Australia- Two sisters in their 20s found dead inside Sydney unit had been there lengthy time, Suspicious deaths, June 2022

[Dotta]

The building had a cctv so if someone was in the building walking around and knocking to people’s doors it would be seen and other people who live there would mention seeing someone suspicious or someone trying to get to their apartment under false premise.
People commit suicide in various ways and its hard to comprehend for anyone who hasn’t been there.
I still believe they commited suicide and nobody else was responsible.

If they were murdered, they were targeted.

I doubt the perp/s would knock on neighbours' doors.

As for cctv - how long are the records kept?

They were discovered after a month.
Are there cameras in the corridors showing front doors?

What about a balcony?

MOO

 

[Fika]

If they were murdered, they were targeted.

I doubt the perp/s would knock on neighbours' doors.

As for cctv - how long are the records kept?

They were discovered after a month.
Are there cameras in the corridors showing front doors?

What about a balcony?

MOO

Police so far doesn’t believe that anyone was in the apartment and they have cctv and talked to people. Since it was restaurant/take out on the bottom there might be some cameras and people out and about.

 

[Charlot123]

I think it is interesting to know where the funds were coming in initially and why the source dried out, but I don’t think we’ll find out about it. I think lack of money strongly contributed to their malnutrition, hopelessness and later, suicide. JMO.

However, whatever scanty information I found about the girls in “the Arab News”, drew the parallels between them and the Farea sisters, and the reading between the lines was obvious. All the more so that they were called “Saudi citizens”.

My feeling is, for refugees coming from countries like SA, one should imagine that they have zero clue how the rest of the world lives, and make brochures starting from there.

A different situation, but in Seoul underground, we were approached by an old Korean man speaking good English. He used to live in the US and had many friends from the country, so he made a brochure for US tourists for their first days in Korea. How to call, where to eat, how subway works, even the toilet (don’t be surprised if you see this-and-this). A couple of phrases, enough to get by. It was very helpful. All that he needed to ask himself was, what would be difficult or puzzling in Seoul for US tourists. (It might be important! I remember, when I just moved to US, I spoke the language, but someone, probably knowing I had little money, told me, “to call, you pick up the phone and say, “Call collect”. So I assumed, this is how people in US make all calls, and how would I know otherwise? Until someone else asked me, look, you are working in a company with a name, why the heck do you call collect from your work? This is how I found out that not all calls in the US were collect). Just an example, that people coming from all kinds of curtain may speak English but have zero, nada, clue how the system works, and if they are scared to ask their own (I didn’t have this problem), it is a double whammy.

So maybe, it would be a good start. And maybe at the very end, in this brochure, there should be a depression screening test and a line to call.

 

[dotr]

It’s interesting to hear that their funds were drying up.

Everything I’ve read stated they ran with $5000. That’s not going to go very far.

They had a small, but albeit, nice apartment that they were paying out almost $2000/month for. They had a car that they either owned or leased. Again not cheap.

If they didn’t go to work or go anywhere why did they get a car? Now they need gas money.

They ordered in food which gets costly. Why didn’t they cook for themselves?

They didn’t work. Why not? How did they envision their future?

Where was the money coming from, and if it was coming from family in Saudi Arabia, what happened? Why was their Bank Account dwindling? Did someone find out that a family member was bankrolling the girls and put a stop to it?

Honestly, I think the sisters knew it was over for them. They had been found out and the tap got turned off.

They couldn’t go back. If they did, they would be killed.

No money, no life, no family, just incredible fear and worry.

I can believe they committed suicide.

MOO

Reminded of the similar financial circumstances of these tragic sisters.. rbbm.

Saudi sisters who were found duct taped together in Hudson River died by suicide, medical examiner says

Tala Farea, 16, and Rotana Farea, 23, were bound together with duct tape

abcnews.go.com

''Authorities said they'd been living in Manhattan since Sept. 1, shopping, ordering lavish meals and staying at lofty hotels until a credit card they were using maxed out.''

''People who knew the Farea sisters in Virginia told investigators that they made statements within the last year indicating "that they would rather inflict harm on themselves — commit suicide — than return to Saudi Arabia," WABC reported.''

 

[Dotta]

I think it is interesting to know where the funds were coming in initially and why the source dried out, but I don’t think we’ll find out about it. I think lack of money strongly contributed to their malnutrition, hopelessness and later, suicide. JMO.

However, whatever scanty information I found about the girls in “the Arab News”, drew the parallels between them and the Farea sisters, and the reading between the lines was obvious. All the more so that they were called “Saudi citizens”.

