Deceased/Not Found AUSTRALIA - Ms Lesley Trotter, 78, Homicide, Brisbane, 28 Mar 2023

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  • #661
I have a bin in my kitchen using a so called "green" plastic bin liner.

As Lesley seems to have been into things like recycling correctly, riding a bike,
maybe it went to the extent that she wouldn't even use any bin liners, including in the kitchen.

If they're talking about the recycle bin. I keep a teeny bin in the laundry, not a council one. I put anything in it that can go in the recycle. I transfer the contents later to the recycle bin.

Without those bins in the house I know I would be going to the bin more frequently.
Actually the neighbours would have to know, if LT took something to her bins in whatever container (certainly not in plastic bags as I am doing it ;)). Did she have something in her hand during her twice daily walks or not?
 
  • #662
Looking at the street view pics of Lesley's unit from the front, Lesley has a plastic table and chair set on her verandah, and the unit below her has a wicker table and chairs set, back in September 2022. Then when looking at the real estate pics of her verandah, Lesley has that wicker table and chair set on her verandah - in Feb 2023.


1682068211397.jpeg

2nd Floor Unit - September 2022
1682068260084.jpeg

Lesley's top floor unit - September 2022
1682068306945.jpeg

Real estate listing pic - February 2023

 
  • #663
Looking at the street view pics of Lesley's unit from the front, Lesley has a plastic table and chair set on her verandah, and the unit below her has a wicker table and chairs set, back in September 2022. Then when looking at the real estate pics of her verandah, Lesley has that wicker table and chair set on her verandah - in Feb 2023.


View attachment 416139
2nd Floor Unit - September 2022
View attachment 416140
Lesley's top floor unit - September 2022
View attachment 416141
Real estate listing pic - February 2023

One table has only one desk leg, LT's has 3 or four. A chair set has a different braided backrest than the other set of chairs. Am I wrong with that?
 
  • #664
This is true. Which makes me recall something about her family saying she was intimidated about being online (sorry I can’t have the source but it was posted in this topic).

She is the demographic that scammers heavily target.

This is my wild speculation. As far as I know there has been nothing other than being in the target demographic that would suggest she was a victim of any scams.
Apropos "online": Did LT have a younger person to help her with EDV technics perhaps?
I am in the same "demographic circle" like LT, and sometimes of course have problems with hardware/software. A friendly WS fellow member told me long ago, I should search for a teenager in my neighbourhood, who would help me, if necessary.

Btw: Scammers (re old people) are rather specialized on connections via phones/cell phones, I noticed.
 
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  • #665
One table has only one desk leg, LT's has 3 or four. A chair set has a different braided backrest than the other set of chairs. Am I wrong with that?
You are right, the table legs do look different. But, I think the chairs are the same?
 
  • #666
Maybe the furniture was moved around to make the unit look more appealing.
 
  • #667
You are right, the table legs do look different. But, I think the chairs are the same?
The two chairs in the pic (top) look like the braided backrest does not reach the seat; LT's chairs look like the backrest is longer.
 
  • #668
We actually don't have any idea at all whether she chose to live frugally, or if she needed to.

Just because someone had a good income (in our opinion) and whatever other assets doesn't automatically mean that they will always have that amount.

As well, Lesley lived in a nice district. Her strata (body corporate) fees were $3,758 per annum, her council rates were $450 a quarter. That is an extra $5,500+ that she had to come up with each year. On top of her car rego, car insurance, increasing petrol costs, increasing electricity bills, water bills, maybe private health insurance, increasing cost of groceries, etc.

For a person on a fixed income, with no real way of bringing in extra income any more, I imagine she might have watched her pennies.

I actually don't see any signs of air conditioning in her unit either. Which I would think was a must in Qld, so money may not have been in abundance for her. Until the sale of her unit ... when she suddenly and mysteriously died.

Strata fees and rates in the real estate ad.
 
  • #669
I actually don't see any signs of air conditioning in her unit either. Which I would think was a must in Qld, so money may not have been in abundance for her. Until the sale of her unit ... when she suddenly and mysteriously died.
I live in Brisbane and it is not uncommon for older properties to not be air conditioned. There is a bit of a “we were fine without it before” attitude about it, particularly for those who are older. I know multi millionaires who don’t have it.

I have it but don’t use it except on the hottest few days of the year. Not because I can’t afford to run it but because I grew up without it and think that feeling a bit uncomfortable is part of the life experience (and with that statement I have officially turned into my parents).
 
