Autistic boy banned from Minn. church

[Glow]

Thanks Bham and Xcom,

I really appreciate your insights here.

 

[BhamMama]

These are not to be confused with simple bad behavior, which autistic children are quite capable of doing as well. The trick as a parent is to recognize the difference and deal with the situation accordingly.

He's thirteen. He just hit puberty.

Very correct! They are children after all.

And boy howdy does the puberty throw you both for a loop! I had NO idea it would be so different. It opened up whole new doors of behaviors and discipline avenues. Not to mention self esteem issues and attitudes towards the opposite sex that are all new for him and us as well. Somedays I feel like he's the same old kid, then he opens his mouth and I'm struck by the thougt that I'm not raising a kid any longer, but will be in charge of a full grown adult before I know it.

Makes all the other problems seem small when I look back now lol

 

[Lola]

Agree squaddie, Ms. Race should wake up and face reality. Her 13 year old is physically bigger than some men.

 

[SweetPea2]

shortened for space:

It could be that it's profound, or it could be that the parents think that their disabled child should be tolerated by everyone.

Re: the weight issue. Why don't they have that child in a weighted vest or have him use a weighted blanket? Common for people with sensory issues and it sounds like they understand he likes weight and it helps.

I feel that the parents are being a bit selfish personally. They are making every person there deal with their kids problems. So much so that others have def noticed and tried to meet her half way. They wanted a solution way before they banned him. It's the parents responsiblity to make sure their child is not disruptive, not the other way around. I know that not everyone wants, or feels able, to deal with my son. Why would they want to put him, or others, in that position? So they can go to Church?

They need to either listen to the Bible on tape, watch a taped version of the service, prepare their son better, watch him much closer and do what's right for him, not what they want to do just because they can.

Perfect response! I totally agree!:clap::clap::clap::clap:

 

[southcitymom]

It could be that it's profound, or it could be that the parents think that their disabled child should be tolerated by everyone.

Autism manifests itself in many ways, profound or not. Outbursts are common with any degree of autism. Sort of over stimulated.

I'll venture that a parent who educates themselves, not only on autism, but the child's emotional well being, their triggers and learn about how to stem a storm quickly would def get a different reaction from their child than one who just thinks they should let them do whatever.

My son is held to the same set of rules his siblings are. He's not stupid by any stretch. We do disipline different with him but when we discipline is not really an issue. He hits, screams, throws things, stomps his feet and calls names. His punishment is the same as if anyone else in the household does those things in that the first thing we do is remove him from the situation. He is made to sit in a room by himself and calm down. THEN we talk about the bad behavior and what he can do next time. He also has to tell someone he's sorry if he's done something to physically, or emotionally hurt them. Of course we do other things but he has a set standard and he's not allowed to continue to disrupt the whole household when there are ways to fix the problem.

If he does these things out in public, we leave, right then. If he calms down and we prepare him better next time, we might try again at another time.

Re: the weight issue. Why don't they have that child in a weighted vest or have him use a weighted blanket? Common for people with sensory issues and it sounds like they understand he likes weight and it helps.

I feel that the parents are being a bit selfish personally. They are making every person there deal with their kids problems. So much so that others have def noticed and tried to meet her half way. They wanted a solution way before they banned him. It's the parents responsiblity to make sure their child is not disruptive, not the other way around. I know that not everyone wants, or feels able, to deal with my son. Why would they want to put him, or others, in that position? So they can go to Church?

They need to either listen to the Bible on tape, watch a taped version of the service, prepare their son better, watch him much closer and do what's right for him, not what they want to do just because they can.

Thanks for checking in, Bham. Great post. I completely agree that children with issues like autism or ADD or ADHD, etc... still need firm loving discipline just the same as every child. I understand that it can be exhausting to deal with a special needs child and I do think some parents just kind of give up.

 

[kgeaux]

I am sorry, I have friends with autistic kids, but if one is this disruptive and you cannot control him/her you have no right to force that behavior on other people. It's not like a small tic or speaking very loudly, this is way beyond that.

