Deceased/Not Found AUSTRALIA - Ms Lesley Trotter, 78, Homicide, Brisbane, 28 Mar 2023

[TootsieFootsie]

Thank you, one more question ... how do the bins get to the kerb? Does everyone wheel out their own bins? Who carts out the recycling? I'm wondering because it seems to me that on pick up day, there will be folks scurrying out to manage their last minute garbage before the truck comes to pick it up. It makes me think there could be witnesses to the crime.

Most people here put their bins out the night before, or even the afternoon before.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Once, when I put my green waste bin out during the afternoon before it didn't get emptied because someone snuck their cut grass on top and then the lid wouldn't close, so the bin people wouldn't take it.

I started putting my bin out a bit later and it never happened again

 

[musicaljoke]

Most people here put their bins out the night before, or even the afternoon before.

So am I right to think that someone's bin was not taken to the curb the night before, and that the person was up early to do so when he or she murdered Ms Trotter in the bin storage area? It seems like this should point to a specific person rather quickly. At least the pool of suspects might be small.

Don't you think that folks are creatures of habit and will put their bins out at about the same time each week, whether the afternoon or night before, or the morning of pickup?

 

[T-dawg420]

Thank you, one more question ... how do the bins get to the kerb? Does everyone wheel out their own bins? Who carts out the recycling? I'm wondering because it seems to me that on pick up day, there will be folks scurrying out to manage their last minute garbage before the truck comes to pick it up. It makes me think there could be witnesses to the crime.

As its stated by a couple of people the general trend is for each apartment/house to take their own bins out. And most do it the night before. I have lived in two apartment blocks in neighbouring suburbs to Toowong called Taringa and Indooroopilly where there was a kinda caretaker who‘s responsibility was to take all the bins out and bring them back in after being emptied.

 

[musicaljoke]

Once, when I put my green waste bin out during the afternoon before it didn't get emptied because someone snuck their cut grass on top and then the lid wouldn't close, so the bin people wouldn't take it.

I started putting my bin out a bit llater and it never happened again

Ugh! Well, that's pretty inconvenient until the next pickup. Did you happen to have murderous thoughts? j/k

eta, I don't mean to make light of this tragedy. I'm just trying to understand what would lead to such extreme anger that a person would murder a senior woman out early in the morning.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Ugh! Well, that's pretty inconvenient until the next pickup. Did you happen to have murderous thought?

I was a bit annoyed at the time because I was in the middle of doing a lot of gardening and needed the bin emptied.
It was awhile ago now but I do remember checking every so often that nothing had been added to the bin.

And I was ready to go out and transfer any extra anyone left into big garden bags.
I was determined to get my bin empty.

Another time someone added general waste to my recycle bin I spent ages out there under the street light sorting it out

 

[SLouTh]

There was also this too in a very early article ….on April 7….


He said two separate crime scenes had been established in and outside Ms Trotter’s unit complex on Maryvale St in Toowong.

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And this news bulletin states …

“Crime scene set up outside the unit of LT“

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14 seconds

 

[SouthAussie]

Exactly when and why did the police change their focus from "Lesley went on a hike" to "Lesley was placed in a bin"?

Why did they think she was hiking? When she had appointments in her diary for that morning and afternoon, and had left her door unlocked.

Did it take a week for someone to notice signs of a crime scene in two areas at/near her home?

 

[LacieL]

Thank you, one more question ... how do the bins get to the kerb? Does everyone wheel out their own bins? Who carts out the recycling? I'm wondering because it seems to me that on pick up day, there will be folks scurrying out to manage their last minute garbage before the truck comes to pick it up. It makes me think there could be witnesses to the crime.

I lived in a similar brick walk up apartment building in Brisbane, though well over a decade ago.

At that building the bins were treated as communal but someone who also lived there would take all the bins to the street and back for collection, I assume it was an arrangement with the strata but I rented and wasn’t privy to those details. I’d try to help out by dragging a couple back if they were still out when I got home. Most people put their bins out the afternoon-evening before collection. There were issues with people using the recycling bins correctly in that building too. Actually 4/5 apartments I’ve lived in had issues with recycling. Apparently the council would threaten to stop collecting the recycling if it was consistently contaminated, at least that’s what the notes in the common areas and stuck to bins and, e-mails from management said. Some people just don’t care.

 

[SLouTh]

Exactly when and why did the police change their focus from "Lesley went on a hike" to "Lesley was placed in a bin"?

