ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - # 9

[LolliPop]

Micheline

You are spot on.

 

[LambChop]

I am not joking.

The whole beach location has been something that was unclear from the beginning.

The first reports claimed they went swimming behind the former Nanki Country Club.
Then it was mentioned Robyn allegedly drowned while snorkeling at Baby Beach.
Then it was mentioned they had went swimming at Rodgers beach.
Then it was mentioned they went swimming between Rogers Beach and Baby Beach.
Then two months later someone made a video of "rocky point" and since then it has been assumed that is where Giordano claims they went snorkeling.

You said the whole area is the same (as in rocks) but how then does that fit witnesses who have seen them walking the shoreline, if it is just jagged rocks how could Robyn walk the shoreline there on high heels or barefoot?
Then there are witnesses who claim the towels of Robyn and Giordano were on the beach and her dress aside from the towels on the beach, if it is all rocks how could anyone be lying there even when using a towel?

You keep referring to Babybeach while as far as I know they were at the southern part of Rodgers Beach, that is not just rocks, there are area's of rocks, but since there are area's of sand too, why does ABC show the rocks only, why would anyone assume they must have walked over these jagged rocks while they could have walked in the sand?

Then I see footage of the re enactment, and I see no rocks, it is green and sand in the re enactment.

Here is a picture of the area, you have been there, can you point out to me where in your opinion they went into the sea? TIA

On the right side of the picture about an inch down is Rocky Point. You can see the opening to the sea for Baby Beach (the cove like area). Baby Beach area is the crescent area surrounding the cove. If you follow along from the point back maybe a 1/2 or so that is where they went in. It is the area behind the restaurant.

Where you see the restaurant and the land curves back to the left, that is Rodger's Beach. There were no reports from GG, LE or witnesses that they went into the water at Rodger's Beach only the dive shop owner who claimed that this is where he would have recommended they go into the water had he asked.

You can see the green then the road which is hard packed sand over rock and the water's edge is pretty much rock. About 2 inches in you can see where the beach road curves towards the restaurant. That is where there is a beach area. IMO that when you see the pictures of the sand that is where LE was meeting to decide what they were going to do.

As for him laying down the towels it appears they were on part of the road area. Not the best to sit or lie down on to get a tan (another inconsistency I'm guessing). Not an area I would pick when Baby Beach is right behind you. And if they were in the dive shop why didn't GG ask where the best place to snorkel would be. He was right there????? It does not make sense along with a lot of other things.

But that whole darker area is full of sea weed and the fish are over in that area not where he claims they were. The area that is light (mostly rocks and sand) is to the right and that is where he claims they were snorkeling. So you can figure 100 yards from the restaurant to the right in the picture and that is where they were. jmo

 

[vlpate]

I am not joking.

The whole beach location has been something that was unclear from the beginning.

The first reports claimed they went swimming behind the former Nanki Country Club.
Then it was mentioned Robyn allegedly drowned while snorkeling at Baby Beach.
Then it was mentioned they had went swimming at Rodgers beach.
Then it was mentioned they went swimming between Rogers Beach and Baby Beach.
Then two months later someone made a video of "rocky point" and since then it has been assumed that is where Giordano claims they went snorkeling.

You said the whole area is the same (as in rocks) but how then does that fit witnesses who have seen them walking the shoreline, if it is just jagged rocks how could Robyn walk the shoreline there on high heels or barefoot?
Then there are witnesses who claim the towels of Robyn and Giordano were on the beach and her dress aside from the towels on the beach, if it is all rocks how could anyone be lying there even when using a towel?

You keep referring to Babybeach while as far as I know they were at the southern part of Rodgers Beach, that is not just rocks, there are area's of rocks, but since there are area's of sand too, why does ABC show the rocks only, why would anyone assume they must have walked over these jagged rocks while they could have walked in the sand?

Then I see footage of the re enactment, and I see no rocks, it is green and sand in the re enactment.

Here is a picture of the area, you have been there, can you point out to me where in your opinion they went into the sea? TIA

They were 100 yrds from the Reef Restaurant...is this information correct?

 

[Micheline]

Thank you Lambchop, is it correct that according to you the spot where they allegedly went into the sea acc. to Giordano is B?

 

[vlpate]

I am not joking.