  • #670
St Aidens where Leslie was a teacher is currently one of the highest performing schools in Queensland.

I haven’t been able to find a date for when she retired.
 
  • #671
Ohhh good points.
Did LT have pets? I don’t thinks so from memory of reports.
Was LT sensitive to smells? Could that have also been a potential reason to monitor bins/bin areas? Stop neighbours bins from getting manky cause she didn’t like it?
I’m assuming as the unit just sold there would have been the routine pest inspections and if there were pest issues they would have had to been treated prior to sale?
All accounts from neighbours suggest she was quite routine about her movements around the bins, so although would make sense if she removed rubbish as she created it, wouldn’t the attendance to the bin be more random/ sporadic or even more frequent if that was the case?
I've waited for an email or a phone call to verify my 'status' and nothing from WS so far....should I contact again or wait for a response....

-I'm certain LT didn't have a dog - I never saw her walking one around the area. Cat - I went to her house once and didn't see one, but doesn't mean she didn't have one.
-LT wouldn't have been able to smell the bins from her unit; too far away.
-LT's unit complex was in tip top shape and she attended to less routine issues before she sold. She had the area (where you saw police sitting underneath the shelter) pressure-sprayed right before she put the unit for sale. I would imagine she had pest inspections done regularly too.
-I would see LT go to the bin and put small bags in the bin; sometimes more than once per day. Sometimes very early in the morning (ie 4.30 or 5am).
-I doubt LT could see the bin area on Clayton Lane from her kitchen window (that's the window at the back of the complex). I would often see her head at her back window, especially at early evening, and there is no way she could see the bins at that angle.

LT's unit was spartan but neat and well-kept (from real estate photos). She had a white Mazda 121 (bubble car) from the 90s which was also in great condition. I was sad to see, after police removed the crime scene tape from railings and the orange 'witches hat' thing outside her door', that someone removed her car and parked it on Clayton Lane as always garaged it and never parked it on Clayton Lane. I thought, 'Lesley would not have approved that!' I saw her at her own bin area more than any other resident (including the other elderly person who lived in her complex) but she was the body corporate president. And being an ex-teacher she ran a tight ship over there. I would see a man from her complex regularly smoking on the driveway area at the back and he was on friendlish speaking terms with LT because I saw them chatting pleasantly (I was surprised at this because another ex-tenant had not very nice things to say). I doubt he would ever leave his butts there as 1. I never saw him flick them and 2. LT would know it was him. Im guessing LT told him he can smoke there as there are common body corporate by-laws about not smoking on verandahs and LT was the sort who would let him know straight away where and how to smoke. Anyway, she wasn't down regularly picking up butts. But what I did notice was she kept the recycle bins to the right of the property and the general garbage at the left (looking at the back from Clayton Lane) and she was missing about four days and someone had already moved those yellow-lidded bins next to the general waste bins. I thought that was so weird that someone took charge of that so soon.
Another thing you don't see from reports. There was a 'secret path' used to gain access from Clayton Lane to Maryvale St. If you look at the back, behind the left of the general bin area, there's an access point through the hedge to the neigbouring complex to their driveway area. She didn't like people using that AT ALL and it caused angst for LT and she lectured people about it. I'm not cutting through out of respect for her, at least until her remains are found and she's had a proper burial.

She was very excited to be selling her unit. She prepared for the sale. I didn't see her as much early evenings in the last few months before she sold the unit (and went missing) nor did I see her driving as much. (Edited to add) When I heard directly from police she sold her unit to go into a retirement facility, it made sense about not seeing her drive as much. Also, she had four flights to walk up to her unit. I assumed she had been spending time at the new place (communal areas...bingo, elderly folks night time activities) to get used to it before moving in.
 
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  • #672
I don’t think she would have been short on money.

She was a teacher which while isn’t a super high paid position, in Australia teachers are not paid poorly. She had owned her apartment for 40 odd years and would have paid it off pretty quickly imo if it had a mortgage on it at all. It appears she lead a simple life in terms of spending.

She would also have superannuation and possibly a teacher’s pension. She didn’t have children so her teachers wage would have been more than enough to support herself. I actually think it’s more likely that she had saved a small fortune over her life rather than being desperate for money.

She doesn’t seem like the type to have a gambling problem (though they say you can’t always tell).

She may have been collecting cans for money but I don’t think she was short on money.

