Found Deceased Australia - Russell Hill, 74, & Carol Clay, 72, Wonnangatta Valley, 20 Mar 2020 #5 *charges*

[OzFreelancer]

I've always struggled with the accidentally killed during an altercation scenario.

Firstly, because I'm not aware of any other accidental death case where 2 people are killed one after the other. Seems unusual.

Secondly, accidentally killing not 1 but 2 people AND hiding the bodies, setting fire to the evidence, and not coming forward. A normal person who accidentally kills would be wracked with guilt.

Thirdly, the sleeping bags are missing. Presumably they were used to transport the bodies.

Now, I've never tried this but I imagine it would be very difficult to get a deceased person into a sleeping bag. I guess you could unzip the bag flat and roll the body on.

But why bother. Why not just load them up? IMO it makes more sense that they were in their sleeping bags when they were killed. They might not have been asleep but keeping warm whilst reading a book.

If they were killed in their sleeping bags then that would explain the fire. Destroy any blood, DNA. JMO.

Pure speculation.

I really doubt there were any sleeping bags. I have never known a couple camping around there to use sleeping bags, let alone an elderly couple. They would have used doonas, which would be obliterated by the fire (or used to wrap the bodies)

 

[they'll get you]

I came late to this, and haven’t caught up on the first three threads yet, but do we have any reason at all to believe there was an altercation?

Well, I guess, they are missing, their tent burned down with their possessions inside the locked car.
I trust the cops.

 

[Satchie]

My feeling is that if GL was caught doing something like illegal hunting, or if he got mad and shot the drone then he could have been worried about possible charges affecting his job as a pilot, as I imagine that any charges could lead to a suspension. He might have been worried about RH and CC reporting him and that could have been a motive to get rid of them.

Possibly, but it takes a special type of person to solve a potentially minor problem by murdering two people and disposing of their bodies, and then go back to living a normal life.

I recall a decades long mystery of what happened to a couple who had disappeared near Belize. There was a boy who witnessed it: his father had been minorly humiliated by the man. Instead of laughing it off, he plotted revenge, which was to tie heavy objects to them - while they were alive - and dump them into the sea.

I just have the feeling that Lynn is not the kind of man to muddle through or bumble around, to get himself into messes, accidentally do things he never intended to do. A pilot, a guy who leaves his young wife and children for another woman without remorse, who goes off to Quataar for a change of scene, a life-long solo camper and adventurer...I don't think he would make mistakes.

JMO

 

[they'll get you]

The shovels.

Bunnings.
Did he buy lime and other chemicals to speed decomposition?
Just thinking if he purchased these things he must have returned.

 

[they'll get you]

Am I right they were newish Bunnings shovels?

Surely the cops would’ve trolled the sale of two shovels within a period of time.

What else did the purchase docket include?
Was it paid by card? ….Gotcha!

 

[wary]

Well, I guess, they are missing, their tent burned down with their possessions inside the locked car.
I trust the cops.

I wasn’t doubting that the couple were harmed. I wondered if there was any evidence that the two men got in a fight about something, which then led to the deaths of the couple. Any reason to believe that, other than the desire to seek an explanation that makes some sense? (My belief is that murders tend to make no sense at all—to anyone but the murderer.)

 

[ozazure]

@Aboreal Just to add to your post above - because they also pay for information, they often get exclusive stories which other media outlets then use. They always have the best photos and lots of them. In fact no other outlet can compare.

Quite frankly I get tired of everyone making disparaging comments about the DM because I've seen numerous mistakes in other media but no-one ever comments about that. These days in the rush to get stories out, it's not uncommon to see mistakes. The days of employing investigative journalists is not the same as it was years ago. Just saying.

It seems counterintuitive but I find the Daily Mail often has factual information first or are the only ones to publish stuff that is later confirmed in official documents. I also agree that all sources often have incorrect information. It is a crazy world when you are more likely to get more information from DM than ABC News but I think it's the strange reality.

 

[Motomike]

The shovels.

Bunnings.
Did he buy lime and other chemicals to speed decomposition?
Just thinking if he purchased these things he must have returned.

Another point re the shovels, If the burial site is in the Grant historic area its a long trek to Mt Hotham area to dispose of the shovels. Grant is south of the Wonangatta valley and Mt Hotham is North west of the Wonangatta valley with no easy route between the 2 places. If both Grant and the shovels are pieces to the puzzle then GL has gone to some serious steps to conceal the evidence.

Edit: Looking at the maps again i was incorrect Mt Hotham is NE of Grant and there is a reasonable road that connects MT Hotham to Dargo which is not too far from Grant Historic area. So it is a possibility that there is a link there.
As others have mentioned the shovels were not the type that you would choose to dig in the rocky ground up there , but they were the type you might have for 4WD activities to get yourself out of a bog etc. Just me thinking out load...

 

[they'll get you]

Possibly, but it takes a special type of person to solve a potentially minor problem by murdering two people and disposing of their bodies, and then go back to living a normal life.

I recall a decades long mystery of what happened to a couple who had disappeared near Belize. There was a boy who witnessed it: his father had been minorly humiliated by the man. Instead of laughing it off, he plotted revenge, which was to tie heavy objects to them - while they were alive - and dump them into the sea.

I just have the feeling that Lynn is not the kind of man to muddle through or bumble around, to get himself into messes, accidentally do things he never intended to do. A pilot, a guy who leaves his young wife and children for another woman without remorse, who goes off to Quataar for a change of scene, a life-long solo camper and adventurer...I don't think he would make mistakes.

