Australia - JS, 32 y.o. man, charged w/ murder of 9 y.o. girl , Mt Wilson, 13 January 2022 #2

[Inplainsight]

Wildenstein was where JS did his drug deals 5 years prior. This quote from the DM.

"[The neighbour] also said [JS] lived 'in a shack' on the grounds of Wildenstein and had been there with a different girlfriend when he had got into trouble more than five years ago with 'drug dealing on the property'. "

Looking again at the timelines.

JS's story was that CM was last seen on the verandah of Wildenstein on Thursday afternoon. Yet, JS is at Bunnings at 5.30pm purchasing sand bags - having a conversation with KM.

Where was CM supposed to be? Alone at Wildenstein or in the care of a third party? Clearly CM could not be going on a boat trip - when JS last "saw her" that afternoon.

It easy to review a story from hindsight and all the pieces that don't fit together logically. The police must have been suspicious from the get go.

 

[Kemug]

KM may not have been actually unwell of course, but suffering from morning sickness. That might well have made her unable to look after her daughter.

 

[Pusheena]

Small calibre firearms hold bullets not cartridges, and in the pic, that's a cartridge that comes from a shotgun, one barrel or two. Shotguns are the preferred firearm for rural properties, they spray pellets, deadly at close range because the target takes the whole pellet, but more effective at long range, the pellets spread and more chance hitting its target, and easier for a human to survive.

While a small calibre firearm either hits its target or it misses, there isn't a spray effect. Obviously, deadly at close range, at long range, there will hardly be any blood spatter. jmo

I found this document (attached pdf) absolutely fascinating.

It's the full judgment overturning the NSW police Force decision to revoke the gun licence of the bird shooting neighbour, JH.

It's very long and very detailed.
There's a lot about the type of guns, gunshots, the sound of them, how far away they can be heard, the proximity of other neighbours -- several of whom gave accounts.

Definitely provides more context to the question of whether a gunshot would or should have been heard if CM was indeed killed there.

There's also some stuff about the shack and interesting details about the layout of the property.

Having read it several times now, I still can't work out if JH, who vehemently denies killing wildlife, was telling the truth or whether there was a second person taking pot-shots, knowing everyone would assume it was the neighbour

All MOO

Edit: here's the link if the PDF doesn't work Haitzler v Commissioner of Police, NSW Police Force - NSW Caselaw

 

[Aussieboy]

I found this document (attached pdf) absolutely fascinating.

It's the full judgment overturning the NSW police Force decision to revoke the gun licence of the bird shooting neighbour, JH.

It's very long and very detailed.
There's a lot about the type of guns, gunshots, the sound of them, how far away they can be heard, the proximity of other neighbours -- several of whom gave accounts.

Definitely provides more context to the question of whether a gunshot would or should have been heard if CM was indeed killed there.

There's also some stuff about the shack and interesting details about the layout of the property.

Having read it several times now, I still can't work out if JH, who vehemently denies killing wildlife, was telling the truth or whether there was a second person taking pot-shots, knowing everyone would assume it was the neighbour

All MOO

Edit: here's the link if the PDF doesn't work Haitzler v Commissioner of Police, NSW Police Force - NSW Caselaw

<modsnip: removed personalizing comment> ... pretty much impossible to kill a human with a .22 air riffle( a Mossberg 12 gauge pump action shotgun and 3 X .22 calibre air rifles with scope), maybe blind them if you were a good enough shot to hit someone's eye.

 

[Puzzles]

<modsnip: Quoted post was modsnipped>

... I don't see where Pusheena claims anyone was killed with "a .22 air riffle" (sic) which you state "is pretty much impossible."

... it appears you are incorrect regarding deaths from .22 air rifles:

BBM

"AIMS: To describe characteristics of a series of people accidentally and deliberately killed by air powered weapons. METHODS: Five cases of fatal airgun injury were identified by forensic pathologists and histopathologists. The circumstances surrounding the case, radiological examination, and pathological findings are described. The weapon characteristics are also reported. RESULTS: Three of the victims were adult men, one was a 16 year old boy, and one an eight year old child. Four of the airguns were .22 air rifles, the other a .177 air rifle. Two committed suicide, one person shooting himself in the head, the other in the chest. In both cases the guns were fired at contact range. Three of the cases were classified as accidents: in two the pellet penetrated into the head and in one the chest. CONCLUSIONS: One person each year dies from an air powered weapon injury in the United Kingdom. In addition there is considerable morbidity from airgun injuries. Fatalities and injuries are most commonly accidents, but deliberately inflicted injuries occur. Airguns are dangerous weapons when inappropriately handled and should not be considered as toys. Children should not play with airguns unsupervised..."
Air weapon fatalities.