The whole beach location has been something that was unclear from the beginning.

The first reports claimed they went swimming behind the former Nanki Country Club.
Then it was mentioned Robyn allegedly drowned while snorkeling at Baby Beach.
Then it was mentioned they had went swimming at Rodgers beach.
Then it was mentioned they went swimming between Rogers Beach and Baby Beach.
Then two months later someone made a video of "rocky point" and since then it has been assumed that is where Giordano claims they went snorkeling.

You said the whole area is the same (as in rocks) but how then does that fit witnesses who have seen them walking the shoreline, if it is just jagged rocks how could Robyn walk the shoreline there on high heels or barefoot?
Then there are witnesses who claim the towels of Robyn and Giordano were on the beach and her dress aside from the towels on the beach, if it is all rocks how could anyone be lying there even when using a towel?

You keep referring to Babybeach while as far as I know they were at the southern part of Rodgers Beach, that is not just rocks, there are area's of rocks, but since there are area's of sand too, why does ABC show the rocks only, why would anyone assume they must have walked over these jagged rocks while they could have walked in the sand?

Then I see footage of the re enactment, and I see no rocks, it is green and sand in the re enactment.

Here is a picture of the area, you have been there, can you point out to me where in your opinion they went into the sea? TIA

The first report said she cut her foot IN the water, if true, what difference does the shoreline make? Conflicting reports confuse.

 

[LolliPop]

A lot of difference.

 

[LambChop]

Thank you Lambchop, is it correct that according to you the spot where they allegedly went into the sea acc. to Giordano is B?

I think it is closer to C. A would be the start of Rodger's Beach going left and Nanki would be around B and Rocky Point is at the very end. Rocky Point is named because it's obvious, I guess. It's at the point and rocky.... So I think what the locals are saying it is Nanki Beach out near Rocky Point because they would understand the location more than we would.

So I'm guessing that the news truck would have been behind the dive shop and was shooting pictures over the grassy area that you can see on the pictures and the actors were at the water's edge getting into the water..

To the best of my recollection if you were looking down on the spot this is what you would see:

&&&&&& is grassy area
oooooooo larger rocks where GG was sitting
_________ is the road which is hard packed sand over rocks
####### would be the rocks at the water's edge
{{{{{{ would be the water

When you step into the water from the rocks it's approximately 1 foot deep there I think so it's not like walking into the water from the beach where you start walking in on the sand with the water at an inch and it slowly get deeper. jmo

Hope you can understand

 

[LambChop]

They were 100 yrds from the Reef Restaurant...is this information correct?

I believe that is what GG claimed. That he had to run 100 yards, approximately the length of a football field. jmo

 

[neesaki]

This is a few weeks old but I don't remember seeing it or it being posted here. Sorry, I don't know how to embed videos.

Dan Abrams, Dr. Michael Welner discuss Gary Giordano's second ABC interview.
"Aruba Mystery: Is Gary Giordano Unemotional?"
05:02 | 12/05/2011

Dr. Welner: "if you hit the raw nerve of Giordano, he goes off the script".

RE: motive: "... the most likely explaination for motive is a rejection sensitivity, because you have Giordano who has a history of domestic violence complaints ....
What were the triggers that inspired those complaints against him from multiple women. How did they play out in the relationship that he had with Gardner? "

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/aru...otional-robyn-gardners-disappearance-15086624

 

[LolliPop]

It would be good if totally neutral commentators had to give their unbiased point of views.

To continually have media talking heads and selective commentators weighing in with what is clearly a rehearsed interview does nothing to help a victim.

 

[LambChop]

I noticed on the timeline that GG & RG were scheduled to leave on Thursday, August 4th, not Friday. If this is the case GG stayed a day later than his scheduled flight. If he was told he could leave the country, as he claims, why didn't he leave on his scheduled flight? IMO his attorney was in contact with LE about whether he could leave or not and GG admits discussing it with both his attorney and the consulate. We only have GG's word that he had this conversation because neither his attorney (ML) nor the consulate have given a statement to confirm the conversation that we know of.

It seem suspicious that all of a sudden GG tried to leave in such a hurry with the Aruban LE rushing over to the airport to arrest him. Something was already in the works regarding his arrest and I'm willing to bet his attorney was aware of it and so was GG. Had his attorney been informed that he was not to leave???