Why did they think she was hiking? When she had appointments in her diary for that morning and afternoon, and had left her door unlocked.

Did it take a week for someone to notice signs of a crime scene in two areas at/near her home?

I have been trying to find some thing specific about the case tonight … and in doing so know the answers to some of this….

An early report states that Tuesday was Lesley’s usual hike day …. (Assuming morning?? With her hair appointment in the pm )

The investigation seemed to change radically on the Thursday evening, before Good Friday …

Unfortunately, investigations yesterday afternoon and late into the evening have led us to the conclusion that Mrs Trotter is, in fact, deceased," he said. (7th April)

Police set up crime scenes after determining missing Brisbane woman is dead

Police say Lesley Trotter often went through rubbish bins outside her property and neighbouring properties to sort recycling from general waste, and they "have not ruled out" that this might be linked to her death.

www.abc.net.au

I will try to re-find the links …

But yes I totally agree about the door being open and her phone and wallet being there…. And how long it took for someone to notice the “crime scene” …..

 

[T-dawg420]

It’s still very baffling this case. If Lesley was in fact placed in the bin and didn’t fall in (I don’t think she fell in personally) then the act of placing someone who is deceased in a bin is very deliberate. If her death was purely accidental why hide her body in a bin? Lesley’s apartment being on the top floor would make it hard to take her body down to the bin area without being seen. maybe she was killed nearer the bin area, or on the concrete slab above the car ports. Maybe someone brought a bin to the crime scene, Still, if it was night or very early in the morning the chances of being seen are quite high. Esp with the potential for shift workers, or night owls going down to the 7/11 just down the road Etc. it does lead my thinking towards it being a spur of the moment crime and then hurriedly trying to cover it up and disposing of her body. I could be way off though.

i can think of a few scenarios that possibly were the reason for Lesley’s death.

1- it was simply down to the recycling habits of Lesley and she made someone angry. There was an altercation over it and it caused her death.

2- it could have something to do with the sale of her unit. Someone wanted to stop the sale for some reason. Maybe for financial gain, for example inheriting Lesley’s possessions after her death.

3- she could have witnessed a crime, Toowong does have its fair share of criminals, either coming to the area to commit a crime like breaking and entering into units or cars. There are quite a few drug offences around that area as well and maybe she witnessed something like that. Maybe there was a drug dealer living in the apartment block. Again with Lesley being a long term resident, and the apartment block being quite old the chances of knowing other people business is quite high IMO

4- she had been a long term resident of that apartment. I think she was single. I don’t want to tarnish her name or disrespect her in any way. However there is a possibility she could have had a relationship with someone who was partnered and it angered someone to the point which it caused her death. Maybe she was seeing someone and broke it off and was stalked?

It’s really hard to ascertain what happened without any evidence. Maybe there are more scenarios I’ve missed but those are the ones continually running around in my head.

 

[musicaljoke]

I have been trying to find some thing specific about the case tonight … and in doing so know the answers to some of this….

An early report states that Tuesday was Lesley’s usual hike day …. (Assuming morning?? With her hair appointment in the pm )

The investigation seemed to change radically on the Thursday evening, before Good Friday …

I will try to re-find the links …

But yes I totally agree about the door being open and her phone and wallet being there…. And how long it took for someone to notice the “crime scene” …..

... giving plenty of time to have the cleanest and best scrubbed bin in town. But, apparently there was still evidence of the murder in the bin.

 

[SouthAussie]

I have been trying to find some thing specific about the case tonight … and in doing so know the answers to some of this….

An early report states that Tuesday was Lesley’s usual hike day …. (Assuming morning?? With her hair appointment in the pm )

The investigation seemed to change radically on the Thursday evening, before Good Friday …

Unfortunately, investigations yesterday afternoon and late into the evening have led us to the conclusion that Mrs Trotter is, in fact, deceased," he said. (7th April)

Police set up crime scenes after determining missing Brisbane woman is dead

Police say Lesley Trotter often went through rubbish bins outside her property and neighbouring properties to sort recycling from general waste, and they "have not ruled out" that this might be linked to her death.

www.abc.net.au

I will try to re-find the links …

But yes I totally agree about the door being open and her phone and wallet being there…. And how long it took for someone to notice the “crime scene” …..

I noticed that, a week after Lesley disappeared, the police suddenly wanted people to check their sheds etc for any sign of Lesley.

I recall she had a gym appointment in her diary for that particular Tuesday morning.