JMO

Right!

Preflight checklist

In aviation, a preflight checklist is a list of tasks that should be performed by pilots and aircrew prior to takeoff. Its purpose is to improve flight safety by ensuring that no important tasks are forgotten.

 

[Satchie]

Another point re the shovels, If the burial site is in the Grant historic area its a long trek to Mt Hotham area to dispose of the shovels. Grant is south of the Wonangatta valley and Mt Hotham is North west of the Wonangatta valley with no easy route between the 2 places. If both Grant and the shovels are pieces to the puzzle then GL has gone to some serious steps to conceal the evidence.

I am geographically challenged about this area: is the Mt. Hotham where the shovels were found the same as the Mt. Hotham route the blue vehicle was photographed on?

I was dubious about those shovels: they are flat bottomed, so useless for digging into the earth. Would be used for spreading gravel or, potentially, digging a vehicle out of snow, mud, etc.

It occurs to me, possibly a compleat off-roader would carry a couple of those shovels in his emergency kit, and possibly, if he needed to make room in his vehicle or trailer, the shovels might have been discarded off into the woods on the way out of the valley...

 

[Doesitmakesense]

I am geographically challenged about this area: is the Mt. Hotham where the shovels were found the same as the Mt. Hotham route the blue vehicle was photographed on?

I was dubious about those shovels: they are flat bottomed, so useless for digging into the earth. Would be used for spreading gravel or, potentially, digging a vehicle out of snow, mud, etc.

It occurs to me, possibly a compleat off-roader would carry a couple of those shovels in his emergency kit, and possibly, if he needed to make room in his vehicle or trailer, the shovels might have been discarded off into the woods on the way out of the valley...

Those types of shovels might to be the best for that type of digging. But if that's what you have on hand, as you mentioned some people may have for off roading. They would work better than no shovel at all

 

[Sillybilly]

Please welcome Motomike who has been verified as a long term acquaintance of Russell's. We'll let our VI tell you how they knew each other.

We are always fortunate to have a VI contributing to our discussions, so please treat Motomike with respect at all times. If there is something you disagree with, please do not argue or badger them for information they may not wish to share.

Thank you to Motomike and everyone else for being here to discuss Russell and Carol's case.

 

[Detective Willy]

No Cookies | Herald Sun

Search area for the bodies of Russell and Carol is said to be the Grant Historic Area near Wonnangatta.

Roadblocks setup near Dargo High Plains Rd-McMillans Rd, near Dargo
Some campers already there told they can stay.

Search expected to start on Monday


Behind a paywall

 

[Motomike]

I am geographically challenged about this area: is the Mt. Hotham where the shovels were found the same as the Mt. Hotham route the blue vehicle was photographed on?

I was dubious about those shovels: they are flat bottomed, so useless for digging into the earth. Would be used for spreading gravel or, potentially, digging a vehicle out of snow, mud, etc.

It occurs to me, possibly a compleat off-roader would carry a couple of those shovels in his emergency kit, and possibly, if he needed to make room in his vehicle or trailer, the shovels might have been discarded off into the woods on the way out of the valley...

I will have to check the records, but from memory the shovels were found off the side of the road leading to Mt Hotham. If the photo of the blue Nissan were taken on the Mt Hotham road then it could be a link. There are a couple of roads it could have been in the area (Dargo High Plains road or The Great Alpine road being the main roads used to access Mt Hotham).
Just looking at the maps again and I was incorrect in my first posting re the shovels and Grant Historic area. The journey would not be as arduous as I first thought. It may be a possibility, but still a bit of an effort to hide your tracks if in fact that is what has happened.

 

[emirates1957]

Oh you have hit it on the head.

I thought he looked like a big eater who's also a big drinker. I didn't think he looked debauched or a drug taker.

Generally speaking Pilot’s are not the healthiest …. Sitting in a flight deck 8 hours per day being fed snack after snack, transit at an airport more junk food. They have to be very careful with booze and drugs as CASA can rock up any time with a DAMP tester, any trace of either your stood down…..also as a Check Captain coming out of lock down he would have been on call months ago to revalidate crew. From memory on the crew bus he was certainly on the large size.

 

[JayWill]

Well, I guess, they are missing, their tent burned down with their possessions inside the locked car.
I trust the cops.

Have the cops said that there was an altercation?

 

[JayWill]

I am geographically challenged about this area: is the Mt. Hotham where the shovels were found the same as the Mt. Hotham route the blue vehicle was photographed on?

I was dubious about those shovels: they are flat bottomed, so useless for digging into the earth. Would be used for spreading gravel or, potentially, digging a vehicle out of snow, mud, etc.

It occurs to me, possibly a compleat off-roader would carry a couple of those shovels in his emergency kit, and possibly, if he needed to make room in his vehicle or trailer, the shovels might have been discarded off into the woods on the way out of the valley...

Or making a shallow drain around a tent in wet weather.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

I don't know about looking debauched, but I think he looks, using an old fashioned word, Tipsy.

 

[Motomike]

Map of the possible route from RC and CC campsite to Mt Hotham via Grant Historic area (route is approximate only).

 

[Doesitmakesense]

Map of the possible route from RC and CC campsite to Mt Hotham via Grant Historic area (route is approximate only).

Thanks for the map!!