AZ AZ - Allison Feldman, 31, Scottsdale, 18 Feb 2015 #2

[MissD]

I keep thinking though, about the DNA.........even if LE obtained it from under her fingernails..........they still have to have the perp to be able to compare it to. Even if they enter the DNA results into some type of criminal DNA database, if the perp has no criminal history and has no DNA on file in that system, they'd not get a match. So DNA is only good/helpful if you have a potential perp to match it to. So the fact that it's been some time now since they obtained DNA and no arrest has been made, it makes me wonder if they have no match and therefore no clue who did this. But something I DO wonder. Say they have a possible suspect in mind but not enough evidence to obtain whatever legal documentation they'd require (warrant?) to require that individual to submit DNA.............could that be what's causing the delay? What if LE has someone in mind and has met with this person who was initially cooperative but when LE asked him for a DNA sample he got a lawyer who advised him that it was his right to refuse and then it all just stopped right there?

I don't think it all just stopped right there, Dayzee. Because this is such a very high profile case LE has to do everything strictly by the book. They say they don't want to jeopardize the investigation but I think the real truth is they don't want to jeopardize the conviction.

They want a slam, dunk! And I think they'll get it!

 

[MissD]

Yes, they physical evidence, but in just a little over two months? I'd be very surprised to learn they a profile of the DNA.

ETA: It won't be long before a facial reconstruction can be rendered from a DNA profile.

They say they have it, Bessie.

<snipped>

"Police say they have a DNA profile of her attacker, and that the attacker likely left her home around 1 a.m. on February 18th."

http://www.fox10phoenix.com/story/28794082/2015/04/14/new-details-in-the-allison-feldman-murder-case

They will have facial reconstruction from DNA in the near future? WOW! Won't that be a breakthrough!

 

[MissD]

Yes they can.....and even way more than that.

Oh they can? Thanks! I didn't know that. I actually don't know much about DNA. I'm learning more about it from this case.

Thanks for letting me know!

 

[Luvrosco]

Mm

LE could try to obtain a surreptitious sample from something like a discarded cigarette butt or water bottle. If the DNA profile from the saliva matches the profile from the crime scene, that's sufficient probable cause to obtain a warrant to collect a "proper" sample. But that's just one possibility. Hopefully, LE has their hands on enough additional evidence to put together a case, IF there is a known suspect. But it all takes time. Chances are they don't even have the lab results back on the DNA yet.

That's what I think,Bessie. I hadn't even thought that they might not have the results back yet. That puts everything in a different light. It just might be a matter of time now.

 

[cluciano63]

OT it was determined that the serial killer in Louisiana, Derrick Todd Lee, was eventually found due to a new (at the time) DNA test for race, showing the killer was likely black. LE had been assuming the killer was white simply due to statistics of past serial killers. So, yes, they can determine race if the tests are done.

I can't imagine a DNA profile taking two months anymore, in a murder case. It should only take a few days, unless it is sitting at the end of a very long line of samples, which seems unlikely to me in this case. I know of cases where it was completed and run through CODIS for a hit, within three days (Chelsea King, for one.) So it baffles me that LE has not cleared the BF. Also, LE cannot tell for sure they have a usable profile until tests have been run. So it would be premature for them to state they could match it, if if has not been tested. Jmo

 

[Pacific2011]

I keep thinking though, about the DNA.........even if LE obtained it from under her fingernails..........they still have to have the perp to be able to compare it to. Even if they enter the DNA results into some type of criminal DNA database, if the perp has no criminal history and has no DNA on file in that system, they'd not get a match. So DNA is only good/helpful if you have a potential perp to match it to. So the fact that it's been some time now since they obtained DNA and no arrest has been made, it makes me wonder if they have no match and therefore no clue who did this. But something I DO wonder. Say they have a possible suspect in mind but not enough evidence to obtain whatever legal documentation they'd require (warrant?) to require that individual to submit DNA.............could that be what's causing the delay? What if LE has someone in mind and has met with this person who was initially cooperative but when LE asked him for a DNA sample he got a lawyer who advised him that it was his right to refuse and then it all just stopped right there?

