ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - # 7

[LambChop]

Yes, otto, I know that. I believe it's obvious I know that from my posts. I grew up in South Florida and have encountered more than a few "riptides" (as we called them).

But JeannaT is talking about a current running out to sea from the tip of an island and saying she had no shoreline to speak of to serve as a point of orientation. So I am wondering whether what she experienced was a true rip current or whether the tide was moving around an island, causing a current on both sides.

But that is speculation and we have already been told and shown a video a local provided for us that the water was unusually calm in that area. This is why the authorities feel that had RG drowned as GG said in that water the way it was that day they would have found her. Trust me, they know the currents and how they run because they do warn people when they feel there is a danger about going into the water. I have seen flags up on the eastern side in the small beachy coves.

What is more disturbing is that a fisherman claims they left by car and he never saw them go into the water later. Native Arubans are very, very appreciative of blonds so if RG was there and went into the water with a skimpy suit on he would have noticed. They don't miss much. lol

 

[LambChop]

I was replying to Otto who said that it was dark when the coast guard arrived for the search.

And it might be a pleasant time of day to wait for the sun set, but it is not the best time for snorkeling. From what I learned, you want the sun to be shining on the water pretty straight on, so you can see the fish. But that late in the afternoon it would be pretty dark and shadowy. His story makes no sense. Why do you think nobody else was out there? If this was sucjh a great place to snorkel, why were they the only people any where around there?

I think it is because the sane people had left already. jmo

 

[Nova]

But that is speculation and we have already been told and shown a video a local provided for us that the water was unusually calm in that area. This is why the authorities feel that had RG drowned as GG said in that water the way it was that day they would have found her. Trust me, they know the currents and how they run because they do warn people when they feel there is a danger about going into the water. I have seen flags up on the eastern side in the small beachy coves.

What is more disturbing is that a fisherman claims they left by car and he never saw them go into the water later. Native Arubans are very, very appreciative of blonds so if RG was there and went into the water with a skimpy suit on he would have noticed. They don't miss much. lol

True rip currents can appear and dissipate rather quickly, LambChop. In my experience in Florida and California, lifeguards usually know about them only when people get in trouble and report them.

JeannaT reported a specific experience related to the tip of an island and I was trying to understand it. I engaged in no speculation.

But surely we can both appreciate the irony of you accusing me of speculation, only to then speculate yourself as to the reaction of every native Aruban to a blonde in a swimsuit. LOL.

 

[Nova]

I think it is because the sane people had left already. jmo

I agree it is very odd that two people would decide to go snorkeling in an unfamiliar location within a couple hours of sundown. But I've lived in enough resort areas to know that people often get an unrealistic sense of invulnerability while on vacation. Where I live now, we quite regularly collect dead or nearly dead hikers from the surrounding mountains.

 

[Peliman]

"Rip currents move along the surface of the water, pulling you straight out into the ocean, but not underneath the water's surface. A rip current may knock you off your feet in shallow water, however, and if you thrash around and get disoriented, you may end up being pulled along the ocean bottom.

...

Rip currents are terrifying because they catch you off guard: One minute you're bobbing along peacefully in the surf, the next you're being dragged out to sea at top speed. They occur in all sorts of weather and on a wide range of beaches. Unlike violent, crashing waves, you probably won't notice a rip current until you're right in the middle of it."

http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/oceanography/rip-current.htm

From the same source, you need waves. The water was smooth that day.

Why Rip Currents Form
Rip currents are anomalous occurrences, but they are born out of ordinary, everyday ocean waves. On the most basic level, you can think of ocean waves as travelling fluctuations in water level.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/oceanography/rip-current1.htm

 

[vlpate]

What a sweet thing to say, vlpate. I don't want to derail the discussion, but I had to swim at FULL strength for about an hour and a half, which is a very long time to swim as hard as you can. I intended to go out to the second sand bar where my teenage son and I agreed to meet to snorkel together when we got into the water, and somehow I missed it and kept swimming further into dangerous water. By the time he realized I was missing, I was GONE. I ended up about a half mile down the beach when I was finally able to drag myself ashore, and my family was in hysterics. : ( Come to think of it, I'm a bit surprised no one thought to call for help - I was starting to hope for a helicopter overhead. Anyway, alls well that ends well, I just have come away with a deep respect for currents if you swim further than you think you have. Glad you made it back from your near shark experience in the dark in the keys!! ;D

Well apparently Robyn just went under and never resurfaced, not once, not twice, not ever. I do believe, if nothing else, GG is guilty of leaving her there without ever looking back - if his story is to be believed.

