GUILTY Australia - Jill Meagher, 29, Melbourne, 22 Sep 2012 #2

[marlywings]

I just need to ask for clarification about this rule:

An observation about cars in the CCTV was made on the 'Help Us Find Jill Meagher' FB page. Am I allowed to discuss it here? I think the page was set up by her husband, but the comment was not made by him.

Hi fruity & welcome to WS You can post the link to the facebook page but please don't post any of the comments from there.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

wow....excellent.....I know I heard it somewhere, but think it could be the local townsville news....and hahaha if you have lived up here, you know how good that can be. Actually I woke up at 9.07, so could not be Today. a bit luxurious I know, but it's school hols!!! I have checked everywhere to see where I could have got that about a red hatchback and it is nowhere......my mother said that I definitely told her this morning that the guys were in a red hatchback....am thinking locals have given out too much info

I believe in the very fine print it says that Moms are reliable sources for WS! :smile:

 

[GutFeeling!]

Oh, on that note ... do we know if there's CCTV in the alley where Jill's bag was found?

Snipped: I highly doubt it. This video (it has been posted earlier) actually walks to the place where the handbag was found. I wish this guy had looked for cameras along the way, he did a great job of showing us the area and the route she may take to go home.
http://thebrunxonline.com/2012/09/2...her-was-seen-on-cctv-to-her-home/#comment-166

 

[Fuskier]

After spending several hours this morning watching the video in the slowest possible speed, I made several observations...
... Here are my impressions regarding the interactions between them, based on the hand gestures, posture, body language, etc.

When they first appear in view of the camera, it looks like BH intercepts Jill and is uncomfortably in her space, causing her to take a step back.
She wants to go forward but he is preventing her from doing so.
He seems to be trying to convince her of something or is attempting to get something from her. She seems to be very reluctant to move forward with him, but it looks like he is guiding her forward to some degree. His right arm seems very close to her body, and at an angle that someone would use to usher you forward.
I think there is a very real possibility that this person had already scoped out the surveillance camera, as he makes every effort to position his body so that his face is not ever directly pointing at the camera. It is also possible that he did not take note of the camera until he was standing there with her, which is why he moves ahead of her and stays closer to the wall where he can't be seen clearly.
The next part of the sequence is the most critical in my opinion because I do think that he pulled out a weapon of some kind, either a small pistol or a knife. When he moves forward, he does a " single grapevine-ish" to the left and reaches across his body and then turns slightly towards her with his body, extending his arm in her direction and motioning her ahead. For a second on the film, it definitely appears as though it is an object in his hand.
If this did happen, it presents a very perplexing situation. Why would she not cry or scream or walk away?
I think that she holds her hands out in front of her in a defensive, " hey don't shoot me" pose, after he appears to point something at her. She has her cellphone in her hand. You can see that she is unsure of what to do, and so she starts making small movements away from him and towards the street. She then appears to fumble around with her phone for a minute.
Why would he allow her to stall if he was planning on abducting her? This interaction does not follow the standard "surprise and grab" abduction, I don't think it would be inconceivable for her to try and stall or buy time while still on the street. I think she looks around and behind her to see if there is any chance that someone is going to see what is going on and come to her aid. She may have weighed her options and then reluctantly started walking, with a plan to try and outrun him or ditch him.
Initially I thought he walked on ahead of her, and she followed. I watched that part of the film several times and realized that he did not actually walk away first, he is just largely out of the camera view. If you look closely at the small open section in the window, you will see his leg(s) are still moving.
When she finally starts walking again, her body posture looks like she is very reluctant, like a small child when they "don't wanna go!" somewhere.
After they are out of the camera view completely, there are several cars that pass by rather quickly. One of them is a blue car, and a small dark colored car.
Sorry for rambling.
I also do not think this person acted alone. I think there may have been one and possibly two more people involved. One would be a driver, and the other could have been someone acting as a lookout of sorts.

I was very bothered by the way that he moved. It seemed angry, his jaw was set like a pitbull, and his posture screamed with intensity and malice.
I know that might come across as a stretch, but as always, it is just my opinion.

Excuse any grammatical errors and poorly constructed sentences, and whatnot, as I am exhausted and not on point at the moment.

Thank you LittleMissContrary. Good solid analysis in my opinion. I tend to agree that he does not move on and she follows. He is still standing far left of screen, sometimes a portion of his face enters the screen, then we see the lower part of the pants and a shoe. IMO she moves first, reluctantly, as if she has no other choice and has been ordered to do so - possibly at gunpoint.

 

[Public_Hysteria]

Maybe if it's the norm it should be in the FAQ or the info sent to new members. Can't find it mentioned anywhere.

I've found there are lots of little things that aren't explicitly stated in the rules, but are things that you pick up after posting for a while. Not rules as such, more just 'forum etiquette'. It would take quite a while to list them all, you jut pick it up along the way.

Regardless, welcome to Websleuths! :greetings:

And hello to all the new posters that have joined us! :welcome:

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

The reporter probably wouldn't have known about the case as it didn't happen in Australia.
I had to google it as the name was unknown to me and I follow all the missing persons etc case here so sounds like it didn't make the news here in Australia

Thanks!

