Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sept 2014 - #12

[krig101]

http://www.9news.com.au/national/20...of-bill-spedding-over-missing-william-tyrrell

The alleged victims, now in their 30s, claim they were told not to speak of the attacks or their mother would be put in jail or taken away, according to documents tendered to the court.


I also located this article which outlines details of the abuse, different to how Hillsley has attacked children (as discussed earlier in the thread):

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...graph&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=editorial

Thanks Angeline!


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[blefuscu]

So you think a defence attorney would say this with no proof?


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Didn't stop Nurmi and Willmott in the Jodi Arias trial!

 

[sosocurious]

Back in January when BS home and office was raided in relation to the search for William.
Why was Colin so eager to get 1987 out there?
You get to know someone over 28 years. He loves those kids his step - grandchildren and they aren't his. His gotta be commended.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...liam-disappeared/story-e6frg6nf-1227193861228

 

[frogwell]

Hillsley went back to jail, 29/1/87. If he raped the victims even a few days before he went inside they could easily have visible injuries well into March. The internal injuries may have taken longer to heal especially if they were not treated soon after the trauma. The police have tendered to the court that the victims had to clean up blood and vomit after being repeatedly raped. It is already on record that he is brutal to children and capable of doing this. It's on record he wanted to do this to his neice and had access. This is not a red herring. MOO

My take on all this is that if BS married MS later in 1987, he was probably separated from the mother of the two girls and living full-time in a caravan in the back of a friend's house in Campbelltown. If he had actually married the mother of the two girls, it would take at least a year then to get a divorce. and he would have had legal rights to see the girls every second weekend and have them stay with him. So the divorce proceedings would have begun in 1986. He could have begun by living under the same roof but by March, 1987 at least, he had moved out. He may have lied to his ex-partner that he was sharing a house and they had an extra bedroom. for the girls. So IMO every second weekend from March through to May, 1987, he shared a bed with these little girls. Perhaps access was stopped after these allegations or he had meet MS by then and moved into her house.

IMO there is no way you could blame Hillsleyr for sexual abuse which happened between March and May, 1987 as he was locked up then. The Defence claimed it did not have the report from the child's mother so the mention of Hillsley is just a red herring. Surely the children were asked to describe the perpetrator in terms of hair colouring, etc. as they do not look alike.

The Defence is trying hard to promote doubt that BS was the perpetrator but I do not think they have offered enough bail money and it is feared that he is a flight risk, a danger to children if he continued to visit homes to repair washing machines if they might live there and he could tamper with evidence and witnesses.

My prediction is that BS will not be offered bail.

BBM

 

[frogwell]

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WHOA!

10. He was released on parole on 19 December 1986. On 29 January 1987, following a report expressing grave concern about the respondent's inappropriate and potentially dangerous behaviour towards young girls, his parole was revoked and he was returned to prison to serve the remainder of his sentence. The respondent had been found in his place of employment on 21 January 1987 with a young girl locked in the toilet in the building. He was interviewed by the probation and parole officer. He stated that nothing had occurred and that everyone was over-reacting. He was interviewed the next day by a medical officer who was of the opinion that the respondent had some unresolved behavioural problems and that he was still focussing his sexual attention on girls of tender years, including his nieces with whom he had some regular contact at his parental home. He had been warned by his father not to take these children into a bedroom prior to the incident in the toilet.

11. While continuing his psychiatric outpatient treatment, he revealed to his doctor that he had taken clothing belonging to his niece which had been stored in a garage under his home unit block. He was later interviewed by the probation and parole officer and questioned about his intent. He stated "It is purely sexual, yes. I would probably have intercourse this time. I was angry at the family for thinking I was doing the wrong thing so I thought I would show them and actually do it".

http://www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/si...rey Hillsley

My opinion only and not that of Websleuths.

That does look like an admission to me. When he is caught before the act with the girl in the toilet he minimises it. After reading his other crimes he seems to admit frankly what he has done after the fact. It may not have been received as an admission, just an answer to the question about intent, but I think he telling them what he has already done and why.

 

[frogwell]

Why did he go to great lengths to store her clothing?

 

[sosocurious]

Hillsley went back to jail, 29/1/87. If he raped the victims even a few days before he went inside they could easily have visible injuries well into March. The internal injuries may have taken longer to heal especially if they were not treated soon after the trauma. The police have tendered to the court that the victims had to clean up blood and vomit after being repeatedly raped. It is already on record that he is brutal to children and capable of doing this. It's on record he wanted to do this to his neice and had access. This is not a red herring. MOO

BBM

He is accused of three counts of having sex with a three-year-old between March, 1987 and April OR April - May depending on which article.

http://www.portnews.com.au/story/3155011/spedding-historical-child-sex-offences-case-adjourned/
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...ild-rape-charges/story-fni0cx12-1227316615479

Police allege the abuse was carried out during a weekend when Spedding was staying in a caravan near Campbelltown. On one occasion, court documents say, Spedding’s then six-year-old alleged victim woke up to him raping her.