That’s my gut read of what we know of her circumstances. She reminds me of a few frugal retirees I know who are privately very comfortable but wear second hand clothing, collect cans etc.
I agree with everything you wrote (but teachers pension might not be too much) and aligns with exactly what I thought of her financial situation. Frugal, not rich, but possibly not doing the cans/bottles because she needed the money. But who knows her situation. Maybe she was trying to get as much money before her move? Could be more like 'free money for a little effort'? (edited to add detail).
 
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  • #673
Actually the neighbours would have to know, if LT took something to her bins in whatever container (certainly not in plastic bags as I am doing it ;)). Did she have something in her hand during her twice daily walks or not?
I saw her with a green shopping bag to put her cans/bottles in on walks around the neighbourhood.
 
  • #674
I live in Brisbane and it is not uncommon for older properties to not be air conditioned. There is a bit of a “we were fine without it before” attitude about it, particularly for those who are older. I know multi millionaires who don’t have it.

I have it but don’t use it except on the hottest few days of the year. Not because I can’t afford to run it but because I grew up without it and think that feeling a bit uncomfortable is part of the life experience (and with that statement I have officially turned into my parents).
I agree with this. Also, her unit is top floor and would get excellent cross breeze. I don't think the unit needed it and for someone used to it, and careful with money, why bother?

(Edited to add) I laughed at your 'I have officially turned into my parents' and agree that we're meant to be a bit uncomfortable... :)
 
  • #675
I've waited for an email or a phone call to verify my 'status' and nothing from WS so far....should I contact again or wait for a response....

-I'm certain LT didn't have a dog - I never saw her walking one around the area. Cat - I went to her house once and didn't see one, but doesn't mean she didn't have one.
-LT wouldn't have been able to smell the bins from her unit; too far away.
-LT's unit complex was in tip top shape and she attended to less routine issues before she sold. She had the area (where you saw police sitting underneath the shelter) pressure-sprayed right before she put the unit for sale. I would imagine she had pest inspections done regularly too.
-I would see LT go to the bin and put small bags in the bin; sometimes more than once per day. Sometimes very early in the morning (ie 4.30 or 5am).
-I doubt LT could see the bin area on Clayton Lane from her kitchen window (that's the window at the back of the complex). I would often see her head at her back window, especially at early evening, and there is no way she could see the bins at that angle.

LT's unit was spartan but neat and well-kept (from real estate photos). She had a white Mazda 121 (bubble car) from the 90s which was also in great condition. I was sad to see, after police removed the crime scene tape from railings and the orange 'witches hat' thing outside her door', that someone removed her car and parked it on Clayton Lane as always garaged it and never parked it on Clayton Lane. I thought, 'Lesley would not have approved that!' I saw her at her own bin area more than any other resident (including the other elderly person who lived in her complex) but she was the body corporate president. And being an ex-teacher she ran a tight ship over there. I would see a man from her complex regularly smoking on the driveway area at the back and he was on friendlish speaking terms with LT because I saw them chatting pleasantly (I was surprised at this because another ex-tenant had not very nice things to say). I doubt he would ever leave his butts there as 1. I never saw him flick them and 2. LT would know it was him. Im guessing LT told him he can smoke there as there are common body corporate by-laws about not smoking on verandahs and LT was the sort who would let him know straight away where and how to smoke. Anyway, she wasn't down regularly picking up butts. But what I did notice was she kept the recycle bins to the right of the property and the general garbage at the left (looking at the back from Clayton Lane) and she was missing about four days and someone had already moved those yellow-lidded bins next to the general waste bins. I thought that was so weird that someone took charge of that so soon.
Another thing you don't see from reports. There was a 'secret path' used to gain access from Clayton Lane to Maryvale St. If you look at the back, behind the left of the general bin area, there's an access point through the hedge to the neigbouring complex to their driveway area. She didn't like people using that AT ALL and it caused angst for LT and she lectured people about it. I'm not cutting through out of respect for her, at least until her remains are found and she's had a proper burial.

She was very excited to be selling her unit. She prepared for the sale. I didn't see her as much early evenings in the last few months before she sold the unit (and went missing) nor did I see her driving as much. (Edited to add) When I heard directly from police she sold her unit to go into a retirement facility, it made sense about not seeing her drive as much. Also, she had four flights to walk up to her unit. I assumed she had been spending time at the new place (communal areas...bingo, elderly folks night time activities) to get used to it before moving in.
I’m so sorry it’s taking so long, we have all been waiting patiently for you so we really appreciate you staying involved.
Hopefully you will be “officially verified” asap.
Interesting observations re the smoking neighbour too.

