Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #48

[katydid23]

His boss would have no say in gaining a warrant, that's up to a Judge.

oh ok, in the US the detectives have to get their bosses to ok submitting warrants to a judge.

 

[mussopossum]

It could be that he thought some evidence would be destroyed (damage to property) - I wonder?

My opinion has always been that PS witnessed something from his position.

For whatever reason IF it may be that Jubelin got wind from a tip-off (Crimestoppers or a local) that PS had either lied or had confided in someone that he did in fact know or see something however refused to admit this to LE.

He doesn't appear to have ever been a suspect (after the initial searches took place) that we know of and I assume that this is why a warrant would not have been obtained? But Jubelin may have had that gut instinct and knowledge he was keeping something and did what he did as believed as he said that he had a lawful reason/right.

 

[SouthAussie]

oh ok, in the US the detectives have to get their bosses to ok submitting warrants to a judge.

They probably do here, as well. But Jubes was the boss. I don't think he would have had to go any further up the chain for permission.

 

[sleepinoz]

They probably do here, as well. But Jubes was the boss. I don't think he would have had to go any further up the chain for permission.

Exactly, if the actual Head of Homicide had to sign every single warrant application, he would get nothing else done. IMO

Just to add, there is a hierarchy within Homicide, Head of Homicide and then about five Chief Inspectors under them. These five have a number of cases under them, GJ was one of those supervising many cases at the time.

 

[SouthAussie]

Thanks. I also read about problems within the team. There's no doubt there's some red tape around all this :0

Here's what I was speaking of, peekinandy. Stemming from a team mate and friend who worked with Jubes on the Bowraville case.
Jubes fought the system in this case ... essentially accusing former investigators of racial bias.


Later, I speak to another detective, Jerry Bowden, who has spent a decade working with Gary on the Bowraville investigation. Jerry says Gary pushes his investigations hard, burning people or the road behind him; always demanding resources that have to be taken from elsewhere. Some of those who’ve worked with him on big investigations now don’t talk to him. And those were great jobs, says Jerry, shaking his head. The sort of thing you build a friendship out of.

Some detectives ask Jerry why he works with Gary. His answer is that the things that enrage him, like Gary’s relentless determination, are the same things he respects. The two of them, says Jerry, have sat with the Bowraville families and talked about their children. They’ve felt the grief rising up in the room and threatening to overwhelm them. Working with Gary is the best way to get these murders solved.

Gary is a policeman, a part of the justice system, and yet he seems to see himself outside it. “So in terms of who are we fighting with, it’s a system,” he says.

NoCookies | The Australian
The fight of his life
Dan Box - June 29, 2019

 

[mussopossum]

IMO the circumstances are of a serious nature, PS was losing his memory/mind.

Another really good point.

Never thought of this.

 

[SouthAussie]

I hope he also talks about this incident in his book.

Perhaps once the active investigation into William's disappearance is over, Jubes will have Dan Box sit with him and write about it.

If you ever have the chance to read Bowraville by Dan Box, I highly recommend it. Jubes allowed Dan access to lots of material from the dusty case box - and inspired Dan to go on and write the story.

Another thing that likely got under the skin of some people in the police force. imo
Interestingly, Bowraville by Dan Box was released a month after Jubes resigned.

Journalist Dan Box learnt about this case from Gary Jubelin, a homicide detective who had worked it. He was shocked by the way this story had faded into obscurity.
Review: Bowraville by Dan Box · Readings.com.au

 

[peekinandy]

Is it unusual, for a witness to hire both a lawyer and an attorney? Just curious...

 

[JLZ]

Perhaps once the active investigation into William's disappearance is over, Jubes will have Dan Box sit with him and write about it.

If you ever have the chance to read Bowraville by Dan Box, I highly recommend it. Jubes allowed Dan access to lots of material from the dusty case box - and inspired Dan to go on and write the story.

Another thing that likely got under the skin of some people in the police force. imo
Interestingly, Bowraville by Dan Box was released a month after Jubes resigned.

Journalist Dan Box learnt about this case from Gary Jubelin, a homicide detective who had worked it. He was shocked by the way this story had faded into obscurity.
Review: Bowraville by Dan Box · Readings.com.au

Having read it I formed the opinion that Jubelin's pugilistic approach is problematic.

 

[SouthAussie]

Having read it I formed the opinion that Jubelin's pugilistic approach is problematic.

Problematic to whom? Other police officers? Criminals? Defence attorneys? Yourself?

He certainly is appreciated by the victims, and had good success with politicians and in court.

As well, I found his manner with 'witnesses' very empathetic and patient - as evidenced in his walkthrough with Margaret Spedding.

 

[sleepinoz]

Is it unusual, for a witness to hire both a lawyer and an attorney? Just curious...

A lawyer and an attorney are basically the same thing. A lawyer and a Barrister is another thing, and yes it is usual.

 

[JLZ]

Problematic to whom? Other police officers? Criminals? Yourself?