BBM.

IIRC, LE has stated that Alison's killer, although not normally violent, could become "violent when confronted" -- or words to that effect. Perhaps the person "they have in mind" became violent when confronted by LE as they asked for a sample of his DNA. JMO.

 

[OldSteve]

I can outshoot my guy! And he was an officer in the Navy.

I'm also a better sailor than he is.

(I am a pistol packing mama! Like they say: I'd rather have a gun and not need it than need a gun and not have one!)

Good going! After I mentioned guns, and left the web, I realized that since there was no sign of forced entry, if she had a gun, she might not had a chance to get to it...

I'm still sticking with my

the killer is someone local, who has taken notice and targets the the victim... Also, some cases where a victim has had recent dealings with the killer who notices she lives alone, and then days (weeks) later decides to visit her at night thinking he can get lucky.

but, feel free to disagree. Only wish we knew more...

 

[Bernina]

Yes, they have physical evidence, but in just a little over two months? I'd be very surprised to learn they a profile of the DNA.

ETA: http://snapshot.parabon-nanolabs.com/

I posted a link way back for processing DNA. It takes 60 hours, start to finish. With the Adrienne Salinas case, Az DPS was able to identify her body within 3 days with her "known" DNA and that of her body. (Tempe PD handed it off to them). Then there's whatever backlog the lab has.....and a previous post stated SPD passed it on to another lab.
I think SPD HAD a DNA profile weeks before they made it public, they just didn't have a match with anyone they got samples from, or anything from known data bases.
If the BF was cooperating, as SPD stated, he should have been eliminated already. They also had a POI from AF's "past", and you'd think they'd have either a surreptitious sample or asked him point blank to volunteer a swab.
Arizona collects DNA from all felony "arrests". You don't have to be convicted, just arrested.
If the perp is a criminal, he's good, he's a "ghost". He's never been added to any data base for an Arizona felony arrest, or any other State for an arrest/felony. Maybe a "cold case" but you'd think if one was entered in to the system, it would have flagged.
Maybe the issue of scratches on the hands came about because the perp may have left part of a fingernail that was excluded from AF? So the assumption is he wasn't wearing gloves or one was pulled off during the struggle?

 

[Luvrosco]

[/B] BBM.

IIRC, LE has stated that Alison's killer, although not normally violent, could become "violent when confronted" -- or words to that effect. Perhaps the person "they have in mind" became violent when confronted by LE as they asked for a sample of his DNA. JMO.

This statement has always sounded odd to me. How do they know that he could become violent when confronted? You might be right. Did someone they spoke to become agitated? Hmmm

 

[nancydrew71]

Good going! After I mentioned guns, as was off the web, I realized that since there was no sign of forced entry, if she had a gun, she might not had a chance to get to it...

I'm still sticking with my


but, feel free to disagree. Only wish we knew more...

I'm sticking with that quote you put in too, Steve. If they get a snapshot, I hope it will be a slam dunk.

 

[nancydrew71]

This statement has always sounded odd to me. How do they know that he could become violent when confronted? You might be right. Did someone they spoke to become agitated? Hmmm

I know that is weird. I can't figure that out either.

 

[OldSteve]

[/B] BBM.

IIRC, LE has stated that Alison's killer, although not normally violent, could become "violent when confronted" -- or words to that effect. Perhaps the person "they have in mind" became violent when confronted by LE as they asked for a sample of his DNA. JMO.

My take on that (not that it means much) was that they figured this out from something to do with the crime scene; may have appeared she let someone in, they had drinks or coffee as evident by two classes, and then the violent attack took place later when she resisted his advances..

 

[Bernina]

[/B] BBM.

IIRC, LE has stated that Alison's killer, although not normally violent, could become "violent when confronted" -- or words to that effect. Perhaps the person "they have in mind" became violent when confronted by LE as they asked for a sample of his DNA. JMO.

