Australia - Toyah Cordingley, 24, body found on beach, 22 October 2018 #2

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  • #641
Watching that video of Toyah at work makes this crime far worse that we already know it is. Such a waste of a beautiful young life.
I just cannot understand the evil monster who took her life. What a poor excuse for a human being.
 
  • #642
Thanks for all your comments - I've been following this case obsessively, to the point of crying when watching T's mother's statement etc, and it helps to feel others care and are interested.

A few out loud musings (sorry if I go on too long!):-

I don't think excess violence necessarily points to a known killer with personal rage. Some of the most violent murders of women are psychopath/stranger killings, eg Anita Cobby.

Also, I don't think we have clear knowledge that there was an excess level of violence. The police statements indicate there was some visible injury, but I think we are mainly basing ideas that the violence was particularly extreme, on T's Dad's comments. If it was my daughter I found murdered, ANY violence would seem messed up and excessive, I wouldn't be capable of distinguishing between my daughter and worse cases, so I don't think we can rely on this poor man's assessment.

Given uncertainty around what she wore - and if police had any idea of what she was wearing I am sure they would have mentioned, to help jog people's memories - it seems she was found naked and her clothes weren't in the area. This may also relate to uncertainties around whether it was a sexually related crime - naked could mean a sexual motive, and perhaps there were no other signs of sexual assault. However, naked could also mean a killer removing and disposing of clothing to remove potential DNA evidence. That is, perhaps no sexual assault motive, just an attempt to cover up a random rage 'snap'. Perhaps this contributed to her Mum's confusion - it there wasn't visible sexual assault, what possible other reason could someone have for killing her daughter on a beach?

This makes me lean towards the stranger killing theory, by a random 'undesirable' on the beach. Perhaps he attempted to approach a pretty girl and was rejected, then attacked her with a rock or whatever in a sudden fit of humiliated rage. Afterwards, he did what he could to avoid detection - removing clothing and phone etc, trying to hide the body. At least in terms of victim profiling (attractive young woman, by all accounts a lovely person, but with the self-confidence to stand up for themselves and rebuff unwanted approaches) and circumstances of the crime (smaller community, woman out doing something casual and normal) this case reminds me of Mollie Tibbetts. Like Mollie, perhaps Toyah threatened the perpetrator with her phone? Took a photo of him masturbating at her or something?

What doesn't seem to fit with the above, as lots of people have mentioned, is the dog. However, it's not a stranger handling the dog that bothers me - i think a gentle dog could be handled by a stranger enough to be tied to a tree, particularly a stranger with adrenalin going etc - but the inconsistency of tying up the dog near her body, YET trying to bury her body for the purpose of hiding it. Leaving the dog there almost guarantees she would be found after the dog was found (as happened), in which case why bother burying her?

So perhaps she WAS buried out of shame by a perpetrator known to her, who ultimately wanted both the dog and her body to be found. Which then brings me back to the most obvious suspect when a woman is murdered. But I suspect he may have been discounted because he was at work or something, as if they are looking for someone for missing clothes/injuries, this would be easy to prove with M. Also, there hasn't been the footage of evidence, brown paper bags etc being taken from M's house. I don't know! So confusing.

I guess I still come down on the side of a spur of the moment stranger killing, who tried to cover it up, but just didn't know what to do about the dog. Perhaps he tied the dog up after the killing - the dog may have been running off ahead when he approached T, and the killing couldve happened quite quickly, then once he'd dragged her up in the dunes to get rid of the evidence, the dog came back and he just grabbed it and tied it to a tree, then didn't know what to do so just left it. Perhaps he only wanted to hide her enough to make his getaway. Perhaps someone troubled/narcissistic/poor impulse control rather than a stone cold psychopath, who wouldve killed and disposed of the dog too.

Either way, I hope this person is caught, and feel such sadness for T's family that this still won't bring her back.
 
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  • #643
Thanks for all your comments - I've been following this case obsessively, to the point of crying when watching T's mother's statement etc, and it helps to feel others care and are interested.

A few out loud musings (sorry if I go on too long!):-

I don't think excess violence necessarily points to a known killer with personal rage. Some of the most violent murders of women are psychopath/stranger killings, eg Anita Cobby.

Also, I don't think we have clear knowledge that there was an excess level of violence. The police statements indicate there was some visible injury, but I think we are mainly basing ideas that the violence was particularly extreme, on T's Dad's comments. If it was my daughter I found murdered, ANY violence would seem messed up and excessive, I wouldn't be capable of distinguishing between my daughter and worse cases, so I don't think we can rely on this poor man's assessment.

Given uncertainty around what she wore - and if police had any idea of what she was wearing I am sure they would have mentioned, to help jog people's memories - it seems she was found naked and her clothes weren't in the area. This may also relate to uncertainties around whether it was a sexually related crime - naked could mean a sexual motive, and perhaps there were no other signs of sexual assault. However, naked could also mean a killer removing and disposing of clothing to remove potential DNA evidence. That is, perhaps no sexual assault motive, just an attempt to cover up a random rage 'snap'. Perhaps this contributed to her Mum's confusion - it there wasn't visible sexual assault, what possible other reason could someone have for killing her daughter on a beach?

This makes me lean towards the stranger killing theory, by a random 'undesirable' on the beach. Perhaps he attempted to approach a pretty girl and was rejected, then attacked her with a rock or whatever in a sudden fit of humiliated rage. Afterwards, he did what he could to avoid detection - removing clothing and phone etc, trying to hide the body. At least in terms of victim profiling (attractive young woman, by all accounts a lovely person, but with the self-confidence to stand up for themselves and rebuff unwanted approaches) and circumstances of the crime (smaller community, woman out doing something casual and normal) this case reminds me of Mollie Tibbetts. Like Mollie, perhaps Toyah threatened the perpetrator with her phone? Took a photo of him masturbating at her or something?