I'm impressed with your endurance - I can't imagine being in that situation. Ty, I've never been snorkeling again lol.

 

[Peliman]

Here's a picture after LE arrived. Dealt with many riptides myself growing up in South Florida. IMO the conditions were not right for riptide to be a concern. I also beleive her body would have surfaced within two days even if she sank if and when she drown. I have no idea what happened to her. JMO of course..

 

[vlpate]

He most likely brought equipment for both of them and if she drowned, then the equipment is with her at the bottom of the ocean.

Fortunately the purchase will be traceable - it had to come from somewhere!

 

[neesaki]

I don't mean to make this all about me and my opinions, so I'll make this brief.

I think his life was ruined by the accusations against him, and the jail time he served in the Holloway case. I think he was a brash playboy prior to that, and then she drowned, and it ruined him completely and it led to his dad's death, and that ruined him.

But again, I really don't want to derail this thread.

You're right, this is off topic. But I can honestly say that this is the first time I've ever heard anyone ever try to defend Joran Van der Sloot. Other than his parents. And his poor mother finally gave up on him after he helped send his own father to his grave. Nothing ruined Joran except Joran. And he ruined his family along with him. This is above and beyond the women's lives he is responsible for taking, Stephanie Florez Ramirez and Natalee Holloway, and for all I know there may be more. And I won't get off topic even further by going into how you think Natalee "drowned", which is even more ridiculous, unless of course Joran drowned her himself. JMO

 

[RR0004]

Dateline didn't even have the right hotel

Did they say Marriott...'cause if they were at the Renaissance then it kind of makes sense seeing that it's a Marriott.
I think I've confused myself...which one was it?

 

[neesaki]

Did they say Marriott...'cause if they were at the Renaissance then it kind of makes sense seeing that it's a Marriott.
I think I've confused myself...which one was it?

The Renaissance is a Marriott Hotel property, I believe. I don't remember exactly what they said in the interview. I have heard the names used interchangeably in this case, though I can't say why. Shouldn't be that hard to get the hotel name right, but .....

 

[RR0004]

EXACTLY. Which is why GG 's story makes no sense. There is no way that he would end up right back where he started, and there is no reason that she would have suddenly 'disappeared.' Rip tides don't work like that.

Which makes me wonder...if he was swimming for his life...he probably had little strength when it came to getting out of the water. Surely his legs would have been scratched if he dragged himself out by those rocks? I also wish LE had checked the inside of his sneakers for sand. If the water had been churning, I would imagine sand ending up in his sneaks.

 

[RR0004]

sh

True rip currents can appear and dissipate rather quickly, LambChop. In my experience in Florida and California, lifeguards usually know about them only when people get in trouble and report them.

JeannaT reported a specific experience related to the tip of an island and I was trying to understand it. I engaged in no speculation.

But surely we can both appreciate the irony of you accusing me of speculation, only to then speculate yourself as to the reaction of every native Aruban to a blonde in a swimsuit. LOL.

LC is very familiar with the island...as am I. Perhaps she's basing it on her experiences there...which I can attest to as well.

 

[RR0004]

No, the call was made at 6:23pm. Sun was fully down by 7:02pm. So he is saying she disappeared an hour before sunset. That water is dark once that sun starts to set. Baby Beach is also at the southeastern most tip of the island where the sun sets at the northwestern tip of the island. jmo

Yep...just checked...sunset was @ 7pm.

 

[vlpate]

You're right, this is off topic. But I can honestly say that this is the first time I've ever heard anyone ever try to defend Joran Van der Sloot. Other than his parents. And his poor mother finally gave up on him after he helped send his own father to his grave. Nothing ruined Joran except Joran. And he ruined his family along with him. This is above and beyond the women's lives he is responsible for taking, Stephanie Florez Ramirez and Natalee Holloway, and for all I know there may be more. And I won't get off topic even further by going into how you think Natalee "drowned", which is even more ridiculous, unless of course Joran drowned her himself. JMO

Actually, Joe Tacopina also said Van Dersloot was driven to killing Stephany by the NH disappearance and the way people treated him. I really wouldn't expect anything more from Tac though.