Medical reports obtained by the police made soon after the alleged event suggests the young victim was penetrated.

http://www.news.com.au/national/cri...-appear-in-court/story-fns0kb1g-1227316450596

 

[Makara]

Hillsley went back to jail, 29/1/87. If he raped the victims even a few days before he went inside they could easily have visible injuries well into March. The internal injuries may have taken longer to heal especially if they were not treated soon after the trauma. The police have tendered to the court that the victims had to clean up blood and vomit after being repeatedly raped. It is already on record that he is brutal to children and capable of doing this. It's on record he wanted to do this to his neice and had access. This is not a red herring. MOO

BBM

Spedding is alleged to have inflicted the abuse in April and May, 1987.

One of the people made the original call to Crime Stoppers about Spedding days after William Tyrrell was snatched.

Police have also obtained medical reports made soon after the event that allegedly suggest the young victim was penetrated. After the alleged rape, Spedding then “focused his attentions” on the three-year-old nearby, police allege.

Police allege that, since Spedding became aware they were making inquiries with him in relation to the disappearance of William Tyrrell, he had contacted people he knows in the hope of obtaining character references.

BBM. UBM.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...graph&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=editorial

Frogwell, I respect your opinion but I don't agree with you. The MSM report above is quoting information that police have made available and that is all we can go on for now. It is at least a little better than some of the utter rubbish that has been printed in regard to this whole case.



You say

If he raped the victims even a few days before he went inside they could easily have visible injuries well into March.

I think you're trying to fit a square peg into a round hole with this logic. It has been stated that BS is charged with rape and assault that occurred in April/May of 1987. Not January, not February, not March. Police have obtained medical records soon after the assaults, not months after the assaults.

If it's proven beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law that BS is innocent of raping and assaulting two little girls under the age of 10, then so be it. In the interim all of us here including yourself are still hoping that little William is found alive and well and hasn't fallen victim to a paedephile ring of which, according to police, BS is allegedly a part of. This is something he hasn't been charged with and I sincerely hope that he had no part in William's disappearance. I keep hoping that William is being loved and cared for somewhere and will one day be reunited with his family.

I take umbrage to the fact that the police investigators in this case are criticised and demeaned. Don't put the police down on my watch! They are not grasping at straws or have stumbled across the perfect smoke and mirrors sideshow to distract the public from looking so empty handed! They are not there to "save face." These investigators are highly intelligent and well trained and they couldn't give a stuff about saving face. They are doing their job to see that justice is served. Always.

I'm going to cuddle my husband now. (Policeman of 20 years, now retired). Gawd this case is heartbreaking on so many levels!

 

[sosocurious]

Well said Makara
I agree totally.
Goodnight.:bed:

 

[frogwell]

Spedding is alleged to have inflicted the abuse in April and May, 1987.

One of the people made the original call to Crime Stoppers about Spedding days after William Tyrrell was snatched.

Police have also obtained medical reports made soon after the event that allegedly suggest the young victim was penetrated. After the alleged rape, Spedding then “focused his attentions” on the three-year-old nearby, police allege.

Police allege that, since Spedding became aware they were making inquiries with him in relation to the disappearance of William Tyrrell, he had contacted people he knows in the hope of obtaining character references.

BBM. UBM.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...graph&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=editorial

Frogwell, I respect your opinion but I don't agree with you. The MSM report above is quoting information that police have made available and that is all we can go on for now. It is at least a little better than some of the utter rubbish that has been printed in regard to this whole case.



You say I think you're trying to fit a square peg into a round hole with this logic. It has been stated that BS is charged with rape and assault that occurred in April/May of 1987. Not January, not February, not March. Police have obtained medical records soon after the assaults, not months after the assaults.

If it's proven beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law that BS is innocent of raping and assaulting two little girls under the age of 10, then so be it. In the interim all of us here including yourself are still hoping that little William is found alive and well and hasn't fallen victim to a paedephile ring of which, according to police, BS is allegedly a part of. This is something he hasn't been charged with and I sincerely hope that he had no part in William's disappearance. I keep hoping that William is being loved and cared for somewhere and will one day be reunited with his family.

I take umbrage to the fact that the police investigators in this case are criticised and demeaned. Don't put the police down on my watch! They are not grasping at straws or have stumbled across the perfect smoke and mirrors sideshow to distract the public from looking so empty handed! They are not there to "save face." These investigators are highly intelligent and well trained and they couldn't give a stuff about saving face. They are doing their job to see that justice is served. Always.

