Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sept 2014 - #24

[Makara]

Well I hope no one has been presumptuous in insinuating Im insinuating the FP are involved.

If one of the experts could post a 'definitive' timeline from when 'father' left, when the deck shot was taken, up till the 10:30 discovery by FGM? That would be cool. Because the media sure as hell are not reliable and 10:30 onwards has been done to death. After 10.30am is useless to me.

I spent my morning on a bog slow server explaining to someone that the EXIF CANNOT be faked.

A leg up would be great thanks. Waiting on 'definitive' timeline from when dad left.. Thankyou.

I wasn't insinuating you were insinuating anything Crabstick. The police are not going to tell us everything they know and so we have to rely on MSM. There are timelines available if you choose to search for them. You'll be waiting a long time if you expect me to do if for you.

 

[Hbayne]

The whole act of the kid napping is so brazen and risky. A car seat or restraint surely wouldn't factor into the mind of this or these persons !

 

[sleepinoz]

Is the pelican cleared?

The Pelican has been arrested for faking EXIF data :shame:

 

[frogwell]

I don't want you to leave William's thread. I, for one, value your contributions; even if sometimes I don't agree with them.
__________

As for the two boys in Jamie's case, I can't think of any other way to describe what they did as anything other than evil and monstrous. I know about the trauma these child perpetrators are often subjected to within their own families, froggy, and thus the propensity for the development of personality disorders. I try to have compassion for them but my compassion for their victims outweighs it. I know one boy responded well to therapy and is apparently living a quiet life. The other still brags about his crime and so has been given four new identities. He has also been jailed for breaching the conditions of his release (and alleged possession of child ).

Bo, I'm not leaving cause of disagreements. I'm just recognising in myself the trait of behaving "like a recalcitrant schoolboy" as Paul Keating would say. I just want to fight with everyone for the sake of it cause I want to know what has happened to William. I'm frustrated and run out of tolerance and patience. That's my cue to take a break.

 

[Bohemian]

The Pelican has been arrested for faking EXIF data :shame:

So...now he's a jailbird? :floorlaugh:

 

[Warshawski]

Have you tried rebooting your computer? That is *always* the first thing an IT person will ask you to do. moo

Sure did, and even swore at it, since that's always the second suggestion

thanks everyone for your help & support - it seems to be working ok again now so maybe some sort of server issue.

 

[kiwi50]

The whole act of the kid napping is so brazen and risky. A car seat or restraint surely wouldn't factor into the mind of this or these persons !

Exactly, I can't imagine a kidnapper taking time to put him in a car seat, especially if this was unplanned, I doubt if the car was stopped for anymore than 20 seconds, you wouldn't even turn off the engine.

 

[Bohemian]

Bo, I'm not leaving cause of disagreements. I'm just recognising in myself the trait of behaving "like a recalcitrant schoolboy" as Paul Keating would say. I just want to fight with everyone for the sake of it cause I want to know what has happened to William. I'm frustrated and run out of tolerance and patience. That's my cue to take a break.

I know the feeling. It's been a hard couple of weeks. Enjoy!

 

[ozazure]

Hang on, hang on, What do you mean by suss? Can you be specific what you mean by 'e-hashing'

I meant re-hashing ... my R doesn't work well and sometimes I miss my mistakes. I was basically expressing my frustration with some of the discussion, but you know, I probably shouldn't have as (within reason) everyone can have their say.

 

[Warshawski]

Do you have a link to where DCI Jubelin said that 'extended family' was ruled out? Remembering William's BGM, NC, has been reported on as being a POI, as was her 'best friend' KL (who has a history of associating with AJ)?

My hands are up Boho, caught out unprepared for sure. And after I posted I thought uh oh - where's the link.

I do apologise. I am convinced I read this but can't now find.. . .. I do absolutely take your point on NC who certainly must qualify as 'extended family' and I should have twigged to that fact ( I don't feel KL fits that description but that's another story )

my apologies again, I'll keep looking and let you know when I find. ..

 

[ozazure]

My hands are up Boho, caught out unprepared for sure. And after I posted I thought uh oh - where's the link.

I do apologise. I am convinced I read this but can't now find.. . .. I do absolutely take your point on NC who certainly must qualify as 'extended family' and I should have twigged to that fact ( I don't feel KL fits that description but that's another story )

my apologies again, I'll keep looking and let you know when I find. ..

I believe it was said around the 4th bithday media attention ... I have found "all family" cleared attributed to Jubelin but not as a direct quote. Looking for video now.

 

[sleepinoz]

My hands are up Boho, caught out unprepared for sure. And after I posted I thought uh oh - where's the link.