My feeling is, for refugees coming from countries like SA, one should imagine that they have zero clue how the rest of the world lives, and make brochures starting from there.

A different situation, but in Seoul underground, we were approached by an old Korean man speaking good English. He used to live in the US and had many friends from the country, so he made a brochure for US tourists for their first days in Korea. How to call, where to eat, how subway works, even the toilet (don’t be surprised if you see this-and-this). A couple of phrases, enough to get by. It was very helpful. All that he needed to ask himself was, what would be difficult or puzzling in Seoul for US tourists. (It might be important! I remember, when I just moved to US, I spoke the language, but someone, probably knowing I had little money, told me, “to call, you pick up the phone and say, “Call collect”. So I assumed, this is how people in US make all calls, and how would I know otherwise? Until someone else asked me, look, you are working in a company with a name, why the heck do you call collect from your work? This is how I found out that not all calls in the US were collect). Just an example, that people coming from all kinds of curtain may speak English but have zero, nada, clue how the system works, and if they are scared to ask their own (I didn’t have this problem), it is a double whammy.

So maybe, it would be a good start. And maybe at the very end, there should be a depression screening test and a line to call.

But the sisters cooperated with refugee centre.
They attended school, they worked.
They even knew how to organise AVO for "b/f".

They were not naive, after all they organised the escape to a foreign country.

MOO

 

[Charlot123]

But the sisters cooperated with refugee centre.
They attended school, they worked.
They even knew how to organise AVO for "b/f".

They were not naive, after all they organised the escape to a foreign country.

MOO

Well, no one is naive, immigrants just follow the known path. They followed a certain path, too, but it was bankrolled by someone’s money.

We don’t know how exactly they came to the foreign country because every newspaper writes whatever it wants, basically, to be the first one to post the news. It is even a little bit shameful, to post they were naked, then retrieve it.

From my perspective, they were isolated, with slim support network.

And maybe it all worked well as long as they had money. As soon as $$ was cut off, everything went downhill. This, the money, lack thereof - is on SA’s side. So it is important to know about them in Saudi, but not sure we shall know all the details.

 

[Dotta]

Well, no one is naive, immigrants just follow the known path. They followed a certain path, too, but it was bankrolled by someone’s money.

We don’t know how exactly they came to the foreign country because every newspaper writes whatever it wants, basically, to be the first one to post the news. It is even a little bit shameful, to post they were naked, then retrieve it.

From my perspective, they were isolated, with slim support network.

And maybe it all worked well as long as they had money. As soon as $$ was cut off, everything went downhill. This, the money, lack thereof - is on SA’s side. So it is important to know about them in Saudi, but not sure we shall know all the details.

Re: The money

I noticed they told the landlord:
"Money will be soon".
As if they were waiting for money transfer to their bank account.

Maybe it was Mother.
It was said she visited her daughters in Sydney.

MOO

 

[NeverPersonal]

Re: The money

I noticed they told the landlord:
"Money will be soon".
As if they were waiting for money transfer to their bank account.

Maybe it was Mother.
It was said she visited her daughters in Sydney.

MOO

Perhaps. I'm going to view the mother visiting thing as an unconfirmed rumor after the sort of rumor-based reporting we've seen on this case.

 

[Dotta]

Summary

Saudi Alsehli sisters died as part of suicide, NSW Police claims

Fresh theories emerged on Wednesday about the baffling case of Asra Abdallah Alsehli, 24, and Amaal, 23, who were found inside their Sydney unit in June.

www-dailymail-co-uk.cdn.ampproject.org

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

The building had a cctv so if someone was in the building walking around and knocking to people’s doors it would be seen and other people who live there would mention seeing someone suspicious or someone trying to get to their apartment under false premise.
People commit suicide in various ways and its hard to comprehend for anyone who hasn’t been there.
I still believe they commited suicide and nobody else was responsible.

Oh I didn't realise there was CCTV to review. Were the recordings kept? So LE know for sure that nobody went to their door?

The building I have has CCTV and can be reviewed but I don't know how long they keep it for over time - I hope this is the case.

I wouldn't imagine someone was going round the whole building if they were targeted personally.

I hope there's some evidence one way or another. I know plenty of people who have taken their own lives, including some in lockdown out of despair. Sadly it's usually a very messy, drawn out, process with a few non lethal events before they end up dead JMO

PS not in any way trying to be snarky, I was told recently that the term 'committed suicide' is out of favour nowadays as it refers to the time when people were told ending their own life was a mortal sin that meant they would go to hell forever and also it was a crime that could be tried and convicted. Apparently there's now a new language of attempted suicide / completed suicide or 'took their own life' or 'chose to end their life' etc.