I think it could be that someone discovered the crime scene/s (blood?) about a week later. So they started looking in her direct area.
At that point, I don't think they realised that she had been put in a bin.


April 4th:
"This is a highly urbanised environment requiring significant personnel, logistics and operational planning to search effectively," he said on Tuesday in a statement.
"Police are appealing for members of the public to check their yards, open garages or sheds for any signs of Lesley - this would help us greatly."

Police redirect search for missing Brisbane hiker

Investigators initially believed Lesley Trotter, 78, was at a popular Brisbane hiking spot but they are now searching closer to her home.

www.perthnow.com.au

 

[LacieL]

But yes I totally agree about the door being open and her phone and wallet being there…. And how long it took for someone to notice the “crime scene” …..

This is morbid but I think those things would have potentially pointed to a non-suspicious disappearance.

In the case of a suicide I think it isn’t uncommon for people to abandon their personal belongings or not bother locking a home. Combined with the large change about to happen in her life, that might have been the initial theory.

 

[dotr]

Police comb landfill for woman's body dumped inside a rubbish bin

Police are set to begin a painstaking search for the body of missing Brisbane woman Katarina Carroll whose body was dumped in a wheelie bin in Toowong on March 28.

www.dailymail.co.uk

April 17 2023

''Despite the arduous task, recovering Ms Trotter's remains will be vital to the police investigation.

'When you get the body of a person, you then have a lot more information available to you in terms of evidence, the forensics et cetera, so it's incredibly important that we do as much as we can over the next few weeks to find her.'

Ms Trotter vanished from the inner suburb of Toowong on March 28.

The retired teacher's mobile phone and wallet were found in her unit and her car was still in the garage.''

''Her body was hidden a wheelie bin, which was collected the next day then taken to a Nudgee transfer station and dumped in a pit, along with rubbish from another 22 trucks.

The rubbish was pressed in a massive compactor into huge blocks and freighted to landfill sites at Swanbank near Ipswich and Rochedale in Brisbane's south.

Both landfill sites are official crime scenes as police begin a forensic search through mountains of refuse.''


''The day Ms Trotter went missing six B-double loads of garbage were moved to landfill sites.

Rubbish collection continued for another 14 days, with another 300 truckloads disposed at the Nudgee transfer station alone.''

 

[SLouTh]

I noticed that, a week after Lesley disappeared, the police suddenly wanted people to check their sheds etc for any sign of Lesley.

I recall she had a gym appointment in her diary for that particular Tuesday morning.

I think it could be that someone discovered the crime scene/s (blood?) about a week later. So they started looking in her direct area.
At that point, I don't think they realised that she had been put in a bin.


April 4th:
"This is a highly urbanised environment requiring significant personnel, logistics and operational planning to search effectively," he said on Tuesday in a statement.
"Police are appealing for members of the public to check their yards, open garages or sheds for any signs of Lesley - this would help us greatly."

Police redirect search for missing Brisbane hiker

Investigators initially believed Lesley Trotter, 78, was at a popular Brisbane hiking spot but they are now searching closer to her home.

www.perthnow.com.au

Agree with the date of 4 April …

Had also come to the same conclusion, but couldn’t remember how I had come to that… but yes the article makes sense .

imo

 

[SLouTh]

... giving plenty of time to have the cleanest and best scrubbed bin in town. But, apparently there was still evidence of the murder in the bin.

We are assuming, at this stage, until confirmed by Police, that they have camera footage from inside the Garbage Truck that confirms her death..

 

[musicaljoke]

We are assuming, at this stage, until confirmed by Police, that they have camera footage from inside the Garbage Truck that confirms her death..

Awh yes, so maybe the bin was scrubbed clean and the evidence is the camera footage, rather than the actual bin.

 

[SouthAussie]

Agree with the date of 4 April …

Had also come to the same conclusion, but couldn’t remember how I had come to that… but yes the article makes sense .

imo

I guess the reason that I am even wondering (why the shift in direction) is because I wonder if Lesley's disappearance on her "usual hiking day" was chosen.

And the police spent a week fluffing around at Mount Coot-Tha. While Lesley was getting buried deeper and deeper in that rubbish dump.

"Look over there (Mount Coot-Tha)" ... 'but I know she's really over there (rubbish dump)'.

If there was any premeditation involved. (Big if)

 

[TootsieFootsie]

And how about the perp, maybe they got blood on themselves.
Did anyone see blood on someone. Or did someone suddenly have a shower.