 

[Aussieboy]

<modsnip: Quoted post was modsnipped>

... I don't see where Pusheena claims anyone was killed with "a .22 air riffle" (sic) which you state "is pretty much impossible."

... it appears you are incorrect regarding deaths from .22 air rifles:

BBM

"AIMS: To describe characteristics of a series of people accidentally and deliberately killed by air powered weapons. METHODS: Five cases of fatal airgun injury were identified by forensic pathologists and histopathologists. The circumstances surrounding the case, radiological examination, and pathological findings are described. The weapon characteristics are also reported. RESULTS: Three of the victims were adult men, one was a 16 year old boy, and one an eight year old child. Four of the airguns were .22 air rifles, the other a .177 air rifle. Two committed suicide, one person shooting himself in the head, the other in the chest. In both cases the guns were fired at contact range. Three of the cases were classified as accidents: in two the pellet penetrated into the head and in one the chest. CONCLUSIONS: One person each year dies from an air powered weapon injury in the United Kingdom. In addition there is considerable morbidity from airgun injuries. Fatalities and injuries are most commonly accidents, but deliberately inflicted injuries occur. Airguns are dangerous weapons when inappropriately handled and should not be considered as toys. Children should not play with airguns unsupervised..."
Air weapon fatalities.

The alleged murder weapon was a .22 rifle right, air activated rifle is a bit different to a gun powered by black gunpowder, the later is what the LE is looking for.
Find that article a bit hard to believe, I've been shot many times with an air riffle as a kid, admittedly not in the face region or head, sure it hurts and leaves quite a large bruise. You'd need to be very unlucky for the pellet to penetrate your skin and enter into vital organs, from my own experience. It wouldn't be a gun that you would deliberate use to kill someone.

 

[Pusheena]

<modsnip: removed personalizing comment> ... pretty much impossible to kill a human with a .22 air riffle( a Mossberg 12 gauge pump action shotgun and 3 X .22 calibre air rifles with scope), maybe blind them if you were a good enough shot to hit someone's eye.

<modsnip: Quoted post was modsnipped>

... I don't see where Pusheena claims anyone was killed with "a .22 air riffle" (sic) which you state "is pretty much impossible."

... it appears you are incorrect regarding deaths from .22 air rifles:
... I don't see where Pusheena claims anyone was killed with "a .22 air riffle" (sic) which you state "is pretty much impossible."

Thanks very much @Puzzles and you are quite right.

I wasn't making any link, nor do I believe there is any link, between the bizarre backyard antics of Mt Wilson residents described in the decade -old court judgment and the death of CM.

I posted it because a) it makes fascinating background reading b) large chunks of it describe what happens when somebody fires a gun in in the vicinity of Wildenstein.
Or rather, it describes the many different ways neighbours were effected by/responded to the sound of gunshots.

That they were rattled/irritated/spooked/furious/ suspicious/worn down/intimidated by JHs alleged bird shooting sprees isn't really the point.

The point is this stoush has been going on for at least 15 years, meaning the ears of residents in that tiny community would be more attuned than most to the sound of a gunshot.

Yet nobody (that we know of) has come forward to say they heard one.

We know CM died from 'a fatal gunshot' but police have not revealed whether they believe one or multiple bullets were fired, whether CM was hit by more than one bullet (only one being fatal) or if this was an execution style murder.

If CM was shot dead at Mt Wilson as police allege, why has nobody come forward to say they heard (a) gunshot/s?

One of the neighbours (JHs wife) noticed the "mystery car" leaving or arriving at Wildenstein at around 4.30am.
It didn't have its lights on, yet they still noticed it, must have heard the vehicle before they saw it.

Yet nobody heard a gunshot?

Somehow I can't see JS being together enough/professional enough to use a silencer or whatever the hell people use to muffle the sound.

Not after the ghastly, haphazard and ultimately botched mission to dispose poor CMs body.

ALL MOO and speculation

 

[Aussieboy]

Thanks very much @Puzzles and you are quite right.

I wasn't making any link, nor do I believe there is any link, between the bizarre backyard antics of Mt Wilson residents described in the decade -old court judgment and the death of CM.

I posted it because a) it makes fascinating background reading b) large chunks of it describe what happens when somebody fires a gun in in the vicinity of Wildenstein.
Or rather, it describes the many different ways neighbours were effected by/responded to the sound of gunshots.

That they were rattled/irritated/spooked/furious/ suspicious/worn down/intimidated by JHs alleged bird shooting sprees isn't really the point.

The point is this stoush has been going on for at least 15 years, meaning the ears of residents in that tiny community would be more attuned than most to the sound of a gunshot.

