GUILTY Australia - Jill Meagher, 29, Melbourne, 22 Sep 2012 #5

[Jmbr]

I've also been thinking today about him saying he apologised to her.. Do you think he raped her, then after it was over he apologised (apparently), because he said he felt bad and couldn't imagine how she was feeling, and maybe she punched him (the bruise on the nose), and he got angry and strangled her?

May not make sense because no one heard screaming, but I read somewhere someone said that they were assaulted once and just froze and couldn't scream... Perhaps Jill froze, but if there were three rapes, it was probably a prolonged attack..

Ah I hate this! I can't even imagine how her family feel if we all feel this bad. So happy we can all come on here and talk about it to get it off our chests..

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/...e-and-husband-tom/story-fndo1svg-122659675250

So sad... She wanted a family with him.

 

[Scoobysnack]

I just can't feel sorry for the girlfriend. I mean, it's good that she cooperated with police, but judging from the court transcripts she's not the sharpest tool in the shed, and who shacks up with a serial rapist anyway? Unless, of course, she didn't know about his past.

I don't know... maybe it's just that AB is so vile that I can't muster any sympathy right now for someone that chose to be with him.

I feel exactly the same, I can't but help feel that she is lucky.... My gosh without a doubt there must have been signs of him being violent .

 

[Sleuthilicious]

If you watch this footage, you will see Jill walking off to the left of screen, and then there is a splice-in of Bayley following her (he, hurriedly, turns off left also):
http://video.heraldsun.com.au/2342165393/Is-this-Jill-being-chased-by-her-accused-killer
That place into which they both turn off is called ‘Sparta Place’. This is a description of it: ‘Sparta Place is a quaint and quirky laneway, just off Sydney Road in Brunswick.’ You can read some more about it here:
http://www.weekendnotes.com.au/sparta-place-brunswick/
It is now my belief that walking down Sparta Place was Jill’s usual path home. She would walk down Sparta Place to Tripovich Street, take a right, walk up to Ballarat Street, take a left, walk all the way down to the Upfield Bike Path, cross it and walk right onto Nardella Way, then walk down Nardella to Ferrier Street, turn left into it, which leads right to Lux Way, her home.
All of this would explain the comments back at the time that ‘she shouldn’t have been up this far’- up as far as Hope Street- that path was not her usual routine. But I believe she was warned off her usual back-streets path as Bayley was there right behind her, hassling her, as we can see from the footage above- she turns into Sparta Place, only to have him tailgating her. So she must have changed plans away from Sparta Place, and decided to walk up the busy Sydney Road path- all the way to Hope Street, hoping to lose him along the way. That is where we see her, outside of Duchess Boutique in that infamous blue hoodie cctv footage, offering her final ploy to ward off Bayley: the good old talking on the mobile phone trick. Bayley must have walked off ahead of her during that call and went down Hope Street, hiding in some shadows and leapt out to grab her. This is terrible. That footage is particularly haunting; it reminds me of a Hitchcock film.

He followed and hassled her for about 170m- from Sparta Place to Duchess boutique; and no doubt she was trying to lose him that whole way. There is about another 80m from Duchess boutique to Hope Street- so 250m all up, according to my calculations on Google maps.

just as i wrote this, a new pope was elected. pity religion can't help in these cases.

I'm so pleased in one sense that Bayley came back and moved her, it would have been unimaginable for Tom to find her during his search that morning. Its bad enough for him to have the 'what ifs' and factual knowledge of what happened to her in his head without the grim reality. Bayley of course only moved her to save his own skin, but I'm glad he did.

I have some sympathy for the girlfriend. After watching the eons of cctv footage of Bayley after the crime, I imagine he remained quite calm after the murder. He was probably very convincing. Perhaps she wasn't fully aware of his past. Perhaps he has relationships with attainable women with a desperation to be loved? He forcibly takes from the unattainable ones..

 

[mister2]

I have a feeling he may say that maybe she consented to sex with him to begin with. He seems to be trying to tarnish her image a bit

Nope - he has pleaded guilty to the rape. This is now a murder trial.

 

[ozazure]

I'm so pleased in one sense that Bayley came back and moved her, it would have been unimaginable for Tom to find her during his search that morning. Its bad enough for him to have the 'what ifs' and factual knowledge of what happened to her in his head without the grim reality. Bayley of course only moved her to save his own skin, but I'm glad he did.

I have some sympathy for the girlfriend. After watching the eons of cctv footage of Bayley after the crime, I imagine he remained quite calm after the murder. He was probably very convincing. Perhaps she wasn't fully aware of his past. Perhaps he has relationships with attainable women with a desperation to be loved? He forcibly takes from the unattainable ones..

Plus by moving her, he tangled himself up in a technological net!! But leaving her - would have DNA done him in given his convictions?

 

[Jmbr]

Nope - he has pleaded guilty to the rape. This is now a murder trial.

He's pleaded guilty to one count of rape, they've charged him with three. What I mean is that I feel like he is going to make out that perhaps she led him on in some way and things got out of hand..

Obviously I don't think that happened, but just the way he's said how it all happened, he's almost putting the blame onto her.

 

[Sleuthilicious]

More crime scene pics.

I wonder what all these buckets are for??
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-order/gallery-fnat79vb-1226596531880?page=18

 

[Eireann]

Hi everyone..

I have a few questions regarding the evidence that has come out.

Firstly, the cigarette butt. Has this been revealed to be Jills, or someone elses? The photo isn't great, but I can't see lipstick on it.

The bin with an arrow. Does this look like blood to you? There was also a cloth shown in evidence with what looks like blood on it too.

What do you guys think this stain could be? It was found in the boot where Jill's body was placed.