What concerns me is the sweating. They said he was drenched in sweat. The airport is fully air conditioned and even if you tried to run for your flight there are too many barriers in between...Aruban immigration, security, pick up your luggage, US customs, baggage drop off, US security check, an escalator to the departure floor and the areas for flights that are leaving are right there. Not enough distance to get drenched in sweat. Sounds more as if the sweat may have been from stress. jmo

 

[LambChop]

Thank you Lambchop, is it correct that according to you the spot where they allegedly went into the sea acc. to Giordano is B?

If you look at the C portion on your map that whole gray area under the water is rocky. Not so much coral-like but individual rocks jutting up from the sand. GG claims they were in 10-15 feet of water when RG disappeared and that area is pretty clear when you are looking down at it on the satellite map. LE was in the water right away and the fact that they found nothing I think surprised them. RG should have been right there had it happened as GG claims it happened. Some of those rocks are pretty big so if she went to the bottom they should have found her as some of those rocks might have kept her from moving around.

Now notice how dark the water is at the top of the picture. This is the eastern portion of the island and it faces the open sea. The cliffs are over in that area and the water crashing onto the cliffs appears to be deep. But the area at the lefthand side and bottom is not extremely deep. There is shelf there and the water is much calmer. The darker area in the water near the Club I believe is seaweed. IMO that is where the fisherman as there are probably a lot of fish hiding in the seaweed.

O/T but Aruba has the best fish, ever. I never eat fish at home but order it a lot while I am vacationing in Aruba. jmo

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

It would be good if totally neutral commentators had to give their unbiased point of views.

To continually have media talking heads and selective commentators weighing in with what is clearly a rehearsed interview does nothing to help a victim.

What I found very interesting about the ABC interview was how different parts of that same interview can be extracted.

For instance--Dr. Welner had explained that when you are on national T.V, being interviewed, your freedom in jeopardy, and so much hanging on every word, it would be hard to read too much into his tone.

Furthermore Dr. Welner also mentioned that in his experience you may not see remorse, sadness, caring in Giordano until is "all over".

.....The refusal to even consider another point of view about Giordano's guilt or innocence has made me determined to see both sides of this issue. Strange, because when I first read about this , I was with everyone else here in thinking he was guilty. The more time that went by without a body, proof of foul play, and GG's ultimate release I began to wonder. Then with his first interview I felt he answered the questions adequately enough to convince me it "may have been an accident". I guess I find it hard to believe nothing anyone can say will even make a dent in the definitive guilt of GG. It does however make one question the credibility of those views.

Expressing our viewpoint is what this forum is about, so I will continue to do my best to see both sides. LOL!!!! SLEUTH ON:soldier::twocents:

 

[katydid23]

What I found very interesting about the ABC interview was how different parts of that same interview can be extracted.

For instance--Dr. Welner had explained that when you are on national T.V, being interviewed, your freedom in jeopardy, and so much hanging on every word, it would be hard to read too much into his tone.

Furthermore Dr. Welner also mentioned that in his experience you may not see remorse, sadness, caring in Giordano until is "all over".

.....The refusal to even consider another point of view about Giordano's guilt or innocence has made me determined to see both sides of this issue. Strange, because when I first read about this , I was with everyone else here in thinking he was guilty. The more time that went by without a body, proof of foul play, and GG's ultimate release I began to wonder. Then with his first interview I felt he answered the questions adequately enough to convince me it "may have been an accident". I guess I find it hard to believe nothing anyone can say will even make a dent in the definitive guilt of GG. It does however make one question the credibility of those views.

Expressing our viewpoint is what this forum is about, so I will continue to do my best to see both sides. LOL!!!! SLEUTH ON:soldier::twocents:

If GG did not have such a shady past, then I would be much more open to his possible innocence. But his past incidents with women, many of them vindictive, bizarre, and violent, and his past brushes with the law, which include forgery and extortion and lying/stealing, all together, they spell trouble for him. What are the chances that his story, with all of the inconsistencies and oddities, is true?