Yet nobody (that we know of) has come forward to say they heard one.

We know CM died from 'a fatal gunshot' but police have not revealed whether they believe one or multiple bullets were fired, whether CM was hit by more than one bullet (only one being fatal) or if this was an execution style murder.

If CM was shot dead at Mt Wilson as police allege, why has nobody come forward to say they heard (a) gunshot/s?

One of the neighbours (JHs wife) noticed the "mystery car" leaving or arriving at Wildenstein at around 4.30am.
It didn't have its lights on, yet they still noticed it, must have heard the vehicle before they saw it.

Yet nobody heard a gunshot?

Somehow I can't see JS being together enough/professional enough to use a silencer or whatever the hell people use to muffle the sound.

Not after the ghastly, haphazard and ultimately botched mission to dispose poor CMs body.

ALL MOO and speculation

It's totally irrelevant as it was obviously a shotgun noise at neighbour's property that was heard, air riffles AKA in Australia as 'slug guns' for firing a lead slug and barely make a noise, the alleged weapon is a .22 cal riffle, which yes they make a bit of noise, but nothing like the decibel level of a shotgun, and it's easily muffled in many ways. We don't know if there was machinery running on the day of the incident, as it was in a rural setting for e.g. someone could have been using a chain saw or operating an industrial tractor.

 

[SouthAussie]

It's totally irrelevant as it was obviously a shotgun noise at neighbour's property that was heard, air riffles AKA in Australia as 'slug guns' for firing a lead slug and barely make a noise, the alleged weapon is a .22 cal riffle, which yes they make a bit of noise, but nothing like the decibel level of a shotgun, and it's easily muffled in many ways. We don't know if there was machinery running on the day of the incident, as it was in a rural setting for e.g. someone could have been using a chain saw or operating an industrial tractor.

Is a .22 calibre firearm the only kind of 'small calibre' firearm there is?
I don't know a heck of a lot about this calibre subject.

Only I have never seen the actual calibre mentioned ... only that DS Doherty said it was a small calibre firearm.
He didn't say if it was a handgun or a rifle.

 

[Aussieboy]

Is a .22 calibre firearm the only kind of 'small calibre' firearm there is?
I don't know a heck of a lot about this calibre subject.

Only I have never seen the actual calibre mentioned ... only that DS Doherty said it was a small calibre firearm.
He didn't say if it was a handgun or a rifle.

I'm not really into guns, but spent my childhood growing up on farms, which included the occasional use of long firearms, most farmers had 12 gauge shotguns, 22s and air riffles. They were the common agriculture guns for shooting pest and feral animals in the 70s to late 90's, a few of the other farmers I knew had .308 cals to shoot wild boars, but they were more a speciality thing back then for like sports hunting. I can't even recall anyone owning a smaller calibre gun than .22, they may have been around, but not common AFAIK. The 22 was like the universal size, it was economical and easy to source parts and ammunition for.
I don't know a lot about handguns, but I believe they also come in a .22 cal as well, so yeah, it really could be either.

 

[Warshawski]

It's totally irrelevant as it was obviously a shotgun noise at neighbour's property that was heard, air riffles AKA in Australia as 'slug guns' for firing a lead slug and barely make a noise, the alleged weapon is a .22 cal riffle, which yes they make a bit of noise, but nothing like the decibel level of a shotgun, and it's easily muffled in many ways. We don't know if there was machinery running on the day of the incident, as it was in a rural setting for e.g. someone could have been using a chain saw or operating an industrial tractor.

hey Aussieboy, I’m not aware that we’ve been made privy to the information as bolder by me in your post above.
All I’m aware of is the shot was from a small Calibre firearm - and there’s more than a .22 rifle that falls into that category.

 

[SouthAussie]

I'm not really into guns, but spent my childhood growing up on farms, which included the occasional use of long firearms, most farmers had 12 gauge shotguns, 22s and air riffles. They were the common agriculture guns for shooting pest and feral animals in the 70s to late 90's, a few of the other farmers I knew had .308 cals to shoot wild boars, but they were more a speciality thing back then for like sports hunting. I can't even recall anyone owning a smaller calibre gun than .22, they may have been around, but not common AFAIK. The 22 was like the universal size, it was economical and easy to source parts and ammunition for.
I don't know a lot about handguns, but I believe they also come in a .22 cal as well, so yeah, it really could be either.

Looks like, if it is a handgun, a 9mm is (was in 2018) the most common in NSW.

The Top 10 calibres across Australia - Sporting Shooters' Association of Australia (SSAA)

 

[Webbie2021]

I'm leaning towards something in the front seat, not sure what and definitely not CM. The driver is de-identified but the passenger- it almost looks like the outline of a person.

