AUS - Khandalyce Kiara Pearce (Wynarka) and mum Karlie Pearce-Stevenson (Belanglo) #8

[Makara]

I've always found Des Bray's choice of words in the press conference interesting.

DES BRAY: And the last recorded sighting is now confirmed as being in Charnwood in Canberra. We believe that Karlie and Khandalyce were killed at different times and at different locations but we can't say anymore about that at the moment.

The choice of the word - last RECORDED sighting is now confirmed....

- photograph or CCTV reference?

Does that mean there are more sightings that were not "recorded" - I think yes....

And if you straight away read his next sentence about "different times and locations" - it has led me to believe that there were "sightings" of the non recorded variety that separated mother and daughter post 14/15 December - IMO

I think there are LOTS of witness statements to come - people we have never heard of who are helping LE obtain justice for K&K.

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2015/s4339988.htm


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BBM: It may also mean a police record of a statement by a witness. The witness statement is now recorded.

 

[Makara]

"So when Des Bray says: 'The last reported sighting' how sure can we be that he's not referring to another sighting."

My point is, that is all they have confirmed, released, whatever. If there was another reported sighting, in all likelihood, they would have referred to that sighting, and not the one at Charnwood.

Exactly.

Police believe the pair were most likely murdered in December 2008 because there were no confirmed sightings of them after that date.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-10-23/police-search-homes-in-sa-canberra-mother-daughter/6879814

BBM: UBM:

 

[JLZ]

And I don't think Holdom is as quiet as is made out, merely by lack of released statements by the police, or anyone else.. I think he is blabbing for his very life. Naturally.. it is a matter of how the rest of his long life is going to go.

(snipped)

I understood that DH hasn't lodged a plea yet because he's waiting to see what the evidence is against him. In my opinion he wouldn't be making a gift of information before he knows the strength of his own position. Also in my opinion the police aren't going to drop a homicide charge against him for the sake of a few morsels about drug trafficking (for example) or Centrelink fraud.

 

[JaneSA]

What makes you think her belongings were sorted into two suitcases before she got to Canberra? Seems like a bit of tail chasing going on.

2 suitcases of Karlie's belongings found at DH's sister's home.
1 suitcase of Khandalyce's belongings found in Wynarka.
Possibility that Lanza bag was purchased at Strandbags in Mt Gambier for the purpose of separating out Khandalyce's items.

 

[Wolfinator]

(snipped)

I understood that DH hasn't lodged a plea yet because he's waiting to see what the evidence is against him. In my opinion he wouldn't be making a gift of information before he knows the strength of his own position. Also in my opinion the police aren't going to drop a homicide charge against him for the sake of a few morsels about drug trafficking (for example) or Centrelink fraud.

Unless the blabbing is about our worst case scenario for Kandalyce... And others involved.


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[Makara]

yep the first murder may not have been intentional. just got out of hand. Then you got to clean up. Oh and well might aswell milk the bank account for as long as you can . keeps her alive and keeps them in some cash and otyher potential frauds. A win win situation of the ugliest form.

BBM: Karlie's murder may or may not have been intentional but IMO Khandalyce's murder was premeditated and very intentional. :furious:

 

[Trooper]

(snipped)

I understood that DH hasn't lodged a plea yet because he's waiting to see what the evidence is against him. In my opinion he wouldn't be making a gift of information before he knows the strength of his own position. Also in my opinion the police aren't going to drop a homicide charge against him for the sake of a few morsels about drug trafficking (for example) or Centrelink fraud.

Because he hasn't as yet been charged with Khandalyce's murder, I suspect that he is blabbing stuff that distances himself from that crime. More so, because no one else , so far, has been charged with that crime that I think Holdom is throwing out, thru his solicitor , what he can do to remove himself as far from that dirty crime as is possible, if only considering his current situation, just as an aside. Fingers pointed at anyone, anywhere.. I would imagine morsels about drug trafficking , if any, or Centrelink fraud, ( quite well established ) would not be at the forefront of any floated deals from Holdom's solicitor to the SAPOL ,or the NSW POL.. to Task Force Mallee. They are not worth much in the situation Holdom is in now , and wouldn't get him much of a hearing, and most likely would be a distraction...

 

[JaneSA]

I've always found Des Bray's choice of words in the press conference interesting.

DES BRAY: And the last recorded sighting is now confirmed as being in Charnwood in Canberra. We believe that Karlie and Khandalyce were killed at different times and at different locations but we can't say anymore about that at the moment.

The choice of the word - last RECORDED sighting is now confirmed....

- photograph or CCTV reference?

Does that mean there are more sightings that were not "recorded" - I think yes....

And if you straight away read his next sentence about "different times and locations" - it has led me to believe that there were "sightings" of the non recorded variety that separated mother and daughter post 14/15 December - IMO

I think there are LOTS of witness statements to come - people we have never heard of who are helping LE obtain justice for K&K.

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2015/s4339988.htm


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Excellent "reading between the lines", Wolfie.
I think you have nutted that out.

 

[Wolfinator]

Excellent "reading between the lines", Wolfie.
I think you have nutted that out.

Makara pointed out that it was also possibly "recorded" in relation to being recorded in police witness statements.

Either way - the remainder of the post can still stand. Hopefully lots and lots of people are helping LE deliver justice.


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[JLZ]

If he knows anything about Khandalyce's murder, "blabbing" it will implicate rather than distance him. I can't see his solicitor being party to that at this stage.

 

[Trooper]

From my point of view , every day that goes by without Holdom being charged with Khandalyce's murder, or anyone else being charged with it, confirms in my mind that Holdom is yapping without ceasing, to his solicitor to pass on to the Task Force. It is just my point of view, naturally I don't have an inside run on this, but on the surface of things, there is a certain kind of logic. .