 

[Aluev]

I have to wonder, how often do people choose bleach as a method for suicide? Sure, it is a chemical that can easily be found in most households but my mind first thinks of it as an easier method of destroying evidence than choosing it to commit suicide. Bleach poisoning has very ugly side effects and if the girls were poisoned by it, they would most likely be found elsewhere in the house or on the floor, in a more awkward position. Not just lying there peacefully in their beds.

Another point is the smell. Was bleach used to cover the smell of the two decomposing bodies? How come none of the neighbors complained about the smell sooner?

 

[Dotta]

I have to wonder, how often do people choose bleach as a method for suicide? Sure, it is a chemical that can easily be found in most households but my mind first thinks of it as an easier method of destroying evidence than choosing it to commit suicide. Bleach poisoning has very ugly side effects and if the girls were poisoned by it, they would most likely be found elsewhere in the house or on the floor, in a more awkward position. Not just lying there peacefully in their beds.

Another point is the smell. Was bleach used to cover the smell of the two decomposing bodies? How come none of the neighbors complained about the smell sooner?

Yes.
The bleach seems soooo dodgy!!!

 

[vls12345]

I have to wonder, how often do people choose bleach as a method for suicide? Sure, it is a chemical that can easily be found in most households but my mind first thinks of it as an easier method of destroying evidence than choosing it to commit suicide. Bleach poisoning has very ugly side effects and if the girls were poisoned by it, they would most likely be found elsewhere in the house or on the floor, in a more awkward position. Not just lying there peacefully in their beds.

Another point is the smell. Was bleach used to cover the smell of the two decomposing bodies? How come none of the neighbors complained about the smell sooner?

Very good points.

I, too, had wondered why there was no complaint about smell sooner. Open bleach could have certainly have helped to cover the smell. Imo.

MOO.

 

[dotr]

Japanese Turning to Suicide by 'Detergent Death'

In the past year, some 300 people have committed suicide by inhaling the fumes from a cocktail of bleach and other household cleaning products. Web sites promote the method as easy and painless, but the toxic clouds have forced the evacuation of whole neighborhoods.

www.npr.org

''In the past year, some 300 people in Japan have killed themselves by deliberately mixing bleach with other household cleaners and then breathing the toxic hydrogen sulfide fumes.

BBC reporter Chris Hogg says 50 people in one month alone have killed themselves that way. The Japanese have been alarmed both by the ease of carrying out a "detergent death" and by the way the toxic gas can seep out and affect people living around the victim.''

Bleached to Death (Again)

In light of the current “Bleachgate” scandal– the peddling of a “Miracle Mineral Solution” which claims to cure intractable illnesses but basically doses users withindustrial bleach, I am partly reprising, partly revising an earlier post on the homicidal use of bleach. Why? Because apparently...

www.wired.com

DEBORAH BLUM
SCIENCE
SEP 19, 2010
''.. In fact, in the United States, household bleach is the number one cause of accidental poisonings, with more than 50,000 cases (including eight deaths) reported to poison control centers in a single year.

Certain, killers and would-be killers know this very well. This July, for instance, a Missouri man became angry with his girlfriend and mixed bleach into a pitcher of lemonade for the woman and her children. Added a little bleach to the ice cubes too. Alerted by the noxious smell, they didn't drink it. He was arrested anyway.

The same month, a (former) cook at a Denny's restaurant in Virginia put bleach into the drinks of two co-workers. Both men were sickened but survived. The bleach poisoner was, of course, arrested.

Was July just a good month for stupid poisoning attempts? Or so I wondered. After all, bleach smells awful, tastes awful (or so I assume) and would send all kinds of chemical warning signals to the would-be victim. But when I did a little more research, I realized that I'd underestimated how often people actually try to poison others with bleach''

''Last year, a nurse in Texas was charged with injecting 10 dialysis center patients with bleach - and killing five of them.''

 

[Charlot123]

Summary

Saudi Alsehli sisters died as part of suicide, NSW Police claims

Fresh theories emerged on Wednesday about the baffling case of Asra Abdallah Alsehli, 24, and Amaal, 23, who were found inside their Sydney unit in June.

www-dailymail-co-uk.cdn.ampproject.org

The heading says the sisters sent a desperate letter to their landlord but there is no mentioning of the letter in the article. Daily Mail journalism again?