This was discussed a lot at the time, but I don't think there's another person in the vehicle, mainly because (a) the police have not suggested there was a second person in the vehicle, and have stressed that they believe JS acted alone, and (b) if there was a second person in the vehicle they too would have been blurred.

 

[SouthAussie]

This was discussed a lot at the time, but I don't think there's another person in the vehicle, mainly because (a) the police have not suggested there was a second person in the vehicle, and have stressed that they believe JS acted alone, and (b) if there was a second person in the vehicle they too would have been blurred.

BBM

I am not sure that I necessarily agree with that. It would depend on the police motivation, I think.
Sometimes the police do things to make people twitchy. Try to get them to react, or act, with culpability. Perhaps even get them to come forward and say "I was with JS when he was driving that boat all over the place". It doesn't have to mean that any other person was involved in the alleged murder of CM.

Not saying this is what happened, but it is not out of the realm of possibility. imo
Especially as the police want any other dashcam/CCTV/witness sightings during that Thursday night (but not on Wednesday ... why not Wednesday, or earlier on Thursday?)

JS may have handed the firearm to someone else to hide/keep for him. Or he may have hidden it at someone he knows place. He doesn't seem to be the sharpest tool in the shed.

 

[Webbie2021]

I could be wrong, but legally I don't think they could release unobscured video footage of an unidentified passenger unless they were a suspect. And they've been fairly clear about the fact that they believe JS acted alone not just in the murder but in the disposal of the body. From the presser:

"The information and the evidence that we’ve go so far hasn’t suggested anyone else. Actually the evidence all suggests that [JS] is the only person responsible for the murder, placing [CM] in the barrel and disposing of the barrel on the banks of the Colo River."

 

[SouthAussie]

I could be wrong, but legally I don't think they could release unobscured video footage of an unidentified passenger unless they were a suspect. And they've been fairly clear about the fact that they believe JS acted alone not just in the murder but in the disposal of the body. From the presser:

"The information and the evidence that we’ve go so far hasn’t suggested anyone else. Actually the evidence all suggests that [JS] is the only person responsible for the murder, placing [CM] in the barrel and disposing of the barrel on the banks of the Colo River."

If there is a person in the passenger seat (and one pic looks like there might be, imo), they are not clearly visible. Not in the footage that they released, anyway.
I don't think they have to obscure any other person, if they are an adult. Perhaps pixelate them ... but even that isn't necessary in the footage that we saw.

They definitely haven't said that JS was alone all of the time. Just that he is allegedly solely responsible.

I personally think - in saying that - they are trying to take any heat off KM because they (likely) know she has no involvement in the alleged murder or cover up.

He had boat trouble, he might have asked someone to help him with the boat.
Someone who hasn't come forward yet ... or maybe they have by now (if there is such a person).

 

[Liadan]

If there is a person in the passenger seat (and one pic looks like there might be, imo), they are not clearly visible. Not in the footage that they released, anyway.
I don't think they have to obscure any other person, if they are an adult. Perhaps pixelate them ... but even that isn't necessary in the footage that we saw.

They definitely haven't said that JS was alone all of the time. Just that he is allegedly solely responsible.

I personally think - in saying that - they are trying to take any heat off KM because they (likely) know she has no involvement in the alleged murder or cover up.

He had boat trouble, he might have asked someone to help him with the boat.
Someone who hasn't come forward yet ... or maybe they have by now (if there is such a person).

Maybe the person was completely oblivious to the fact that there was a body in a barrel - and thought they were going along for a ride with JS???? And maybe a boat trip?

 

[madeofstars]

If there was another person in the car that wasn’t intentionally involved I think they’d be cooperating with LE, so there would be no need for all of the appeals for further info as to sightings of the Ute that evening. LE have said nobody else is involved, not just nobody else is responsible.

 

[Allabouttrial]

Duplicate

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Seen my share of broken halos
Folded wings that used to fly
They've all gone wherever they go
Broken halos that used to shine
Angels come down from the heavens
Just to help us on our way
Come to teach us, then they leave us
And they find some other soul to save
Seen my share of broken halos
Folded wings that used to fly
They've all gone wherever they go
Broken halos that used to shine
Broken halos that used to shine
Don't go looking for the reasons
Don't go asking Jesus why
We're not meant to know the answers
They belong to the by and by
They belong to the by and by
Seen my share of broken halos
Folded wings that used to fly
They've all gone wherever they go
Broken halos that used to shine
Broken halos that used to shine
Broken halos that used to shine
Broken halos that used to shine
Source: LyricFind