Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, June 1997 #14

[mishy66]

Oops forgot to attach it

https://media.acny.uk/media/venues/page/attachment/2022/05/BVM_i39_April2022_36PPdigital.pdf

April 2022 How many people are going to remember.....
The whole case in regards to the Authorities has been a huge letdown.

 

[mishy66]

I think he owns a portion of the property - 46B. From what I found there has been a 'body corporate' operating since 1958

ACP IMMEUBLE RESIDENCE PAGANINI A ETTERBEEK R VME - 0825.062.994 - Bruxelles (1040)

Consultez les données de ASSOC. COPROPRIET. IMMEUBLE RESIDENCE PAGANINI A ETTERBEEK RUE (0825.062.994) à Bruxelles (1040) ou d'autres sociétés du secteur Facility management.

trendstop-levif-be.translate.goog

Association des coproprietaires de l'immeuble "Residence Paganini" a Etterbeek, rue des Francs - 0825.062.994 - Belgium

Association des copropriétaires de l'immeuble "Résidence Paganini" à Etterbeek, rue des Francs Belgian company, Company number: 0825.062.994, Incorporation Date Aug 6, 1958;, Address: Frankenstraat S/N, 1040 Etterbeek

b2bhint-com.translate.goog

I think he owns the lot

 

[sah10406]

It’s interesting that he mentions how small the town is and how no one remembers them. I wonder if they were in hiding?

Do we have any records of the kids attending school? Maybe they didn’t interact with anyone in the area?

I was just discussing the Burwash magazine piece with a friend who is very interested in the case but not a websleuth, and she had an interesting take:

"That is very, very interesting. And surely there must be people who remember them. Contacting the local schools, particularly the people doing the schools pick ups involved. I imagine a lot of people the same age as [AKA son] and [AKA daughter], who have remained in Burwash, are now sending their own kids to the schools they attended - and (to generalise) nowadays grandmothers often do the school picks ups, so likely to have known [DdH] back in the day. In my experience, word gets around very quickly at the school gates.

I still remember a little boy called [name] from when I was 6 or 7 because he and his family emigrated to Australia. It lodged in my memory because it was such an unusual and exciting thing to do. So the kids will stick in people's minds because of their "exotic" connections to Australia, Belgium, Luxembourg etc. "

 

[mishy66]

1992 is a pivotal point for Blum IMO

1992 - relocating to Midway Point Tasmania - DdeH says an Uncle died so needed to go to Tasmania - since when did they suddenly have a moral compass?
I say Blum was hiding from something.... JMO

1992 changes his name to R L Westbury

Swimming record held since Jan-92 at the Top of the World swim club near Hobart ( Zomay Avenue Dynnyrne) by son DdeH.

Tolman’s reservoir, with various modifications, additions, and rebuilding after the 1967 bushfires, was the headquarters for the Top of the World Swimming Club from 1926 until 1992.

Lifestyle changes and hard economic times forced TOW to sell the property in 1992. 1993 pool dismantled..... the land it was on was subdivided and sold in the early 1990s.

Swimming lessons moved to the Hobart Olympic Pool until that was demolished in 1995

Our coldest state turned some unique natural features into its most popular pools

Tasmania's cool conditions have never stopped its people enjoying swimming and diving — whether it be in rivers, springs, basins or even an old farm block.

www.abc.net.au

Facebook

www.facebook.com

Dynnyrne Road to Midway Point

www.google.com

It was an ideal place for Blum no doubt, within walking distance from the training pool to the Sandy Bay Casino to do a bit of 'relaxing and laundering' perhaps. JMO

Interestinly both DdeH states at inquest they lived there until 1996 and also MC says on latest podcast that Blum was there for a long time YET podcast says, they were there for a very short time. Inconsistencies in the podcasts dont help!


1992 -
* police found they had a Nissan Blue Bird between 3 July 1992 - 1998
* Blum still writing to MC
* Fernand Nocolas Remakel (QLD license renewed) - held onto that FNR licence for five years before deciding to use it in the ad in the Le Courier Australian.
*Richard Lord Westbury -travelling on a false passport multiple times, possibly 10 trips from 1992) - a name he contiues to use for the next five years when travelling OS with JAL
*Changes name officially to FdH



And the 'coincidental links' I posted a while back:
Could it be "Westbury" as a shareholder would have had the advantage of discounted fares and still 'accessing' these cheap flights throughout the 90's with affiliated airlines or friends in the industry, up until the conviction in 1997 of company chairman DOUGLAS EDWARD REID , by way of fraudulent documentation....
All these planes, pilots, discounts and affiliations makes you wonder!