He certainly is appreciated by the victims, and had good success with politicians and in court.

Yes, to me, I suppose, and it wouldn't surprise me if those to whom he was answerable had a problem with it. And to himself as well. His dedication and hard work are admirable especially as contrasted with the neglect the Bowraville victims had previously experienced. I think there's a point where one has to walk away; it's probably not as early as six months as the present administration are saying, but it's before you resort to building a case from the evidence of obvious liars. That's my take on the four prisoner witnesses in Bowraville; and I suspect something similar was happening at one time with Savage: That he was being given the message that he had to say he saw something, or he was in the frame himself.

 

[JLZ]

A lawyer and an attorney are basically the same thing. A lawyer and a Barrister is another thing, and yes it is usual.

Another point: you can't hire a barrister directly. You need to go through a solicitor. Some solicitors will do court work themselves, if they're competent in the area and available. But barristers are specialists in court work. So retaining a solicitor and a barrister is something like having a GP and a medical specialist.

 

[SouthAussie]

Yes, to me, I suppose, and it wouldn't surprise me if those to whom he was answerable had a problem with it. And to himself as well. His dedication and hard work are admirable especially as contrasted with the neglect the Bowraville victims had previously experienced. I think there's a point where one has to walk away; it's probably not as early as six months as the present administration are saying, but it's before you resort to building a case from the evidence of obvious liars. That's my take on the four prisoner witnesses in Bowraville; and I suspect something similar was happening at one time with Savage: That he was being given the message that he had to say he saw something, or he was in the frame himself.

The things that I admire about Jubes are the things that I admired about my father - who always said that it doesn't matter if people don't like you, do the best job that you can, stay true to your heart, do what you feel is right, and never give up.

I feel that Jubes lives his life that way. And has done immeasurable good, due to that.

I also don't feel that Jubes builds evidence from liars. I think he can spot a liar a mile away. And knows that in things a good liar says are pieces of truth.
And I think that he feels that Savage is a liar. imo

 

[mussopossum]

Perhaps once the active investigation into William's disappearance is over, Jubes will have Dan Box sit with him and write about it.

If you ever have the chance to read Bowraville by Dan Box, I highly recommend it. Jubes allowed Dan access to lots of material from the dusty case box - and inspired Dan to go on and write the story.

Another thing that likely got under the skin of some people in the police force. imo
Interestingly, Bowraville by Dan Box was released a month after Jubes resigned.

Journalist Dan Box learnt about this case from Gary Jubelin, a homicide detective who had worked it. He was shocked by the way this story had faded into obscurity.
Review: Bowraville by Dan Box · Readings.com.au

THanks SA! Did not realise this was out already.

This case will always be one to remember for me.

During high school 1991 we had an excursion to the local police station which held the forensic unit.

A small exhibit of human bones (what was left) lay in a secured protected casing in the police unit.

I will always remember the writing on that card within the case.

Clinton Speedy Duroux.

While everyone either left the building or threw up in the bins or outside after seeing the wall of crime photos I was the one left asking a million questions and scenarios to the poor detectives.

And here started my interest in true crime.

I will definitely head out and buy this thanks SA

 

[peekinandy]

A lawyer and an attorney are basically the same thing. A lawyer and a Barrister is another thing, and yes it is usual.

Bummer, I meant just that - a lawyer & a barrister. My mistake. I read in one MSM article that PS was not called as a witness (whether that's true IDK), but several witnesses were called about his actions/testimony etc. Why has GJ been so interested in PS? Likely already discussed I gather - but he must have his reasons

 

[JLZ]

Bummer, I meant just that - a lawyer & a barrister. My mistake. I read in one MSM article that PS was not called as a witness (whether that's true IDK), but several witnesses were called about his actions/testimony etc. Why has GJ been so interested in PS? Likely already discussed I gather - but he must have his reasons

PS was an inquest witness. He's of interest (to me) because of his location as a near neighbour, his behaviour on the day of the disappearance, and his self-contradictory testimony.

 

[sleepinoz]

Bummer, I meant just that - a lawyer & a barrister. My mistake. I read in one MSM article that PS was not called as a witness (whether that's true IDK), but several witnesses were called about his actions/testimony etc. Why has GJ been so interested in PS? Likely already discussed I gather - but he must have his reasons

IMO it's not just GJ that was interested in PS, almost every witness was asked about him in the early part of the Inquest. There has to be more to PS and his evidence.

 

[peekinandy]

Not allowed...

 

[interested64]

If Jubes was having issues with his boss, it's possible he didn't think the warrant would be approved. Maybe he thought it was urgent to get the info, and deal with the backlash later.

And maybe that was a poor decision, looking back on it?

I think the same way,i think he was so dedicated and on to something he couldnt let it go,and good for him to..i can imagine he can get impatient if held back imo i know i can..and in ps case it would be doing my head in as it has just reading all the things he cant remember when its crucial