Khandalyce and Karlie are in Canberra. ( confirmed sightings ) ..

Holdom murders Karlie. Takes body to Belanglo Forest., returns back to , probably ,where he murdered her, or close by. . after all, he has to be living somewhere, be based somewhere.

Now.. it just makes logic to me, that Khandalyce is there, too. As she was with Karlie. That he now is the sole guardian of Khandalyce, and I don't mean that in a good way. I mean that murdering Karlie has now confronted him with a whole other problem, possibly bigger than the problem , whatever it was, that Karlie presented. Somewhere within the next two days, this big problem, Khandalyce is either on the way to Broadview , South Australia , with him on his tour, alive, or isn't. And is somewhere else, and her clean bones wind up years later in Wynarka, in a suitcase her mother purchased in Mt Gambier, a month before she was murdered, with clothes in it that Khandalyce wore or was wrapped in ( the quilt) ..

So at the very least, he has to have a story of what he did when he returned to base, after the murder. To his solicitor, at least. Something. Or he can pretend to be mad, and be unable to instruct his barrister.

 

[Trooper]

Most of all. he would have to have some sort of yarn, some long convoluted chase that the police are sent on, something along the lines of , you know, the bushy haired stranger, who suddenly appears and takes the child from him.. or.. some one who just turns up on the front porch and takes Khandalyce home with them but he forgot to get their name, but he thinks they live in Queanbeyan, and they drove a Nissan Patrol, or the naughty child wandered away,.in the dark...

If he is the last person known to have seen Karlie alive, its not an unreasonable position to propose that he is also the last person to have seen Khandalyce alive, since the two of them were joined at the hip, so he has to dispel that notion by whatever means.

 

[Makara]

Most of all. he would have to have some sort of yarn, some long convoluted chase that the police are sent on, something along the lines of , you know, the bushy haired stranger, who suddenly appears and takes the child from him.. or.. some one who just turns up on the front porch and takes Khandalyce home with them but he forgot to get their name, but he thinks they live in Queanbeyan, and they drove a Nissan Patrol, or the naughty child wandered away,.in the dark...

If he is the last person known to have seen Karlie alive, its not an unreasonable position to propose that he is also the last person to have seen Khandalyce alive, since the two of them were joined at the hip, so he has to dispel that notion by whatever means.

IMO DH's attitude and any response to police questioning is "Prove it." And "It's not my problem, ask Hazel."

IMO HP is the one who has been singing like a canary.

 

[Wolfinator]

If he knows anything about Khandalyce's murder, "blabbing" it will implicate rather than distance him. I can't see his solicitor being party to that at this stage.

Yep - it's the long slow grind of the wheel of justice turning. I'm happy for DPP/LE to take all the time they need to get it right.

I also hope that the horror of K&K's experience in the end can serve some greater purpose. The investigation has already unearthed and hopefully protected some other at risk children.



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[Trooper]

IMO DH's attitude and any response to police questioning is "Prove it." And "It's not my problem, ask Hazel."

IMO HP is the one who has been singing like a canary.

oh hell no argument on that one, both of them, blabbing blabbing blabbing... both are in the same situation, in one sense, except Hazel isn't incarcerated... I have no doubts that high priced barrister who materialised when Hazel was merely meeting with detectives was not there out of the love and admiration of Hazel. She has been relying on legal advice since day 1..... One of the advantages TaskForce Mallee has is that Hazel cant contact Holdum freely and Holdom cannot contact Hazel freely... a very big advantage.

 

[Makara]

oh hell no argument on that one, both of them, blabbing blabbing blabbing... both are in the same situation, in one sense, except Hazel isn't incarcerated... I have no doubts that high priced barrister who materialised when Hazel was merely meeting with detectives was not there out of the love and admiration of Hazel. She has been relying on legal advice since day 1..... One of the advantages TaskForce Mallee has is that Hazel cant contact Holdum freely and Holdom cannot contact Hazel freely... a very big advantage.

BBM: On the one hand yes but imagine the stuff the police would hear if those two were able to communicate freely with each other.

 

[Trooper]

Khandalyce's murder will attract a sentence far greater than the sentence for the murder of Karlie.. there are so many aggravating factors for the killer to be indicted with and absolutely no mitigating factors whatsoever with in the murder of the child it would be surprising if it didn't result in something like 30 or 33 years, before even being permitted to apply for parole.

 

[Trooper]

BBM: On the one hand yes but imagine the stuff the police would hear if those two were able to communicate freely with each other.

who has doubts that someone hasn't slipped a phone each to them, someone who dresses each morning in a heavily disguised uniform of a blue hue? It wouldn't work if either of them suspected it wasn't an underground phone. I suspect they would only trust the underhanded, the illegal , the shifty, the dodgy.

 

[Makara]

Khandalyce's murder will attract a sentence far greater than the sentence for the murder of Karlie.. there are so many aggravating factors for the killer to be indicted with and absolutely no mitigating factors whatsoever with in the murder of the child it would be surprising if it didn't result in something like 30 or 33 years, before even being permitted to apply for parole.

Yep, and if it is found that DH murdered Khandalyce in South Australia, he will be extradited from NSW to South Australia to face that charge. If he is found guilty of Karlie's murder in NSW, he'll serve his sentence there and on the day of his release, the police will be waiting to take him immediately to South Australia for round two.

 

[Makara]

who has doubts that someone hasn't slipped a phone each to them, someone who dresses each morning in a heavily disguised uniform of a blue hue? It wouldn't work if either of them suspected it wasn't an underground phone. I suspect they would only trust the underhanded, the illegal , the shifty, the dodgy.

Nup, HP is too cunning IMO.

ETA: HP will try and throw DH under the bus with every opportunity she gets. IMO.