R Westbury and L Westbury who had shares in Southern Cross Airlines holdings.
C/- Australian Overseas Travel 64 Scott Street LIVERPOOL NSW 2170

Southern Cross Airlines - Southern Cross Airlines Holdings commenced operations on 31 August 1992 under the name of Compass Airlines. The airline serviced the major eastern ports from Cairns to Adelaide2 using a fleet of five McDonnell Douglas MD80 Series aircraft. It had plans to increase this to seven in early 1993 …..... Southern Cross Airlines Holdings Ltd was placed into voluntary receivership on Thursday 4 March, 1993 after only six months of operations…... There are possible legal issues arising from the company’s failure. Douglas Reid, founder and deputy chairman, has been charged with knowingly supplying false information to the other directors. Receiver/manager Mr Barber is reported as saying that $10 million of the company’s assets, purportedly being for security deposits for aircraft leases, ‘appear to be a sham’….

The Mayne Report - ASIC jail list since 1991

Australia - Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, June 1997 #14

This isn't necessarily specific to the 1990s but she arrived on a Saturday

www.websleuths.com

Find unclaimed money - Moneysmart.gov.au

Search for money that you may have lost in an old bank account, shares or life insurance policy.

moneysmart.gov.au

See more detail	Westbury, L (Owner: WESTBURY L WESTBURY R)	$60.03	C/- Australian Overseas Travel 64 Scott Street LIVERPOOL NSW 2170	SOUTHERN CROSS AIRLINES HOLDINGS
OTN:​ 479159 Money from:​ SOUTHERN CROSS AIRLINES HOLDINGS Type of money:​ Company Section:​ 544 (Liquidator dividend) Joint shareholders:​ Westbury L Westbury R Date interest paid from:​ 01/07/2013

 

[sah10406]

Some useful annotated maps which were posted to the Missing Person Marion Barter FB Page today. They are created by Joni, who runs the page with SL and who is often mentioned in the podcast.

The first map is a comparison of MB and JO's journeys in 1997 and 1999 respectively. It does not include references to anyone else.

 

[mishy66]

Some useful annotated maps which were posted to the Missing Person Marion Barter FB Page today. They are created by Joni, who runs the page with SL and who is often mentioned in the podcast.

The first map is a comparison of MB and JO's journeys in 1997 and 1999 respectively. It does not include references to anyone else.

View attachment 349330

View attachment 349331

View attachment 349332

It's great to see the visuals isnt it!

 

[Tiff23fr]

Mod Note:
Several posts have been removed from thread for the following reasons:
-no link provided in thread to an approved Podcast where info being discussed is coming from
-sleuthing family members or individuals not named a suspect in the case

As a reminder, all statements being made as facts in the case require a link to the source.

Thanks Much,
Tiff

 

[mishy66]

Interesting to read on TLV page that the postcard sent to Marions sister marked August 7 with the Tunbridge Wells postmark on it, did NOT have an airmail stamp attached.
Still no mention of the August 30 postcard that was sent....

 

[Estelle]

Interesting to read on TLV page that the postcard sent to Marions sister marked August 7 with the Tunbridge Wells postmark on it, did NOT have an airmail stamp attached.
Still no mention of the August 30 postcard that was sent....

IMO that is significant to me as it suggests that MB wrote it and someone else found it and put it in the mail.

 

[sah10406]

Interesting to read on TLV page that the postcard sent to Marions sister marked August 7 with the Tunbridge Wells postmark on it, did NOT have an airmail stamp attached.
Still no mention of the August 30 postcard that was sent....

I wonder if we might be over-thinking this. The UK doesn't have specific Air Mail stamps, only separate little blue Air Mail stickers that you can optionally attach to a piece of mail going overseas. They are not required and in my experience not using one doesn't affect when the piece of mail is postmarked or delivered.

 

[KathPlumber]

It would depend if it was different from how she sent other mail. I was constantly writing postcards back to australia from the UK in that era and putting on the Air Mail sticker, that came with the stamp, was absolutely drilled into me. If one wasn’t around, or it didn’t fit, you’d write it on in big letters and draw a box around it. Whether or not it was true, I was very much taught that it made it easier and faster for it to be sorted (source: my parents for a time worked for Royal Mail as sorters) and b) Sea Mail was (is?) still a thing so it was always like, don’t forget or it will go on a boat and be slow etc etc . But on the other hand if it wasn’t a habit and she didn’t usually do it then I guess it’s less unusual.

Strikes me as very primary teachery to always use the proper sticker or stamp though.

