a court order states that they may enter your home...you have to let them in.

Is there a record of a court order? because you don't have to let anyone in your home without a warrant. No one. In no state.
If there is a court order that is about the same thing but I don't see any court orders at this point. I don't see any cause for this either. My guess is that someone is trying to dig stuff up on them now to go along with the old issue.

 

[Tony1902]

http://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity...a-role-model-amid-molestation-scandal-2015126

Jana's turn to prop up Michelle's ego. Mostly worth reading for the comments... "How did the girls even think that that would make the situation look any better?

Oh Joshy was fine but we locked our doors to prevent him from molesting us. I can't wait to do that in my home!!"

I find this quote from the 'Duggar Girls' Scrapbook' interesting. Each one notes their favorite biblical passage, person, etc. And each one has a quote. This is Jana's:

"Lord, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me, and sever every tie, but the tie that binds me to Thy service and Thy heart."
David Livingstone

She has always appeared be more independent, thoughtful & stalwart than her sisters. IMO

 

[human]

I imagine this is how most child protection services operate.

If there is a report of sexual abuse, I am sure the law will,do what they can to investigate,

I get concerned because there are so many dead children on here who were failed by CPS. Concerning that people want to put up barriers to help the vulnerable.

http://dcps.dc.gov/DC/CFSA/Publication Files/When Child Welfare Investigates Your Family.pdf

 

[blue22]

Is there a record of a court order? because you don't have to let anyone in your home without a warrant. No one. In no state.
If there is a court order that is about the same thing but I don't see any court orders at this point. I don't see any cause for this either. My guess is that someone is trying to dig stuff up on them now to go along with the old issue.

Oh no. I was not saying we know there was a court order. Up thread someone asked if they had to let them in without a warrant. I said with a court order they would. IMO (and this is just a guess) the fact that they called LE to help them have access to a child, kind of suggests there was one. That doesn't mean there was one, of course. No, we don't know if there was.