I'm going to cuddle my husband now. (Policeman of 20 years, now retired). Gawd this case is heartbreaking on so many levels!

Makara, you are making it personal, you are right, we don't agree. I can critique a police investigation and speculate on police motives, I obviously see them as human and not perfect like others seem to. I will stick with March as a starting point, it has been reported by MSM as a time frame and there is another valid suspect in the mix. You say square peg/round hole to me, I say just plain in denial to you but where is this going to get us. I could press the mod button as I feel a bit bullied by you but maybe we can just ignore each other.

 

[Makara]

Makara, you are making it personal, you are right, we don't agree. I can critique a police investigation and speculate on police motives, I obviously see them as human and not perfect like others seem to. I will stick with March as a starting point, it has been reported by MSM as a time frame and there is another valid suspect in the mix. You say square peg/round hole to me, I say just plain in denial to you but where is this going to get us. I could press the mod button as I feel a bit bullied by you but maybe we can just ignore each other.

That sounds like a plan Frogwell. Consider yourself ignored. In fact there is an ignore button if you'd like to use it. That way you won't see any of my posts and won't feel bullied. I've just used it for any further post from you.

 

[frogwell]

Makara, I hear what you are saying, I apologise if you are offended by my style of communication... there are no hard feelings from this end.

 

[Mountaingazer]

Hillsley went back to jail, 29/1/87. If he raped the victims even a few days before he went inside they could easily have visible injuries well into March. The internal injuries may have taken longer to heal especially if they were not treated soon after the trauma. The police have tendered to the court that the victims had to clean up blood and vomit after being repeatedly raped. It is already on record that he is brutal to children and capable of doing this. It's on record he wanted to do this to his neice and had access. This is not a red herring. MOO

BBM

But the examination where she was found to be purple and bruised was in May. That's over three months at the very least.

 

[krig101]

http://www.theguardian.com/australi...-seeks-bail-over-historical-sex-abuse-charges

He was called a “dangerous man” and a “naughty man who did bad things”, the court heard. The accusations first came to light in 1987.

"O’Brien said he did not have a transcript of the original police interview with his client, which must exist. “We don’t even have the mother’s original complaint to investigators back in 1987,” he said."


I bet the victims were also told that JH was a naughty man who did bad things and not just BS. Those poor girls I'm sure that info will come out during the trial.

So where is the transcript? Does Jubelin have a copy? [emoji1]

Really hope BS is not let out on bail.

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[frogwell]

Thanks, can I have a link to that please?

But the examination where she was found to be purple and bruised was in May. That's over three months at the very least.

 

[frogwell]

I think I have read the article you are referring to from the daily mail. In the article it describes the injuries the victim's mother saw and the victim complaining of pain in the body and being purple and bruised. I don't think that those observations make up the medical report from Westmead hospital. The only thing I can get from the medical report was there were signs of penetration. I would like a lot more information that stated these same injuries observed by the mother were also observed by the hospital, straight away indicating recent trauma. I can't see any date given with the medical report. context

Thanks, can I have a link to that please?

 

[soolaimon345]

It is not pixilated for me, wonder why it is for you, just curious.

 

[Angeline]

I think I have read the article you are referring to from the daily mail. In the article it describes the injuries the victim's mother saw and the victim complaining of pain in the body and being purple and bruised. I don't think that those observations make up the medical report from Westmead hospital. The only thing I can get from the medical report was there were signs of penetration. I would like a lot more information that stated these same injuries observed by the mother were also observed by the hospital, straight away indicating recent trauma. I can't see any date given with the medical report. context

Can I put it to you that Hillsley being a pedophile doesn't mean that Spedding isn't a pedophile too. I guess that's what trial will have to determine and the judge will have to make a call on today re bail.

 

[newone]

I think I have read the article you are referring to from the daily mail. In the article it describes the injuries the victim's mother saw and the victim complaining of pain in the body and being purple and bruised. I don't think that those observations make up the medical report from Westmead hospital. The only thing I can get from the medical report was there were signs of penetration. I would like a lot more information that stated these same injuries observed by the mother were also observed by the hospital, straight away indicating recent trauma. I can't see any date given with the medical report. context

I can't shake the feeling that this occurrence wasn't the first. I sense that there were multiple occasions and who knows if this was the premier event -- MOO

 

[soolaimon345]

I was thinking the same thing, is it possible the girl actually used the word one would expect and the msm are using BILL so as not to identify the victims publicly?
it just makes me wonder as I find it odd also.