Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #36

[Deleted member 102539]

If a part of family would have thought, little W had to reunite with them, why didn't they abduct his sister too? It makes no sense to abduct only one of the two bio siblings, if this had been the reason. With another plan they could have managed to get them both, W and sister, maybe in Sydney, not Kendall. IMO

 

[gregjrichards]

We still don't know whether William's abduction was a random attack or not. If planned, it was pretty clever.... i just can't see anyone being that clever (or lucky?)... not sure which....

I still think about whether William’s abduction was random or planned a lot. I think it must have been planned to some extent otherwise someone would have likely made a critical error. I just hope their luck is going to run out and they will be incarcerated for William’s case soon.

Will William’s case be in the news in Australia on the fourth anniversary of his disappearance?

 

[Bohemian]

I still think about whether William’s abduction was random or planned a lot. I think it must have been planned to some extent otherwise someone would have likely made a critical error. I just hope their luck is going to run out and they will be incarcerated for William’s case soon.

Will William’s case be in the news in Australia on the fourth anniversary of his disappearance?

BBM.

I think William’s case will definitely be in the news on the fourth anniversary of his disappearance. Beforehand, if there’s a notable break in his case or it goes to inquest.

 

[frogwell]

17 Aug 9:30 am 2018/00091447 William Spedding v Dailymail.com Australia Pty Ltd Civil Supreme Court Directions (Defamation List)

• 
  Justice L McCallum

Supreme Court Sydney

' + lt.court_room_name | trustedHTML" class="ng-binding ng-scope" style="box-sizing: inherit;">Unassigned

 

[iailwa]

How do you think that would have been achieved in each case? Sexual motive, reunification or creation of a family?

Not referring to specifically William's case, as i'm not sure that would be allowed. But i think a MO for sexual motives could be most likely an opportunistic grab - unknown person to the victim - these are the hardest to solve. As for reunification - a grab by a family member or friend/acquaintance/paid criminal. Creation of a family - snatch & grab & take the child to someplace & change appearance. I think this last 2 would be more difficult in OZ compared with USA due to population differences. Just speculating here...

 

[iailwa]

If a part of family would have thought, little W had to reunite with them, why didn't they abduct his sister too? It makes no sense to abduct only one of the two bio siblings, if this had been the reason. With another plan they could have managed to get them both, W and sister, maybe in Sydney, not Kendall. IMO

Def agree FG. Unless 6 degrees of seperation made kendall easier & the opportunity arose. But i doubt it... he'd have to hidden well, plus Bios and FF cleared, so i think reunification is unlikely JMO

 

[iailwa]

I still think about whether William’s abduction was random or planned a lot. I think it must have been planned to some extent otherwise someone would have likely made a critical error. I just hope their luck is going to run out and they will be incarcerated for William’s case soon.

Will William’s case be in the news in Australia on the fourth anniversary of his disappearance?

As for his anniversary - more than likely, bloody well better be! I'm not sure if someone would make a critical error in an unplanned abduction. he's there... nobodys watching. I think with more planning there's likely more room for error? Don't quote me on that, but opportunist unplanned abductions seem to go well unfortunately. Like Daniel Morcombe, adelaide oval & the beaumont children. JMO. Hope their luck is running out too

 

[iailwa]

How do you think that would have been achieved in each case? Sexual motive, reunification or creation of a family?

Bo, whats your thoughts on MO for these situations?

 

[iailwa]

Just thinking of another case here - Taleigha palmer. Something happens to her at her FFs home, could be anything. (But we all know what now). The father leaves the home & disposes of her body. Pretends she has wondered off - from school. What a sad case

 

[Bohemian]

Bo, whats your thoughts on MO for these situations?

Firstly, a sexual motive:

Someone heard the children talking, laughing, squealing whilst playing earlier that morning or they saw them whilst being in the street. Decided to take a look-see. Maybe had a ‘preference’ for young males. As DCI Jubelin said, ‘Evil met innocence.’ that day. Random, minimal planning, crime of opportunity.

Secondly, reunification of family:

First of all, biological parents have been cleared of any involvement into the investigation of William’s disappearance so either extended family member or friend hatched a plan to take William. Possibly achieved through relationships between known POIs and persons known to the public through MSM, ie; NC, KL, AJ, BS, etc. Maybe stalked the FF through SM or physically. Targeted and planned.