And lastly, the red car. Apparently it could have been used in previous attacks. However, in this photo, it looks to be pretty bashed up. Any thoughts on this?

 

[Sleuthilicious]

He's pleaded guilty to one count of rape, they've charged him with three. What I mean is that I feel like he is going to make out that perhaps she led him on in some way and things got out of hand..

Obviously I don't think that happened, but just the way he's said how it all happened, he's almost putting the blame onto her.

I think, in his record of interview he said something along the lines of "we ended up in the alley" like he's trying to insinuate Jill somehow wandered in there with him. Not "I forced her into the alley". He talks about taking responsibility but even at interview he couldn't do it.

 

[Jmbr]

Hi everyone..

I have a few questions regarding the evidence that has come out.

Firstly, the cigarette butt. Has this been revealed to be Jills, or someone elses? The photo isn't great, but I can't see lipstick on it.

The bin with an arrow. Does this look like blood to you? There was also a cloth shown in evidence with what looks like blood on it too.

What do you guys think this stain could be? It was found in the boot where Jill's body was placed.

And lastly, the red car. Apparently it could have been used in previous attacks. However, in this photo, it looks to be pretty bashed up. Any thoughts on this?

First pic is of the pencil on the left. They found an ABC pencil in the lane way.

 

[Eireann]

First pic is of the pencil on the left. They found an ABC pencil in the lane way.

They also mentioned the cigarette on the right. Did they rule this out afterwards then?

 

[Jmbr]

I think, in his record of interview he said something along the lines of "we ended up in the alley" like he's trying to insinuate Jill somehow wandered in there with him. Not "I forced her into the alley". He talks about taking responsibility but even at interview he couldn't do it.

Yes! Like he says he will take responsibility, acts remorseful but still blames her.. He's trying to manipulate the situation by sounding like he didn't completely do an evil thing because she brought it upon herself.

He must be an idiot if he thinks anyone will believe she willingly went in there with him. If he was there when she rang her brother and nothing was going on at that point, then why didn't she answer a minute later when her brother rang back.? He must've heard her coming and took her in there straight after the call.

 

[Jmbr]

They also mentioned the cigarette on the right. Did they rule this out afterwards then?

Oh sorry I didn't hear about the cigarette. Only heard she borrowed one, didn't realize they found it..

 

[gallaggr]

He's pleaded guilty to one count of rape, they've charged him with three. What I mean is that I feel like he is going to make out that perhaps she led him on in some way and things got out of hand..

Obviously I don't think that happened, but just the way he's said how it all happened, he's almost putting the blame onto her.

It seems weird how these type of people justify things in their own head... But his defense team seem smart, I doubt they will try to say anything was consensual.. just that there was no intent to kill. However, apparently the test for mens rea is (1) How probable was the consequence which resulted from the defendant's voluntary act? (2) Did he foresee that consequence?.. I Would say putting any type of strong pressure on the accused's neck makes it foreseeable...plus if he was with her for so long and she was unconscious...wouldn't he KNOW it was likely she would die if he continued.. I know that they will argue her airways were blocked so they are saying probably that she died after bayley left however I think he had to know that she was dead when he left because he came back with the shovel and she probably wasn't stationary long enough for this to happen any other way. I honestly believe he wanted to kill her...his actions are so calm after it all happened.. this man has no remorse, he was just acting sad during the testimony to make the police think he was sorry for what happened. God I hope the prosecution DESTROYS him and that lawyer in Court for putting that lovely family through more pain...
this shows Bayley's state of mind, I agree that the girlfriend would have likely seen his darker side...I wonder if she knew about his past? like she seemed genuinely disgusted from reports when she realised what he had done...http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...e-say-colleagues/story-fndo1wyv-1226596930013
the prosecutions case seems so strong, hate to think they would fail on the intention to kill issue...

 

[Eireann]

Oh sorry I didn't hear about the cigarette. Only heard she borrowed one, didn't realize they found it..

'The photos show police evidence plates dotted about the scene to nominate possible items of interest, including a cigarette butt and an ABC pencil.'

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/jill-meaghers-accused-killer-adrian-ernest-bayley-watched-movies-after-attack-court-documents-show/story-e6frfkp9-1226595956235

 

[Jmbr]

http://m.couriermail.com.au/news/qu...onal-conventions/story-e6freoof-1226596745308

 

[Jewel]

I remember reading about a cigarette butt being found as evidence. The lack of lipstick doesn't surprise me. Was she still wearing lipstick fresh enough to come off on the butt? If I was out drinking with friends at that hour I would not be putting fresh makeup on before heading for home. I find mine rubs off on glasses I am drinking from and there would not be enough left to leave a mark on a cigarette butt, unless it was freshly applied.

I noticed what looked like blood on the cloth... How horrible. No wonder he gave the car such a good cleaning inside and out.

Did I read that the phone was found on his bed? And some of her clothes were there? How did the girlfriend not have some idea of what happened when the evidence was right under her nose?

 

[Eireann]

Did I read that the phone was found on his bed? And some of her clothes were there? How did the girlfriend not have some idea of what happened when the evidence was right under her nose?

Yup. AB had apparently smashed it outside on the driveway. If Jill was found in her bra and tights as was mentioned, then surely everything else she was wearing could have possibly been at the house. I did read somewhere that he tossed her shoes out along the drive. Perhaps he also threw out larger items of clothing.

 

[Eireann]

Did I read that the phone was found on his bed? And some of her clothes were there? How did the girlfriend not have some idea of what happened when the evidence was right under her nose?

 

[Jmbr]

He really isn't smart is he?!

Thanks for the pics. I'm a bit behind as I'm in the UK so I have a whole days news to catch up on when I wake up..