I do apologise. I am convinced I read this but can't now find.. . .. I do absolutely take your point on NC who certainly must qualify as 'extended family' and I should have twigged to that fact ( I don't feel KL fits that description but that's another story )

my apologies again, I'll keep looking and let you know when I find. ..

William’s wider family has been thoroughly investigated and interviewed, too. Their alibis have been declared sound — they were hundreds of kilometres away when William disappeared. Very few people knew the family had left Sydney to visit the area.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...l/news-story/55fe696ecdf5361c3f164bec8bd03e4d

I don't think this would include every single member of the family - just the immediate family IYKWIM.

 

[Warshawski]

After meticulously investigating William’s immediate and wider family the detectives have ruled them out. They’ve come to the conclusion he was snatched by a stranger; one terrifyingly likely motive is sexual gratification. They are hunting for a paedophile.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...sh-into-thin-air/story-e6frg6z6-1227308929078
How could toddler William Tyrrell simply vanish into thin air?
18 April 2015

Thanks so much Soso. Saved me a huge search. I should have saved and posted the link I know. .. will try to do better .. And also should have used the correct adjective ( wider instead of extended) but was certain I had seen that mentioned.

In light of NC.. What does that mean?

Has there been any official word that NC is a POI, or is it simply a case that desperation is making everyone a POI ?

 

[Warshawski]

"Jubelin’s first task was a comprehensive review of the search. “Once I was assured that it was a thorough and professional search then, OK, if he’s not lost, he’s been snatched.” After meticulously investigating William’s immediate and wider family the detectives have ruled them out."

How could toddler William Tyrrell simply vanish into thin air?
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...sh-into-thin-air/story-e6frg6z6-1227308929078
April 18, 2015

thanks so much South - should have posted link I know - then I started to question my sanity! Thanks for saving me. More importantly, thanks for the posting that gives us more train for thought.. OMG, whoever is responsible, please look after this little man..

 

[Bohemian]

My hands are up Boho, caught out unprepared for sure. And after I posted I thought uh oh - where's the link.

I do apologise. I am convinced I read this but can't now find.. . .. I do absolutely take your point on NC who certainly must qualify as 'extended family' and I should have twigged to that fact ( I don't feel KL fits that description but that's another story )

my apologies again, I'll keep looking and let you know when I find. ..

No need to apologise Just asking - not challenging.

You may well find one. Then I'll be red faced :iamashamed: *puts on big girl panties*

 

[Bohemian]

Thanks so much Soso. Saved me a huge search. I should have saved and posted the link I know. .. will try to do better .. And also should have used the correct adjective ( wider instead of extended) but was certain I had seen that mentioned.

In light of NC.. What does that mean?

Has there been any official word that NC is a POI, or is it simply a case that desperation is making everyone a POI ?

600+ POI. Gosh, we're probably all on the POI list with the amount of chatter we generate after every presser. Maybe we should start asking each other about our movements on Friday 12 September 2014 :lol:

 

[Bohemian]

My hands are up Boho, caught out unprepared for sure. And after I posted I thought uh oh - where's the link.

I do apologise. I am convinced I read this but can't now find.. . .. I do absolutely take your point on NC who certainly must qualify as 'extended family' and I should have twigged to that fact ( I don't feel KL fits that description but that's another story )

my apologies again, I'll keep looking and let you know when I find. ..

See, told you. Sorry Warshawski :doh:

Don't understand NC POI/non-POI dichotomy at all...

 

[Warshawski]

That little tidbit about FM calling FD, has been gnawing at me lately. Most recently, I have been wondering... on the timelines that have now been published (see outline below). (Up until I saw this article linked below with the timelines, I hadn't known exactly what time FD had left the house). What has been going through my mind is ... the family arrived after dark the evening before... what if FD got up early, with the kids... and FM and FGM didn't get up until later, like around 10am. Has there been anyone at all on the street who saw or heard the children doing all of that playing outside *after* the time when FD left the home? There seems to have been people out and about on the street that morning?

I know that doesn't make sense, because of that photo that was taken, which is said to be time-stamped at 9:45am, however there have been numerous discussions here about whether that phone and photograph were examined forensically by the police forensic IT specialist department. I seem to recall that Inspector Fehon was saying right away that FM had a photo on her phone.. nothing about the phone having been removed for examination for a few days, just that the time was checked, etc.