 

[Dushi]

how many times have I heard that the Arubans would know things, you know info, rumours
Not true or at least I am hearing nothing

But i will tell you, according to them, there are many areas in the general location of robyns disappearance that is very accessable JMO

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

If GG did not have such a shady past, then I would be much more open to his possible innocence. But his past incidents with women, many of them vindictive, bizarre, and violent, and his past brushes with the law, which include forgery and extortion and lying/stealing, all together, they spell trouble for him. What are the chances that his story, with all of the inconsistencies and oddities, is true?

I hear ya, Katydid,and his past is troublesome. What is the chance that his story is true??....who knows, his past has come back to haunt him that's for sure. I guess I wonder with his past as such, why his anger, now ,at 50 would result in murder. If in fact he was prone to violence toward women to the point of murder, was RG someone he was that emotionally invested in to set him off like that.:waitasec:

 

[katydid23]

I hear ya, Katydid,and his past is troublesome. What is the chance that his story is true??....who knows, his past has come back to haunt him that's for sure. I guess I wonder with his past as such, why his anger, now ,at 50 would result in murder. If in fact he was prone to violence toward women to the point of murder, was RG someone he was that emotionally invested in to set him off like that.:waitasec:

I think it was shown that he was in a very bad place financially. He was desperate for cash at that time. So I think her death was a direct result of the life insurance policy, imo.

And he was NOT emotionally invested in her at all. That is why he could carry out the deed, imo.

 

[LambChop]

Too many inconsistencies for me. I think one of the eeriest moments in the that GMA interview was when Robin asked him if he was planning on claiming the insurance and he waited for a few seconds before answering and then said "I'm thinking about it." Not, "Robin, I'm really not interested in that money" but "I'm thinking about it." I'm willing to bet at that very moment JB would have liked to have crawled under a rock.

I don't think GR believe him either. He was awfully hard on him with his questions. Only to have JB complain that GG was giving "too much detail". A truthful statement doesn't not have too many details, only a statement based on lies would have too much detail. Dr. Glass would be the first to tell us that. I just find his story incredibly hard to believe given the witnesses and the fact his attorney (ML) will not back up his stories. jmo

 

[LambChop]

how many times have I heard that the Arubans would know things, you know info, rumours
Not true or at least I am hearing nothing

But i will tell you, according to them, there are many areas in the general location of robyns disappearance that is very accessable JMO

I think the interest is different this time. As I said I had heard that rumor about NH the Saturday after she went missing. But they were Arubans who were involved and Joran's father was a political figure up for a judge's position. So the island was a buzz with rumors. This time it's an American accused of killing an American so the interest probably just isn't there. They go on with their lives just as we do here.

I could see someone going aboard a large fishing boat and being held captive there all night and taken away early in the morning but RG was last seen at 4:30 and GG reported her missing at 6:15 and this was in the daylight. Plus if she were taken he'd still be in trouble because he claims she drowned. jmo

 

[neesaki]

What I found very interesting about the ABC interview was how different parts of that same interview can be extracted.

For instance--Dr. Welner had explained that when you are on national T.V, being interviewed, your freedom in jeopardy, and so much hanging on every word, it would be hard to read too much into his tone.

Furthermore Dr. Welner also mentioned that in his experience you may not see remorse, sadness, caring in Giordano until is "all over".

.....The refusal to even consider another point of view about Giordano's guilt or innocence has made me determined to see both sides of this issue. Strange, because when I first read about this , I was with everyone else here in thinking he was guilty. The more time that went by without a body, proof of foul play, and GG's ultimate release I began to wonder. Then with his first interview I felt he answered the questions adequately enough to convince me it "may have been an accident". I guess I find it hard to believe nothing anyone can say will even make a dent in the definitive guilt of GG. It does however make one question the credibility of those views.

Expressing our viewpoint is what this forum is about, so I will continue to do my best to see both sides. LOL!!!! SLEUTH ON:soldier::twocents:

BBM. ITA, Dr. Welner is presenting his professional and unbiased opinion in that he presents more than one viewpoint, and he keeps an open mind and doesn't nail GG to the wall.

The reason I posted these particular statements was simply because this theory is one that has been frequently put forth in this forum as a possible motive and explaination as to what happened to Robyn.

And thanks for trying to see both sides, R.U., as I try to do as well, though I have to say, it would take a lot at this point for me not to consider Robyn a victim and GG the prime suspect. But to each his own! :seeya: