Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #50

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  • #261
I don't think it reported when his car was dusted, did it?

Could it have been initially after William went missing in 2014? and he has continued to complain about it along with the other things he was complaining about later mentioned in the article?
o
It seems that PS's vehicle was taken not just for fingerprinting but for 'forensic examination', but not until years later, since the reporting says the vehicle was returned in December 2018. I doubt if police had his vehicle in their custody for four years. That suggests (to me) that none of the neighbours' vehicles had been forensically examined at the time? The fact that police returned the vehicle to PS indicates that nothing was found of W, else they would have kept it as evidence. I believe that even after years, they'd still be able to find something of him in a vehicle during a forensic examination (which is why LE likely bothered to take his vehicle for examination so many years later). imo.

Also, maybe it's just me, but if someone had kidnapped and done something with a neighbour's grandchild in a high profile case and they had their vehicle taken for forensic examination, I don't think they'd be calling to complain about fingerprint dust being left in the vehicle, I'm thinking they would just want to detach themselves as much as possible from the case, period. On the other hand, if a neighbour/person had nothing to do with it and police seized their vehicle years later and then returned it a mess, I think it would be normal to complain. jmo.

In May, 2018, Jubelin used his phone to record two further conversations with Mr Savage at his house.

“It’s the prosecution case that was not a surveillance device that was authorised under the warrant to record that private conversation,” Mr Hogan said.

Then in December that year, Jubelin recorded another conversation with Mr Savage after the 75-year-old called him to complain about the state police had returned his car in.

The car had been seized for forensic examination and there was fingerprint dust left on it.

Jubelin was on leave but went around to his house anyway.


We’re for Sydney | Daily Telegraph
That fingerprint stuff does not come off!!!

I wouldn’t be calling police either! But who knows... maybe he knows he didn’t touch the car for a week.

Might explain his indifference on questioning in the inquest if they have been filming him and testing his car etc.
 
  • #262
I'd like to know if they expected him to be confiding in (or receiving confidences from) anyone in particular. In 2017. Who?
Or threats?
 
  • #263
IMO it was to see his reaction. The camera's would have picked up his response, surprised, shocked, worried or just dumbfounded.

If he hadn't of reported it there would be a problem.
If he has been covering for someone all along I guess you would expect him to grab it and dispose of it in some way.
 
  • #264
Yes, me too. But what were they thinking - from 2017 when the loud radio was interfering with their surveillance until 2019 when the inquest questioning occurred surrounding whether the music was loud on the day W disappeared?
To see if it was a habit maybe? Or only something new he has taken up (suspecting his house is bugged)? I have to say, it isn't that uncommon for a chap his age to listen loudly to talkback. My FIL does it. Jones and Hadley for all the world to hear (even if they don't want to).
 
  • #265
It seems that PS's vehicle was taken not just for fingerprinting but for 'forensic examination', but not until years later, since the reporting says the vehicle was returned in December 2018. I doubt if police had his vehicle in their custody for four years. That suggests (to me) that none of the neighbours' vehicles had been forensically examined at the time? The fact that police returned the vehicle to PS indicates that nothing was found of W, else they would have kept it as evidence. I believe that even after years, they'd still be able to find something of him in a vehicle during a forensic examination (which is why LE likely bothered to take his vehicle for examination so many years later). imo.

Also, maybe it's just me, but if someone had kidnapped and done something with a neighbour's grandchild in a high profile case and they had their vehicle taken for forensic examination, I don't think they'd be calling to complain about fingerprint dust being left in the vehicle, I'm thinking they would just want to detach themselves as much as possible from the case, period. On the other hand, if a neighbour/person had nothing to do with it and police seized their vehicle years later and then returned it a mess, I think it would be normal to complain. jmo.

In May, 2018, Jubelin used his phone to record two further conversations with Mr Savage at his house.

“It’s the prosecution case that was not a surveillance device that was authorised under the warrant to record that private conversation,” Mr Hogan said.

Then in December that year, Jubelin recorded another conversation with Mr Savage after the 75-year-old called him to complain about the state police had returned his car in.

The car had been seized for forensic examination and there was fingerprint dust left on it.

Jubelin was on leave but went around to his house anyway.


We’re for Sydney | Daily Telegraph
The lack of forensic evidence must be incredibly frustrating for police.

If William was placed inside something (horrible thought) and then placed in the car would there be any evidence to find?

I believe there was no forensic evidence found in Cowan's car that linked him to Daniel Morcombe, going off memory so an IMO for now, will try to find links later.

It seems possible to me that evidence is not always left behind.
 
  • #266
I still want to know why PS became a POI in 2017 after seemingly being totally under the radar until then.
Did one of his cars resemble a car Chapman saw?
Was there something specific, did someone new join the investigation team and they reviewed everything?
I wonder how much pressure has been put on PS behind the scenes, it seems a bit half hearted to me, he doesnt appear very fazed by it.
 
  • #267
o

That fingerprint stuff does not come off!!!

I wouldn’t be calling police either! But who knows... maybe he knows he didn’t touch the car for a week.

Might explain his indifference on questioning in the inquest if they have been filming him and testing his car etc.
It wouldn't matter if PS had touched his own car for a week? They would've been looking for forensic evidence of W in his car. Nothing was obviously found or the car wouldn't have been returned. If PS 'did it', how did he get W hidden so quickly and without a car? PS had company that same day and it was reported that the K9s found no scent in the area.
 