I guess it’s also possible that she (or someone else) didn’t put it on, in order for it to be sent more slowly on purpose.

 

[Lord Peter Flimsy]

Aka’s love letter in the latest podcast. I really struggled with the accent. Has anyone done a transcript of it?

 

[Lord Peter Flimsy]

This is still bothering me. Is Mr Aka actually Hungarian by birth but has taken on the identity of one of the Belgium Coppenolle family?

MC states in the latest podcast that Aka is Jewish and his Hungarian Jewish family were murdered in the holocaust.

According to the Concentration Camp registration card (1944) Robert C (his father?) was only 145cm (4ft 9in) tall and Roman Catholic by religion. He had a disabled leg so unless that affected his height why is Aka 6ft 2in?

 

[Lord Peter Flimsy]

If Aka was in a Jewish orphanage in Ixelles in the 1940s would a record of him be held here?

Or has this already been investigated?

 

[ruby925]

If Aka was in a Jewish orphanage in Ixelles in the 1940s would a record of him be held here?

Or has this already been investigated?

It was definitely discussed on here, because there was a Frau Blum (I think she was at Etterbeek) who was a prominent figure and her name may have then been used... Such a difficult time to be Jewish, many people must have denied their faith just to try and survive.

 

[Eyespywithmylittleeye]

Aka’s love letter in the latest podcast. I really struggled with the accent. Has anyone done a transcript of it?

I think we have all struggled trying to understand that and most of what the person reading Rb’s responses. Really hope TLV consider losing the ‘French authenticity’ and just have a male read. So we can all hear clearly what is being said.

 

[mishy66]

I wonder if we might be over-thinking this. The UK doesn't have specific Air Mail stamps, only separate little blue Air Mail stickers that you can optionally attach to a piece of mail going overseas. They are not required and in my experience not using one doesn't affect when the piece of mail is postmarked or delivered.

I think it is a valid point TLV FB page put up.

EVERY other postcard she sent home to Aust had Airmail stamps attached.
Cant dismiss it.

Airmail stamp means the post will be sent via plane as appose to be shipped over. You use to pay a little extra

 

[mishy66]

Aka’s love letter in the latest podcast. I really struggled with the accent. Has anyone done a transcript of it?

Agree!
It is such an awful way to approach a podcast using an accent worse than his own!

Just read it all without accents most are saying! Makes it so difficult to work out!

Apparently the transcript will be out next week.

 

[mishy66]

This is still bothering me. Is Mr Aka actually Hungarian by birth but has taken on the identity of one of the Belgium Coppenolle family?

MC states in the latest podcast that Aka is Jewish and his Hungarian Jewish family were murdered in the holocaust.

According to the Concentration Camp registration card (1944) Robert C (his father?) was only 145cm (4ft 9in) tall and Roman Catholic by religion. He had a disabled leg so unless that affected his height why is Aka 6ft 2in?

I think that height in his capture report is an error. I wouldn't be concerned about the height that was written down. His wife and other family members are very tall.


I also wouldn't believe all he tells MC. He probably told her more truths because he was besotted by her but he also loves to play on sympathy so having said all his family were gassed in the camps would align with his narcissistic personality.

Robert C fiancee WAS gassed in the camp just before liberation so there is some truth in his BS, IF she was his mother.
Personally I dont think she was.

 

[mishy66]

If Aka was in a Jewish orphanage in Ixelles in the 1940s would a record of him be held here?

Or has this already been investigated?

Already been looked into.
There is nothing on him, but how would we really know as we dont have concrete proof of who he is - birth cert.

A couple of sleuths have narrowed down the places he may have been put into if you do a search.....



Wezembeek orphanage - given it was run by a ‘Madame Blum’- coincidently Marie Blum-Alberts father was Chaim
This particular orphanage at Wezembeek was for Jewish children who had been orphaned because their parents had been deported to the death camps.
Personally I think THIS was the orphange he went it. IMO
Then he went to live with Maria and Andre and so began his life of crime. IMO

Then there was:

Ronse orphanage - For needy orphan boys at the expense of the Public Benevolence of Ronse -The boys attend school up to the age of 13 to 14 years

Or
Historique | Internat Saint-Luc Tournai

https://www.pslt.be/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Pensionnat-de-Passy-Froyennes-00091.jpg





But the Q remains IF you believe him, WHY would he be put in the orphange and not his other 2 brothers , one of whom was born AFTER he reckons he went in. IF you believe what he says, Maria had her legs blown off so HOW could she care for two new babies if she decided to put him in an orphange 3 year prior. All BS.
IMO