 

[Charlot123]

Japanese Turning to Suicide by 'Detergent Death'

In the past year, some 300 people have committed suicide by inhaling the fumes from a cocktail of bleach and other household cleaning products. Web sites promote the method as easy and painless, but the toxic clouds have forced the evacuation of whole neighborhoods.

www.npr.org

''In the past year, some 300 people in Japan have killed themselves by deliberately mixing bleach with other household cleaners and then breathing the toxic hydrogen sulfide fumes.

BBC reporter Chris Hogg says 50 people in one month alone have killed themselves that way. The Japanese have been alarmed both by the ease of carrying out a "detergent death" and by the way the toxic gas can seep out and affect people living around the victim.''

Bleached to Death (Again)

In light of the current “Bleachgate” scandal– the peddling of a “Miracle Mineral Solution” which claims to cure intractable illnesses but basically doses users withindustrial bleach, I am partly reprising, partly revising an earlier post on the homicidal use of bleach. Why? Because apparently...

www.wired.com

DEBORAH BLUM
SCIENCE
SEP 19, 2010
''.. In fact, in the United States, household bleach is the number one cause of accidental poisonings, with more than 50,000 cases (including eight deaths) reported to poison control centers in a single year.

Certain, killers and would-be killers know this very well. This July, for instance, a Missouri man became angry with his girlfriend and mixed bleach into a pitcher of lemonade for the woman and her children. Added a little bleach to the ice cubes too. Alerted by the noxious smell, they didn't drink it. He was arrested anyway.

The same month, a (former) cook at a Denny's restaurant in Virginia put bleach into the drinks of two co-workers. Both men were sickened but survived. The bleach poisoner was, of course, arrested.

Was July just a good month for stupid poisoning attempts? Or so I wondered. After all, bleach smells awful, tastes awful (or so I assume) and would send all kinds of chemical warning signals to the would-be victim. But when I did a little more research, I realized that I'd underestimated how often people actually try to poison others with bleach''

''Last year, a nurse in Texas was charged with injecting 10 dialysis center patients with bleach - and killing five of them.''

In the first article, there is a phrase:

“Hogg says authorities have linked the problem to Web sites and online message boards where people discuss ways to commit suicide. Some of the online recipes describe detergent death as relatively painless.”

This is what I always wanted to ask - did sisters attend groups discussing suicide? Asked questions? Complained?

 

[Coppertop15]

Oh, those poor babies!

 

[SouthAussie]

Can someone remind me please - what is the proof that no-one entered the women's property, ie by invitation or coercion or force, killed them and then left?

The crosses got me thinking. What if someone called around on the pretext of being a religious person like the jehovas witnesses type people do? or even a delivery person? or a work person?

There is a photo in this article that is captioned .... "Forensic finger print dust is seen on an external door frame at the alleged apartment where two women were found dead in Canterbury, Sydney, Wednesday, June 8, 2022."

I am guessing that (so far) the police have not been able to find proof that anyone else entered the apartment. With checking for prints being one of the tools the police have used in their determination.

Tragic twist in case of Saudi sisters found dead in Sydney unit

Despite several strange turns coming to light, little remains known about the sisters - but police have a leading theory.

7news.com.au

 

[whiterhino]

In the first article, there is a phrase:

“Hogg says authorities have linked the problem to Web sites and online message boards where people discuss ways to commit suicide. Some of the online recipes describe detergent death as relatively painless.”

This is what I always wanted to ask - did sisters attend groups discussing suicide? Asked questions? Complained?

Um... Who is reviewing suicide methods?? Who could say what is and isn't painless?! I can't believe that made me laugh.

I doubt very much that mixing bleach with detergent and inhaling the vapour would be painless. It would probably make the eyes, nose, throat burn. Blisters, coughing up blood, vomiting. However it could also probably cause loss of consciousness before the person gets to fresh air. Especially if they're under the influence of other things or in an enclosed space.

From what I read there was apparently bleach all over the floors and something about a lot of "fluids". Maybe I misunderstood?

No matter what, if it was suicide it's very tragic. Their lives were worth more than $5000.

 

[bfew]

The building had a cctv so if someone was in the building walking around and knocking to people’s doors it would be seen and other people who live there would mention seeing someone suspicious or someone trying to get to their apartment under false premise.

If they had been dead for 6 weeks when their bodies were first discovered, and the CCTV was routinely wiped after a month, and no backups existed, then the CCTV from the time they died would not be available.