9:00am - The next door neighbour heard young children playing in the yard around 9am, before she left her home ("Mrs Wilson said she heard the two children playing in the neighbouring yard before she left to run errands in the township about 90 minutes before William disappeared, just metre’s from her home." - http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...k=e77d40d05fffc3964d1c23cc2e9be654-1474187223 )

9:15am - FD leaves the house

9:45am - FM takes a photo of WT in his Spiderman outfit, which he had changed into; (but WT appears to be looking and 'rawring' at someone else and not the photographer); WT's sister sat in the background with a winter-ish looking jacket on, coloring a picture which was said to have been to take to FGP's gravesite later.

?am - FGM makes a cup of tea.

10:00am - 10:25am - FM and FGM sit outside as the 2 children play chase in the garden.

10:30am - FM notices that she has not heard WT for about 5 minutes, and the search is on.

10:56am - FM calls 000


https://m.facebook.com/114990695251....114990695251792/804822172935304/?type=3&_rdr
and
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/features/how-could-toddler-william-tyrrell-simply-vanish-into-thin-air/story-e6frg6z6-1227308929078

Thank You D. Awesome poste and great work on the timeline in my opinion.

This is the stuff I have puzzled over.

I am sure parents of little boys will join me in wondering how do you get them to sleep past maximum 7am ( and that would be due to extreme tiredness, late night, dark room, silence around ..) all of which could have been the scenario at FG that morning.

Therefore I am sure William & his sister would have been awake & active way before FD left if that was 9.15 am.

Perhaps that was the 'swap over' point. .. Perhaps the deal with Mum & Dad was that she would have a sleep-in until Dad needed to leave, at which point she would be up and take over the care of the kids.

in that situation, anyone watching / listening out, would have had quite a few hours of knowledge that the kids were there, and to them make plans, position themselves within very easy reach, hand over mouth (perhaps chlorformed) .. No sound would have been heard.

 

[Bohemian]

Thank You D. Awesome poste and great work on the timeline in my opinion.

This is the stuff I have puzzled over.

I am sure parents of little boys will join me in wondering how do you get them to sleep past maximum 7am ( and that would be due to extreme tiredness, late night, dark room, silence around ..) all of which could have been the scenario at FG that morning.

Therefore I am sure William & his sister would have been awake & active way before FD left if that was 9.15 am.

Perhaps that was the 'swap over' point. .. Perhaps the deal with Mum & Dad was that she would have a sleep-in until Dad needed to leave, at which point she would be up and take over the care of the kids.

in that situation, anyone watching / listening out, would have had quite a few hours of knowledge that the kids were there, and to them make plans, position themselves within very easy reach, hand over mouth (perhaps chlorformed) .. No sound would have been heard.

The short answer is; you don't. They're up at sparrow fart. William's Mum did say she went out on to the large balcony with the children to look for a local kookaburra earlier in the morning (when she first saw the parked cars). That was mentioned before Dad's (09:15am) departure in police interview:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZALVhn0hElY

 

[Warshawski]

That goes without saying. But *what IF*, say a detective is tasked with a certain task, whatever it may be.. 'GJ: you, Det ?, you go and check: this, and this, and this'... and somehow, Det ? just doesn't do it, for whatever reason,.. forgot, thought he did it, did it half-@$$ed, whatever. GJ thinks it's been done. There is just no way (imho) that on top of all of the officers performing all of the tasks that would be required in this case, that GJ could also, in addition to levying out the instructions for, make sure that each and every detail was in fact looked after, as directed.

There was a case here on my side of the ocean many years ago when a murder was believed to have occurred, but no bodies had been found. Police had their suspect in mind. Police tasked it to another police force in a neighbouring jurisdiction to check out a location in their area, and it had always been assumed that this had been done. The victims' family was going to do it themselves, but they were told that no, the other police force has done it already. Turned out that the other police force thought the originating police force did it. Just a great big huge misunderstanding... 3 parties could have done it, but yet none did it. Eventually, after months, the bodies were found, in that very location, by a member of the public. Finding this months earlier would have made a substantial difference to the evidence that could have been obtained. Unfortunately, sometimes things fall between the cracks, and nobody even knows that they fell between the cracks, until they somehow come to light at some time in the future. jmo.

I understand for sure what you are saying D, and I would certainly agree with you in normal circumstances, however I don't see this as 'normal' circumstances' and IMO the reason that Det. Jubelin has been assigned, is because it certainly does not fit the 'normal' in terms of this type of unacceptable occurances.

IMO, this is no run-of-the-mill Detective, and he has been appointed to this case (at the expense of others) for a specific reason. I would hazard a guess that reason is because, on his watch, no stone goes unturned.

Have a look at his facial expressions, look at his eyes .. He is focused and will not lose. Part of me would love to be on his team...the other part would dread the expectation, the documentation, the feedback, the expectation .....

No way will he fail, someone will be brought to justice, IMO, no matter when...