This is where my whole "cat burglar" theory comes in. They enter the home while people are sleeping. The whole idea is to get in and get out without the occupants knowing they're there. They will take credit cards because the victim won't know they're gone for usually 24 hours, usually longer, and then the victim will wonder if they just misplaced them. They'll hit jewelry boxes because most middle class people only put their jewelry in there that they wear on special occasions or have sentimental value. Sometimes it's weeks or even months before they realize anything's missing.
If the perp is surprised by the victim, they usually run, specially in Arizona because of our lenient gun laws. But if the victim gets the drop on the perp, confronts the perp, it can get violent.

I'll go crawl back over to the "burglar" side or the thread now, lol!

 

[Pacific2011]

My take on that (not that it means much) was that they figured this out from something to do with the crime scene; may have appeared she let someone in, they had drinks or coffee as evident by two classes, and then the violent attack took place later when she resisted his advances..

Interesting idea! Maybe the perp became violent when confronted twice in connection with Allison's murder -- first at the time of the crime and secondly when asked for a DNA sample. JMO.

 

[OldSteve]

Let's talk about the DNA again:

LE says they have the killer's DNA profile. What exactly does that mean?

And, why announce it? Are they trying to spoke someone? Does it reassure the public that they are safe - IMO, sounds like the killer is on the lose.

Also, no mention if the DNA's been processed .... it should tell us if male or female,
ethnicity, perhaps more as per:
DNA: the next frontier in forensics -
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/012b2b9c-a742-11e4-8a71-00144feab7de.html

 

[Bernina]

And, why announce it? Are they trying to spoke someone? Does it reassure the public that they are safe - IMO, sounds like the killer is on the lose.

Also, no mention if the DNA's been processed .... it should tell us if male or female,
ethnicity, perhaps more as per:
DNA: the next frontier in forensics -
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/012b2b9c-a742-11e4-8a71-00144feab7de.html

Wow, that's really cool!

 

[nancydrew71]

And, why announce it? Are they trying to spoke someone? Does it reassure the public that they are safe - IMO, sounds like the killer is on the lose.

Also, no mention if the DNA's been processed .... it should tell us if male or female,
ethnicity, perhaps more as per:
DNA: the next frontier in forensics -
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/012b2b9c-a742-11e4-8a71-00144feab7de.html

This is what I don't get. announcing they have the DNA! Wow now they can get a snapshot of the person from it. SO, if this person knows this, you know they will stay out of trouble for sure. I don't think it was smart for LE to let the public know this!

 

[nancydrew71]

My take on that (not that it means much) was that they figured this out from something to do with the crime scene; may have appeared she let someone in, they had drinks or coffee as evident by two classes, and then the violent attack took place later when she resisted his advances..

THAT is interesting. you think they found two glasses or mugs from a beverage and figured this person had something to drink with her AND found the DNA on one of the glasses?! Then things got bad. That would make sense why LE said this.

 

[MissD]

Good going! After I mentioned guns, and left the web, I realized that since there was no sign of forced entry, if she had a gun, she might not had a chance to get to it...

I'm still sticking with my

the killer is someone local, who has taken notice and targets the victim...Also, some cases where a victim has had recent dealings with the killer who notices she lives alone, and then days (weeks) later decides to visit her at night thinking he can get lucky.

but, feel free to disagree. Only wish we knew more...

haha Steve! Thanks for your permission!

So if LE thought your theory was correct, they would call this "isolated", "targeted" and "personal"?

I just need to get this straight in my mind.

 

[Luvrosco]

haha Steve! Thanks for your permission!

So if LE thought your theory was correct, they would call this "isolated", "targeted" and "personal".
I just need to get this straight in my mind.

I have to agree. I don't think LE would consider a burglar to commit a targeted crime. If LE thinks this was a burglary,then wouldn't everyone else in the neighborhood be at risk?