This has been a very interesting case re “community”.
LT Wass clearly “community and civically minded” but not actually for everyone’s harmony and well-being, but more to be in control?
She clearly didn’t mind what her neighbours thought about her habits to the point of Council complaints.
What actually happens if one complains to Council about the head of your body cooperates going through your bin for any reason? I’m guessing not actually much?
We’re there people known to be especially pained by the practice?
 
  • #676
Looking at the street view pics of Lesley's unit from the front, Lesley has a plastic table and chair set on her verandah, and the unit below her has a wicker table and chairs set, back in September 2022. Then when looking at the real estate pics of her verandah, Lesley has that wicker table and chair set on her verandah - in Feb 2023.


View attachment 416139
2nd Floor Unit - September 2022
View attachment 416140
Lesley's top floor unit - September 2022
View attachment 416141
Real estate listing pic - February 2023

The pictures with the old mismatched plastic patio furniture are not LT's unit. That top unit pic is the unit 6, not unit 5. You can easily check via google maps '52 Maryvale St'. Her unit (top left looking from front of Maryvale St) shows in google maps having the same metal and wicker furniture as in the RealEstate dot com pics.
 
  • #677
I’m so sorry it’s taking so long, we have all been waiting patiently for you so we really appreciate you staying involved.
Hopefully you will be “officially verified” asap.
Interesting observations re the smoking neighbour too.

This has been a very interesting case re “community”.
LT Wass clearly “community and civically minded” but not actually for everyone’s harmony and well-being, but more to be in control?
She clearly didn’t mind what her neighbours thought about her habits to the point of Council complaints.
What actually happens if one complains to Council about the head of your body cooperates going through your bin for any reason? I’m guessing not actually much?
We’re there people known to be especially pained by the practice?
Thanks...hopefully not too long but I got tired of waiting and had to post...

I thought when I saw LT going about her business it might be a mix of control issues and taking care of the neighbourhood too. Kind of like 'my way is better'. No, she didn't seem to care what others thought of what she did. I doubt Brisbane City Council has much jurisdiction over what people do with their own bins on private property. And she was the body corporate, lol, so no opposition there. But trespass onto other's property to gain access to recycling bins is another matter but I doubt nothing more than a warning from police as I'm guessing it is not a council matter.
 
  • #678
There was a 'secret path' used to gain access from Clayton Lane to Maryvale St. If you look at the back, behind the left of the general bin area, there's an access point through the hedge to the neigbouring complex to their driveway area.
Thanks…. have been wondering about this… Would it be possible to push a bin thru this hedge and path????? In order to place a Clayton Lane Bin on to Maryvale Street or vice versa ??
 
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  • #679
But what I did notice was she kept the recycle bins to the right of the property and the general garbage at the left (looking at the back from Clayton Lane) and she was missing about four days and someone had already moved those yellow-lidded bins next to the general waste bins. I thought that was so weird that someone took charge of that so soon.
This is very interesting ….Thankyou.

Do you know when the Police seized the bins? Prior to Easter Weekend, or during etc?
Were bins seized from Maryvale and Clayton Lane or just the one area?

And maybe when new ones were provided? Just thinking if the bins were replaced at Clayton Lane the delivery person may have placed them all on the left side together ?? ( General waste and recycling)


I've waited for an email or a phone call to verify my 'status' and nothing from WS so far....should I contact again or wait for a response....
Re-contact and maybe send a private message to the Moderator who asked you to apply. They maybe able to help your verification process..

Thanks so much for posting!
 
  • #680
Thanks...hopefully not too long but I got tired of waiting and had to post...

I thought when I saw LT going about her business it might be a mix of control issues and taking care of the neighbourhood too. Kind of like 'my way is better'. No, she didn't seem to care what others thought of what she did. I doubt Brisbane City Council has much jurisdiction over what people do with their own bins on private property. And she was the body corporate, lol, so no opposition there. But trespass onto other's property to gain access to recycling bins is another matter but I doubt nothing more than a warning from police as I'm guessing it is not a council matter.
Was the early starts to do bottles and recycling every day? Or only on certain days like a routine? Or randomly/sporadically?
Did you notice if she left/arrived the same way each time?
I wonder if someone was able to wait and plan or if it was off the cuff.
 
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