  • #268
Lia Harris
@LiaJHarris
Former detective Gary Jubelin’s criminal hearing has resumed this morning, with Detective Sergeant Laura Beacroft testifying. She worked on the William Tyrrell strike force with Jubelin. The Crown is also showing the video recorded police interview with Paul Savage.
 
  • #269
The lack of forensic evidence must be incredibly frustrating for police.

If William was placed inside something (horrible thought) and then placed in the car would there be any evidence to find?

I believe there was no forensic evidence found in Cowan's car that linked him to Daniel Morcombe, going off memory so an IMO for now, will try to find links later.

It seems possible to me that evidence is not always left behind.
There was indeed forensic evidence found in Cowan's car, however LE did not find it because they did not bother to 'examine' it until 8 years later.

DNA samples taken from the car belonging to Daniel Morcombe's killer were not examined for eight years, a coronial inquest into the schoolboy's disappearance has heard.

Inspector Darren Pobar, a forensics expert with the Queensland Police told the inquest fingerprint, blood and hair samples were taken from Brett Peter Cowan's car in 2003, but were not examined until 2011.

When asked why DNA testing was not done on the hair found in the car, Inspector Pobar said technology at the time was laborious and often yielded little results.

Daniel Morcombe murder evidence ignored for eight years, inquest hears

 
  • #270
  • #271
Savage tells Jubelin he heard William and his sister playing but didn’t see them. Jubelin tells him “only three adults heard the kids playing... and one of the kids you hear playing disappeared”.
Lia Harris on Twitter
 
  • #272
It wouldn't matter if PS had touched his own car for a week? They would've been looking for forensic evidence of W in his car. Nothing was obviously found or the car wouldn't have been returned. If PS 'did it', how did he get W hidden so quickly and without a car? PS had company that same day and it was reported that the K9s found no scent in the area.
Fingerprints though? If that is accurate reporting...why would they be fingerprinting the car? For William's fingerprints? Unlikely. Or someone elses? Presumably PS and HS's fingerprints would be there anyway.
 
  • #273
  • #274
  • #275
  • #276
One of PS's video interview with GJ went for 4 hrs ( 16/8/2017 ) . Wonder if they will play the whole thing?? If so it will take up most of the day ............
 
  • #277
There was indeed forensic evidence found in Cowan's car, however LE did not find it because they did not bother to 'examine' it until 8 years later.

DNA samples taken from the car belonging to Daniel Morcombe's killer were not examined for eight years, a coronial inquest into the schoolboy's disappearance has heard.

Inspector Darren Pobar, a forensics expert with the Queensland Police told the inquest fingerprint, blood and hair samples were taken from Brett Peter Cowan's car in 2003, but were not examined until 2011.

When asked why DNA testing was not done on the hair found in the car, Inspector Pobar said technology at the time was laborious and often yielded little results.

Daniel Morcombe murder evidence ignored for eight years, inquest hears
My understanding is that when testing took place years down the track nothing was found.
https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/na...ce-on-alleged-killers-car-20140213-32n5j.html
I was comparing cases because PS car wasn't tested for several years either and I feel like there's no guarantee evidence would still be there after such a long period.
 
  • #278
Lia Harris

The Crown is now questioning Detective Sergeant Laura Beacroft about the local postal worker. He asks her about an AVO taken out by her against Paul Savage. We previously reported these details on
@10NewsFirst
back in September.

The court heard Savage breached the AVO by wishing the woman a happy birthday when he was not supposed to be approaching her. The court is now being shown the recorded interview where Jubelin questions Savage about this. He describes it as “stalking”.

Jubelin tells Savage the postal worker reported on one occasion Savage “approached her vehicle and took hold of her arm, saying I want to spend more time with you” and said he was crying and shaking at the time. Savage denies it, but claims she was in love with him.

Jubelin accuses him of being “delusional”.

https://twitter.com/LiaJHarris
Jubelin puts to him that on two occasions he visited the Kendall Post Office “crying and shaking” and asking for the woman. Jubelin says others witnessed it and heard Savage say “we can be together”. He was married at the time.

Mr Savage admits to breaching the AVO by approaching her to say happy birthday. He tells Jubelin “I knew it was her birthday because it was on the AVO when her birthday was”.

Lia Harris on Twitter
 
  • #279
Lia Harris
@LiaJHarris

·
36s
Jubelin asks Savage during the interview “if you can’t tell the truth to this... how do I know you’re telling the truth about William Tyrrell?”
 
  • #280
In regard to Jubelin's idea of planting the Spiderman costume along the regular path that PS walked every day - this is what I'm wondering, as far as the strategy behind it: I wonder if GJ noticed that PS's memory had been failing somewhat and he was forgetting details, etc. So he thought maybe if they planted the costume there, PS (if he had been the one to have done something to W) might forget what he'd done with the costume, see it there, and think, 'OMG, I forgot to dispose of it, I'd better grab it and burn it!'

Crown prosecutor Philip Hogan said police placed a Spider-Man suit similar to the one William was wearing onto a bush track on July 26, 2017.

The track was frequented by Paul Savage, who had become a person of interest in the case four months earlier. Mr Savage lived on Benaroon Drive in Kendall, the street William vanished from, and was at home on the morning the child disappeared.

Mr Hogan said cameras filmed and photographed Mr Savage, 75, who reported the clothing to police the next day.


https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw...t-in-bushland-court-told-20200204-p53xlj.html
---
Jubelin had come up with the idea of placing the Spider-Man suit in the bush, she said.

No Cookies | The Cairns Post
or maybe, if he was guilty and forgetful, prompt him to check a gravesite?
 
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