I figured that was probably the case... but I was thinking it was a great time to tout WS's horn! :smile:

 

[Public_Hysteria]

Snipped: I highly doubt it. This video (it has been posted earlier) actually walks to the place where the handbag was found. I wish this guy had looked for cameras along the way, he did a great job of showing us the area and the route she may take to go home.
http://thebrunxonline.com/2012/09/2...her-was-seen-on-cctv-to-her-home/#comment-166

This footage is fantastic! I wasn't able to watch while at work today, thanks for bumping it up, it made it much easier to find!

 

[GutFeeling!]

I just need to ask for clarification about this rule:

An observation about cars in the CCTV was made on the 'Help Us Find Jill Meagher' FB page. Am I allowed to discuss it here? I think the page was set up by her husband, but the comment was not made by him.

You can post a link to the official Facebook page but you can't directly copy a post that appears on that page. You can say things like "Someone posted on Facebook that they saw a read car"

This is only my understanding (please correct me if I am wrong anyone) - I avoid Facebook for that reason LOL Plus there are always the attention seekers that like to make stuff up for attention - same as comments made under news stories.

 

[GutFeeling!]

This footage is fantastic! I wasn't able to watch while at work today, thanks for bumping it up, it made it much easier to find!

Yeah that is the best footage I have seen, he is very clear too.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Press 'Command' and 'v' at the same time. That's the paste shortcut on the Mac

Thanks! You Rock! I am going to start practicing! :seeya:

 

[possumheart]

Was everyone in the CCTV footage Caucasian? Is this unusual for a random Brunswick population sample at 2am?

 

[mister2]

Was everyone in the CCTV footage Caucasian? Is this unusual for a random Brunswick population sample at 2am?

Nope ... very, very normal

 

[JK673]

One of the presenters on Sydney radio this morning talked about this and said, no matter what you think of her, her comedy etc, she is very intelligent and also similar in appearance to JM. Should take her seriously.

*****

 

[possumheart]

Thanks Mr2 and welcome

 

[sayitaintso]

I asked a question earlier, but it might have been lost in my long opening post.

Does anyone know if any/many of the the other shops along the street would be as lit up as the bridal store??

I imagine that while the bridal store benefits from having its window display visible, other stores would just be really dark. I think that the behaviour of JM slowing down, looking back, trying to stall, might be because its particularly light there compared to other parts of the street. Similarly we might be thinking that an abduction on Sydney Rd is really brazen because that part of the street is really bright, but further along it might be much darker and hence easier to conceal a quick snatch and grab... thoughts?

 

[they'll get you]

Snipped: I highly doubt it. This video (it has been posted earlier) actually walks to the place where the handbag was found. I wish this guy had looked for cameras along the way, he did a great job of showing us the area and the route she may take to go home.
http://thebrunxonline.com/2012/09/2...her-was-seen-on-cctv-to-her-home/#comment-166

That is an horrific area to walk so late at night. OMG !!
I noticed he walked past so many dumpster bins, lane ways but the camera didn't pan up or into these areas.

I feel she did not make it to her street. In the laneway where her bag was found was so secluded & dark with many little corners where something sinister could have happened. Jill's been in there & could be still in or around that area.

 

[fruity]

Hi fruity & welcome to WS You can post the link to the facebook page but please don't post any of the comments from there.

Thanks. I won't copy the comment on there, but I'll paraphrase the observation.

This is the Facebook page:
http://www.facebook.com/HelpUsFindJillMeagher

Earlier today a post was made on the wall saying that the silver car isn't the only car that appears twice. A blue car is driving past at 0.56 and also at 2.19 and people think it could be the same car. The first time it drives past, it coincides with the BH walking back towards Jill.

If it's the same car both times (and only if), it's driving in the same direction both times so it would have driven around the block.

 

[truthound]

Yes, the missing 5 seconds of of video.
It keeps playing on my mind as to what happened in those 5 seconds that they needed to cut it out.

Oddly I find it reassuring if LE are withholding things: makes me feel that they have more up their sleeves, so to speak.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[fruity]

You can post a link to the official Facebook page but you can't directly copy a post that appears on that page. You can say things like "Someone posted on Facebook that they saw a read car"

This is only my understanding (please correct me if I am wrong anyone) - I avoid Facebook for that reason LOL Plus there are always the attention seekers that like to make stuff up for attention - same as comments made under news stories.

Thanks for clarifying. Can someone let me know if my post isn't okay? Thanks .

 

[Rudra]

Jill's mum said that although Jill was slight, she had done tae kwon do and was a fighter, that makes it less likely to me that one person could get her into a car against her will.
There just had to be a car involved or surely her body would have been found by now.

This is a great logical point. Thank you! Two options, car or no car.

With the no car scenario you would expect that Jill's body would have been found during the search (sorry, it's a sickening thought) or she is being held in a house quite close by. Her body wasn't found in the neighbourhood search, and it seems unlikely she is being held in a place close by. The case is so high profile, I suspect any person who had any suspicion about what was going on in the house next door would have immediately contacted police.

However, once bundle into a car, she could have been taken anywhere.