Thirdly, creation of family:

Someone took a shine to William, either spontaneously or over a period of time. Could have components of both of the MOs above. Either opportunistic or planned, random or targeted, depending on how the perpetrator first came into contact with William.

ETA: I think, sadly, the first is most likely.

 

[Wexford]

Firstly, a sexual motive:

Someone heard the children talking, laughing, squealing whilst playing earlier that morning or they saw them whilst being in the street. Decided to take a look-see. Maybe had a ‘preference’ for young males. As DCI Jubelin said, ‘Evil met innocence.’ that day. Random, minimal planning, crime of opportunity.

Secondly, reunification of family:

First of all, biological parents have been cleared of any involvement into the investigation of William’s disappearance so either extended family member or friend hatched a plan to take William. Possibly achieved through relationships between known POIs and persons known to the public through MSM, ie; NC, KL, AJ, BS, etc. Maybe stalked the FF through SM or physically. Targeted and planned.

Thirdly, creation of family:

Someone took a shine to William, either spontaneously or over a period of time. Could have components of both of the MOs above. Either opportunistic or planned, random or targeted, depending on how the perpetrator first came into contact with William.

ETA: I think, sadly, the first is most likely.

I agree with reunification of the family. It is also possible someone thought he was family and took him too.
What about financial?
I can think of a couple of scenarios that would involve money as well. Ransom is one that springs to mind. If someone knew who he was they could have thought there was the potential for a decent ransom. None of these are happy ending scenarios unfortunately.

 

[Bohemian]

I agree with reunification of the family. It is also possible someone thought he was family and took him too.
What about financial?
I can think of a couple of scenarios that would involve money as well. Ransom is one that springs to mind. If someone knew who he was they could have thought there was the potential for a decent ransom. None of these are happy ending scenarios unfortunately.

When you say ‘thought he was family’, could you elaborate please, Inspector?

As for financial, a potential ransom could be a possibility after taking into account even the little we know about William’s ‘complicated family history’.

I still think the first motive/MO remains the most likely. As you say, there seems not to be a happy ending in sight for William and his loved ones, let alone those of us who have invested so much hope in his safe return during the long (nearly) four years since his disappearance.

 

[iailwa]

Firstly, a sexual motive:

Someone heard the children talking, laughing, squealing whilst playing earlier that morning or they saw them whilst being in the street. Decided to take a look-see. Maybe had a ‘preference’ for young males. As DCI Jubelin said, ‘Evil met innocence.’ that day. Random, minimal planning, crime of opportunity.

Secondly, reunification of family:

First of all, biological parents have been cleared of any involvement into the investigation of William’s disappearance so either extended family member or friend hatched a plan to take William. Possibly achieved through relationships between known POIs and persons known to the public through MSM, ie; NC, KL, AJ, BS, etc. Maybe stalked the FF through SM or physically. Targeted and planned.

Thirdly, creation of family:

Someone took a shine to William, either spontaneously or over a period of time. Could have components of both of the MOs above. Either opportunistic or planned, random or targeted, depending on how the perpetrator first came into contact with William.

ETA: I think, sadly, the first is most likely.[/QUOTE

Great post Bo. And i agree but can't string it together like that

the 2nd point - 6 degrees of separation, indeed. given the types in this web, something could have gone wrong... including accident or evil

point 3. have thought the same. Maybe someone who knew the family was going north...? The nice dressed man, getting directions, & then the opportunity arose? Or someone else. The problem is, IMO it's hard to hide a child unless you go very very isolated & keep them away from the community, or even more evil situations that i don't even want to mention...

 

[iailwa]

I agree with reunification of the family. It is also possible someone thought he was family and took him too.
What about financial?
I can think of a couple of scenarios that would involve money as well. Ransom is one that springs to mind. If someone knew who he was they could have thought there was the potential for a decent ransom. None of these are happy ending scenarios unfortunately.

So are you thinking along the lines of a con-man, or one of those involved in the 6 degrees of separation thing? (who could also be a con-man/con-person?). Never much thought of a ransom motive, it's pretty rare - but hasn't happened for ages. does that increase it's chances? any statisticians here lol? I'm not sure if it does.

 

[Bohemian]

So are you thinking along the lines of a con-man, or one of those involved in the 6 degrees of separation thing? (who could also be a con-man/con-person?). Never much thought of a ransom motive, it's pretty rare - but hasn't happened for ages. does that increase it's chances? any statisticians here lol? I'm not sure if it does.

BBM.