One dear friend of mine has a 16 year old autistic son. He is 6'6" and weighs in at right at 300 #s. My friend is a single parent, 5'1" and 90#s soaking wet. Sonny is a dear boy, but when he acts impulsively he is a menace! He once ran out of his home in his underwear right into traffic! He wasn't the bit phazed but Mom was a basket case. He also once left school, saying he wanted McDonald's. The school had to call police, and the patrol car caught up with him about a mile away. He's been known to rush through restaurants, knocking people out of his way because he's so excited to get to the dessert bar.

My friend is desperate to keep her child home with her, but he is so BIG. He never, never acts with the intention to hurt, but he does hurt her and others sometimes.

I don't know if I like the idea of a church banning a child in need........and we ALL have spiritual needs, autistic or not! But I understand their frustration.

 

[bigbuck]

Great post Xcom, as many of you know I have a 5 year old son on the spectrum. As a parent you learn very quickly what and where to avoid. We stopped attending church due to the stress put on my son and others. Movies and most resturants are also pretty much out of the question.

We have found many places and events sponsored by local autism groups where my son can be himself and we are welcome. For the Races to think others should have to be subjected to their childs meltdowns just because he's disabled is foolish.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

First, I can say that my grandson who is only 5 yo attends children's church regularly. They are aware of his situation and are learning to work with him. They certainly did not turn him away. It is about education for those around him and they are eager to learn. He still talks about Bible School he attended last year! Loved it! However, we are smart enough to know he isn't going to sit through a sermon!

What concerns me most is the child in the midst of this controversy isn't getting everything he needs from homeschooling. While I am sure the mother and father feel they are doing everything they can, I hope they have checked into a school to help with his care and his behaviors. It sounds as if they need to educate themselves on ways to help their son and learn cues etc. The weight jackets, headphones, music, and other ways to calm an overstimulated autistic child should be available in such circumstances.

The people who left their car running in a parking area with children around are being irresponsible. This could happen with any child and not only one with autism. I do think the parents were remiss in not knowing where there son was every given minute tho. He should never have been behind the wheel of any vehicle. Again, it goes back to the parents' intervention and learning ways to help him. Discipline is important, but you have to be able to distinguish what is autistic behavior and what is simply bad behavior. The child getting behind the wheel of a car is simply bad behavior and the parents are responsible.

If the child has a problem with incontinence, he should be wearing protective clothing (ie. diapers etc) in an order not to subject others to his accidents. I can understand the church not wanting to regularly clean up after such accidents when they can be prevented. It isn't comfortable for the child either and should be addressed.

I am curious to know how their son acted at the other church service. Were there obvious problems there, too? Are they doing their son a disservice by throwing him into situations where he is being terribly overstimulated? If they are expecting him to act more appropriately in group situations...where is he getting this training?

I know with my grandson, school opened up a new world for him by exposing him to group situations. He has come a long way in coping, learning certain good behaviors, and adjusting to life outside the home.

I will be interested to follow this case.

 

[curious1]

So far those on WS with autistic kids seem to be doing a pretty good job. You are aware of not only the needs of your children, but their limitations as well and are considerate not only for the feelings of others, but your children as well. You seem to have taken the time to figure out what works and what does not for your child and are not content to just throw them into a situation just because it suits you and/or it's someplace you want to go. Kudos to you all. One of my friends with a child who has severe tourettes recently told me that it is hard, but you just have to accept there are some places you just cannot or should not take your kid.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

There are places you should not take normal children, too! I think it is a matter of common sense on the part of the parents.

Most churches have programs designed for children and should take into account those with special needs.

 

[Taximom]

We didn't go to church (or some other places) for 4 yrs as a family because of our dd. Geez, she was only 3 and up at the time and was a major disruption for them and us.

We took turns attending church w/our other children so they wouldn't miss out, and we had our own church at home so she could learn about Jesus too.

Today's churches usually offer many alternatives to sitting in church. Tapes, DVD's, even online video. Sometimes we would go during a slow service and sit in the crying/baby room with her because they had video of the service in there. Besides her maturing a bit, she was also helped w/meds that calmed her down enough to where she could sit (and not like a zombie!) still for a little bit. Now we are able to go and she sits there better than the others half the time!

To this day, we still plan our movements with her.

I don't know why people would want to put themselves through this! I know when we tried, it wasn't worth it because we were wrestling her the whole hour and NOT hearing a thing at church.