I haven't a clue what happened to RG - but if she drowned, she was probably held under the water involuntarily. JMO

 

[Dushi]

The Renaissance is a Marriott Hotel property, I believe. I don't remember exactly what they said in the interview. I have heard the names used interchangeably in this case, though I can't say why. Shouldn't be that hard to get the hotel name right, but .....

I also have heard them call the renaissance hotel the marriott
And Yes, its because it is a marriott property
But it is not in Palm beach
I do believe the reporter said marriott, Palm beach
JMO

 

[Dushi]

Gary Giordano was arrested in Aruba for murder! Now, the sole suspect in the disappearance of Robyn Gardner defends his story in an exclusive interview.

It’s a must-see Geraldo at Large — Tonight, 10p ET.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/12/04/exclusive-interview-with-gary-giordano/

 

[LambChop]

True rip currents can appear and dissipate rather quickly, LambChop. In my experience in Florida and California, lifeguards usually know about them only when people get in trouble and report them.

JeannaT reported a specific experience related to the tip of an island and I was trying to understand it. I engaged in no speculation.

But surely we can both appreciate the irony of you accusing me of speculation, only to then speculate yourself as to the reaction of every native Aruban to a blonde in a swimsuit. LOL.

It's not speculation. I've been traveling to Aruba every year for almost 30 years and I have been told this by friends there and the locals. No different than in our own country. Blonds do get more attention. RG was very striking and probably more so in person than in her pictures.

Since the authories are saying that part of their suspicion of GG's story is that the water became rough and a storm was coming in. That is not true and they know that. The tip of the island faces Venezuela and is about 17 miles so where she supposedly went into the water is not open ocean and the water is calmer than say up by the lighthouse which is quite turbulent when you ride up there by boat. On the eastern side of the island which is noted for riptides it's open ocean and she could have been pulled out to sea had he taken her there. If the report is true about the dog graveyard and GG headed up the eastern shoreline that could be where she went in and why she has not washed ashore.

There is a lot of traffic running back and forth in that 17 mile stretch of water, tankers, freighters, fishing boats and after awhile her body would have surfaced if nothing were weighing her down so the fact that they have not found her is surprising if that is where she went in.

There is nothing wrong with speculation except when we've already been told the roughness of the water was not an issue by experts who would know. GG lied about the conditions because there was no storm and he specifically claims there was a storm. You can see a storm coming in over the water from way out at sea there are no surprises when one comes in. Because of the size of the island all storms come in from the sea and you can see them pretty far off. No storms develop on the island itself. So he has locked himself into a lie that he cannot get out of.

I just don't think we should give him the benefit of the doubt about a riptide when he has lied and the authories feel it was too calm for that type of condition to exist. Anything is possible but that possibility seems to be very low and it's Robyn who deserves the truth to come out. She can't tell her story. If GG lied about the storm what else did he lie about. jmo

 

[LambChop]

I also have heard them call the renaissance hotel the marriott
And Yes, its because it is a marriott property
But it is not in Palm beach
I do believe the reporter said marriott, Palm beach
JMO

Were they staying at the Renaissance? That is amazing because the Renasissance has their own beach area and and area to snorkel that is perfectly safe. Why drive to Baby Beach two days in a row when there was that beautiful little island for them to spend the day? I've never been there myself but I understand it is beautiful and right off the shore.

I know he stayed at the Renaissance when he was released from jail but were they staying there originally? jmo

 

[Dushi]

Were they staying at the Renaissance? That is amazing because the Renasissance has their own beach area and and area to snorkel that is perfectly safe. Why drive to Baby Beach two days in a row when there was that beautiful little island for them to spend the day? I've never been there myself but I understand it is beautiful and right off the shore.

I know he stayed at the Renaissance when he was released from jail but were they staying there originally? jmo

Yes, they were staying at the renaissance

I have always questioned why they went to that bar and beach two days in a row as well.