My two cents FWIW:

The only two child kidnappings for ransom, where they were removed from their homes, that I can remember are the Graham Thorne kidnapping in 1960:

Articles - Australian Police Journal | Australian Police Journal

And of the 12 year old Gold Coast boy, earlier this year:

Police allege boy was 'kidnapped for ransom'

I vaguely remember school children and their teacher(?) being kidnapped or held against their will in Australia (maybe in southern NSW or Victoria in the 70s?) but I think that was more of a siege, with demands made so the persons responsible could escape arrest. I don’t think there was a ransom demand but I’m not sure.

So that’s two, at the most three, child kidnappings that involved a financial motive in 58 years by my reckoning. Not doing the forensic stats but commonsense tells me it seems like a fairly rare occurrence in Australia to me. That doesn’t mean it’s an impossibility or that these types of scenarios won’t become more common in the future, as it has become overseas.

 

[Wexford]

When you say ‘thought he was family’, could you elaborate please, Inspector?

As for financial, a potential ransom could be a possibility after taking into account even the little we know about William’s ‘complicated family history’.

I still think the first motive/MO remains the most likely. As you say, there seems not to be a happy ending in sight for William and his loved ones, let alone those of us who have invested so much hope in his safe return during the long (nearly) four years since his disappearance.

Complicated family history yes. It could be a factor in a ransom. Let's not forget William's celebrity connections.
As for 'thought he was family' I have a few theories. One could be someone who saw him and thought they recognised him. Possibly someone who has lost their own child and he looked similar? Who hasn't lost a loved one and then thought they saw them? Grief can cause many strange reactions. I agree it's unlikely but not unheard of.

 

[Bohemian]

Great post Bo. And i agree but can't string it together like that

the 2nd point - 6 degrees of separation, indeed. given the types in this web, something could have gone wrong... including accident or evil

point 3. have thought the same. Maybe someone who knew the family was going north...? The nice dressed man, getting directions, & then the opportunity arose? Or someone else. The problem is, IMO it's hard to hide a child unless you go very very isolated & keep them away from the community, or even more evil situations that i don't even want to mention...

Yes, an accidental death worries me quite a lot. Better than any alternative though, other than William being safe and well, of course. It would be very difficult to pull off keeping a child hidden for this long unless you had huge financial support and, as you say, were living somewhere incredibly isolated or OS. It has been done but usually by the child’s biological parents and we know, in William’s case at least, this has been ruled out.

 

[Bohemian]

Complicated family history yes. It could be a factor in a ransom. Let's not forget William's celebrity connections.
As for 'thought he was family' I have a few theories. One could be someone who saw him and thought they recognised him. Possibly someone who has lost their own child and he looked similar? Who hasn't lost a loved one and then thought they saw them? Grief can cause many strange reactions. I agree it's unlikely but not unheard of.

Yes, his celebrity connections. Good one, Inspector. I wonder who would have known them as his paternal grandfather and half-uncle haven’t exactly been shouting their relationships to William from the rooftops since he disappeared. If fact, they’ve seemed to want to distance themselves and the only ‘revelations’ we’ve heard are via MSM.

If William was taken to assuage someone’s grief over their own deceased child (or one taken into care by Children’s Services), that would involve some sort of psychological disturbance of some kind not unlike, I suspect, that of the perpetrator of the recent abduction of the young boy sitting in his mother’s car in the driveway of their home in Melbourne. As you say, unlikely but not unheard of.

 

[Bohemian]

Which brings us to ‘means’. How did the perpetrator escape detection? I suppose I’m talking about the cars FM and MSM reported as being in the vicinity. Were they there or not? Would the perpetrator have needed a car to escape, given the extensive searches of the houses in Benaroon Drive and their surrounds (1 sq km) that have been done in the past and recently?

 

[iailwa]

Yes, an accidental death worries me quite a lot. Better than any alternative though, other than William being safe and well, of course. It would be very difficult to pull off keeping a child hidden for this long unless you had huge financial support or, as you say, were living somewhere incredibly isolated. It has been done but usually by the child’s biological parents and we know, in William’s case at least, this has been ruled out.

So true, a better option... living safely with love. Re that last sentence, BBM above, it might be bio parents who do this most - but it's not unheard of with strangers (eek ones - think Eliz Smart, Natasha K, Jaycee Lee D, Begium, Ohio). Doesn't bare thinking about really. I hope nothing so sinister has happened in this situ