On another note, I have 2 acquaintances w/autistic children and they are hyper-autisic-rights people. Sorry, but that's my term for it. Everyone should bend at their child's knee. These people go overboard, IMO, but it's what drives them and I don't get it. I'm thinking these parents in this article might be like that....

 

[crypto6]

I have a son with Autism. I pick my battles with him. Unfortunately I wouldn't bring him to church if he acted this way we would find an alternative. I don't understand how this child was able to start up two cars and rev the engines. How did he get the car keys? Where was his parents? I don't allow my son to leave my site when we are in public. When he starts to get rowdy we come home. It really is that simple.

Excellent approach to a difficult problem.

I'm wondering if there isn't a lot more to the young man's behavioral difficulties than autism alone. The mom sounds either clueless or crafting a lawsuit. The suit will work better if it looks like the church is denying entrance to someone with autism, rather than a disorder involving escalating violent behavior.

Crypto6

 

[bigbuck]

There are places you should not take normal children, too! I think it is a matter of common sense on the part of the parents.

Most churches have programs designed for children and should take into account those with special needs.

Agreed SS, unfortunatley even the kids room at our church was too much for Marco. Now that he has a year of preschool under his belt we are thinking of trying again. He's made great strides socially and we now enjoy meals at play place and hometown buffet without incident!

:woohoo:

 

[SeriouslySearching]

While I am not into Hyper-rights for our children, I don't find it unreasonable to try and find a church with a children's program. Expecting them to sit through a sermon is a different story altogether tho.

The churches I have attended in the past did not tolerate screaming children, disruptive behavior, and other situations which would interfere with being able to conduct a service nor would I expect them to!

 

[curious1]

Good for you guys bigbuck. :woohoo: Meals out in public with a more than mildly autistic child is no small feat.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Agreed SS, unfortunatley even the kids room at our church was too much for Marco. Now that he has a year of preschool under his belt we are thinking of trying again. He's made great strides socially and we now enjoy meals at play place and hometown buffet without incident!

:woohoo:

We can take M out to certain places to eat, but have to avoid places like McDonalds. The overstimulation is still too much for him. He does much better at a steakhouse with soothing music. It works out very well for us! LOL

 

[Details]

I'm sure she didn't hear a word of complaint or problems until the church showed up at her house - but I doubt that's because there wasn't one. I think it's because she just does not want to hear it. Hyper autism rights sounds about right - there are hyper children's rights people too - the whole world should intimately understand and care for my child's needs, even when they are special, even when they involve inconveniencing a ton of other people, no matter how outrageous.

Reasonable accomodation is one thing - but this child gets into cars and starts them, has issues that can lead to seriously hurting people. The parents need to understand that if their child, for any reason, cannot behave to a reasonable degree in public, and if they cannot be right there by him at all times preventing any outbursts from hurting anyone - he cannot be at that place in public. That's all there is to it.

 

[Taximom]

SS, I think it would be hard to find a church with any children's program that he would be interested in. He's 13 and usually at that age the kids are talking about teen issues and not playing with playdough etc. Maybe he would do well in a younger class but it sounds like he would be a distraction there too.

And no, you are not one of my 2 "hyper-autistic-rights" acquaintances! LOL

 

[SeriouslySearching]

True, he is 13 yo and wouldn't fit into a smaller children's setting...but they do have groups for the older kids which he might take an interest in. My point was they should not be taking him to actual Liturgy and expect him to be accepted with open arms by the congregation. It is unrealistic.

Whew! Thanks! I didn't want to be considered one of "those". LOL

 

[pixies]

I think Carol Race is about to start one heck of a lawsuit against the church. She is failing to look at the issues other then the fact her rights are being voilated & she is the one being banned.

I missed the age of the boy but as a parent if some young guy grabbed my daughter and pulled her onto his lap there would be major issues regardless of everything else.

This kid has little control over himself and his parents have little control over him as well...if he harms a smaller child can you imagine the drama that would fall on this church for allowing this kids to attend and it does sound like he is completely out of control.

If the parents would like to attend church they should find another church or a sitter for the boy. Yeah, it seems unfair but no one can take a chance on him harming someone else.