What doesn't seem to fit with the above, as lots of people have mentioned, is the dog. However, it's not a stranger handling the dog that bothers me - i think a gentle dog could be handled by a stranger enough to be tied to a tree, particularly a stranger with adrenalin going etc - but the inconsistency of tying up the dog near her body, YET trying to bury her body for the purpose of hiding it. Leaving the dog there almost guarantees she would be found after the dog was found (as happened), in which case why bother burying her?

So perhaps she WAS buried out of shame by a perpetrator known to her, who ultimately wanted both the dog and her body to be found. Which then brings me back to the most obvious suspect when a woman is murdered. But I suspect he may have been discounted because he was at work or something, as if they are looking for someone for missing clothes/injuries, this would be easy to prove with M. Also, there hasn't been the footage of evidence, brown paper bags etc being taken from M's house. I don't know! So confusing.

I guess I still come down on the side of a spur of the moment stranger killing, who tried to cover it up, but just didn't know what to do about the dog. Perhaps he tied the dog up after the killing - the dog may have been running off ahead when he approached T, and the killing couldve happened quite quickly, then once he'd dragged her up in the dunes to get rid of the evidence, the dog came back and he just grabbed it and tied it to a tree, then didn't know what to do so just left it. Perhaps he only wanted to hide her enough to make his getaway. Perhaps someone troubled/narcissistic/poor impulse control rather than a stone cold psychopath, who wouldve killed and disposed of the dog too.

Either way, I hope this person is caught, and feel such sadness for T's family that this still won't bring her back.

Excellent post, and interesting perspective RE tying the dog up but trying to bury her. It doesn't make a lot of sense. You'd think someone who didn't mind murdering a young woman would have no issue murdering her dog too.
 
  • #644
maybe the dog was simply grabbed and tied up quickly and angrily before the assault so it didnt get in the way, then forgotten about in their haste to get away?
 
  • #645
toyahs mother said it was m who reported her missing,
possibly to her father who he seemed to be close to, he may have stayed at home in case she came back or he could have been searching for her also, we dont know where he was that night
 
  • #646
i wonder if this white ute is in the roundabout cctv footage?
7 News Cairns
 
  • #647
  • #648
toyahs mother said it was m who reported her missing,
possibly to her father who he seemed to be close to, he may have stayed at home in case she came back or he could have been searching for her also, we dont know where he was that night
Could explain why the other dog went missing - he might have looked for her for all we know, and somehow the other dog went missing? Funny though, cause any dog lover would know - unless it's a very young & silly dog, or a dog that isn't very obedient - you wouldn't normally expect it to escape. But I guess we don't know the situation... unfortunately! wish we did! perhaps this other dog is an escape artist... plenty are
 
  • #649
I can’t seem to find what you are referencing.
its at the beginning of the video around 0.7 where m is lifting toyahs dog from his vehicle
 
  • #650
its at the beginning of the video around 0.7 where m is lifting toyahs dog from his vehicle
Any idea what kind of vehicle this is? It looks like it has a sticker on the back "uncle suss" which could be a DJ....?? Also the little "my family" pictures... quite easily identifiable is cctv are directed toward the back of the vehicle...
 
  • #651
<modsnip - quoted post and reference to it removed>

You just get vibes from people even if you could be wrong, and he does not have that vibe. Also from the few reports about the state of her body it seems like a sexually motivated crime and that doesn't really fit with a man that would have been with her for 3 years.
 
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  • #652
toyahs mother said it was m who reported her missing,
possibly to her father who he seemed to be close to, he may have stayed at home in case she came back or he could have been searching for her also, we dont know where he was that night
Hi bear bear - Toyahs Mum said her BF reported her missing and I thought it curious that she didn’t mention him by name.
 
  • #653
Hi bear bear - Toyahs Mum said her BF reported her missing and I thought it curious that she didn’t mention him by name.
that is odd, maybe they didnt like him and thought he was weird or they may have had a falling out, toyah seemed extremely close to her father and m is in photos with them, maybe that caused a rift?
or maybe it wasnt m who reported her missing, it could have been a new bf?
 
  • #654
I would have thought all those close to Toyah would have spent considerable time in police interview rooms. More so if they are considered suspects.
You have to pretty good or at least truthful to get through those unscathed. They not only record the whole session but examine every word, watch you body language and keep up powerful eye contact.
The questioning can become quite aggressive.

Then, if and when you are re interviewed they look for any changes in your story. But they still have to place you at the crime scene and prove you carried out the murder.
Only two people know what happened; Toyah and her killer. And of course a dog who cannot talk.

It is starting to look like the more rare of homicides.......a stranger to Toyah is the likely perpetrator.
 
  • #655
@bearbear this holden looks like his ute... but there's one lightning bolt on the right back of his, whereas this one has two

This pic is a Holden 2002 VY V8/six-speed ute

similar.png
 
  • #656
could be a holden s ute?
may not even be his, seems odd to have the family stickers on it so could be borrowed?
 
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  • #657
  • #658
  • #659
  • #660
Thanks! for some reason it wasn't working on my phone. Its a holden commodore S VZ or VU? Ute. He got this quite some time ago around the 5 April 2013... (just a guess....). What does UNKLE SUSS mean?

its at the beginning of the video around 0.7 where m is lifting toyahs dog from his vehicle
 
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