AZ - Gabriel Cuen-Buitimea, allegedly shot and killed with an AK-47 by rancher George Alan Kelly, 75, Kino Springs, Jan 2023

[BayouBelle_LA]

More obfuscation from the defense. Soon to be featured as a script for a western. IMO
Challenge to probable cause doc. dated 3 March 2023

​

Kelly-CR-Motion-new-PC.pdf

From the link -

While Mr. Kelly’s statements were scrutinized and challenged, these “witness” statements were accepted as fact by investigators.

While the State admits that the witness statements are not consistent with each other or with the physical evidence, the State dismisses the inconsistencies as simply being the result of the witnesses experiencing a traumatic event. The State also suggests that these witnesses are too “uneducated” to accurately recall events, but that their statements should be believed regardless.

 

[NuttMegg]

It arguably is indeed more difficult. But the point is that it wasn't the charge that they had prepared to defend at the preliminary hearing. If they prosecutor was amending the charges, they should have just done so, and had a new advisement of the charges and reset the PH.

There is something that seems pathetic about the defense griping about reduced charges, I'm not surprised that she didn't scream that one to high heavens. I've read the various documents and media quotes by the defense atty. I'm not saying she's not doing what most defense attys do, pour gas on the fire, imo. But that doesn't mean I have to respect the performance. A man died here. Apparently his daughter will be in court, but I don't know if she made it today.

imo

 

[Eli9]

There is something that seems lame and pathetic about the defense griping about reduced charges, I'm not surprised that she didn't scream that one to high heavens. I've read the various documents and media quotes by the defense atty. I'm not saying she's not doing what most defense attys do, pour gas on the fire, imo. But that doesn't mean I have to respect the performance. A man died here. Apparently his daughter will be in court, but I don't know if she made it today.

imo

Today was just the arraignment. He entered a NG plea, trial date was set for 9/6/2023 and the only other piece of info was that the State had served an additional search warrant of the GK property for today's date.

 

[PrairieWind]

The Defense motion makes reference to the witnesses making reference to the sound of an AK-47. Who first mentioned AK-47? Is a weapon that Kelly owns? Was this weapon suggested to the witnesses by the BP and/or deputies?

 

[Eli9]

The Defense motion makes reference to the witnesses making reference to the sound of an AK-47. Who first mentioned AK-47? Is a weapon that Kelly owns? Was this weapon suggested to the witnesses by the BP and/or deputies?

Yes, GK owns a AK 47, more than one as the officers took the wrong one during the first search.

 

[PrairieWind]

There is something that seems pathetic about the defense griping about reduced charges, I'm not surprised that she didn't scream that one to high heavens. I've read the various documents and media quotes by the defense atty. I'm not saying she's not doing what most defense attys do, pour gas on the fire, imo. But that doesn't mean I have to respect the performance. A man died here. Apparently his daughter will be in court, but I don't know if she made it today.

imo

Right before the Preliminary Hearing, and without proper notice to the Defense, the Prosecution lowered the bar for itself. Why not agree to the continuance of the hearing and then proceed?

 

[shotgun09]

The Defense motion makes reference to the witnesses making reference to the sound of an AK-47. Who first mentioned AK-47? Is a weapon that Kelly owns? Was this weapon suggested to the witnesses by the BP and/or deputies?

I believe the AK 47 reference was made by the MSM. By the time each of the witnesses came forward, the AK47 was widely claimed.

 

[NuttMegg]

The Defense motion makes reference to the witnesses making reference to the sound of an AK-47. Who first mentioned AK-47? Is a weapon that Kelly owns? Was this weapon suggested to the witnesses by the BP and/or deputies?

Kelly said the band of 10 or more migrants were carrying back packs and ak47s. He said that way before any of the witnesses (meaning the 2 Mexicans) came forward. They would have known he had ak47s just from open publicity. Also, Kelly has 2 AK47s.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

One of the witnesses didn’t come forward until after he was picked up by border patrol on February 8 for another crime. That’s when he attempted to provide information about the homicide.

Interesting.

 

[PrairieWind]

Kelly said the band of 10 or more migrants were carrying back packs and ak47s. He said that way before any of the witnesses (meaning the 2 Mexicans) came forward. They would have known he had ak47s just from open publicity. Also, Kelly has 2 AK47s.

Yes, but who first mentioned AK-47 to the witnesses? Did BP aske them if they knew what type of weapon the shooter had? or did they suggest it?

 

[NuttMegg]

Yes, but who first mentioned AK-47 to the witnesses? Did BP aske them if they knew what type of weapon the shooter had? or did they suggest it?

IIRC they did not come forward right away, they would have seen publicity mentioning the ak47 use.

I don't know what they were asked, but basically the whole world knew that Kelly used an AK47 by the time the witnesses came forth.

 

[Cool Cats]

Don't they propose any alternative lesser charges later in the process, if they choose to? Not sure, but I think so.

Yes, they could add on lesser charges later for the jury.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

The Defense motion makes reference to the witnesses making reference to the sound of an AK-47. Who first mentioned AK-47? Is a weapon that Kelly owns? Was this weapon suggested to the witnesses by the BP and/or deputies?

Could be hard to tell since LE only recorded 6 minutes out of a 40 minute interview for one witness. Not good IMO.

https://santacruzcountyaz.gov/DocumentCenter/View/16773/CR-23-026-MOTION-FOR-REVIEW

 

[shotgun09]

Could be hard to tell since LE only recorded 6 minutes out of a 40 minute interview for one witness. Not good IMO.

View attachment 407458

https://santacruzcountyaz.gov/DocumentCenter/View/16773/CR-23-026-MOTION-FOR-REVIEW

Yeah, that 40 minute interview reduced to a recorded 6 minutes doesn't seem suspicious at all....

 

[Telltale]

Is there a reason why only 6 minutes were recorded?

I don't know the protocols over there. Where I am usually a witness will give a written statement. If there is a need for a translation. A professional translator will be used who will have to also write a statement.

If a witness account cannot or is for whatever reason better given in spoken form (for example, young kids.) It is done by a specifically trained officer in a camera and mike equipped special room and the whole thing is recorded.

Though, this is far from a universal protocol. I do hesitate to suggest the witness testimony was influenced in those 34 minutes. For the simple fact that if the police officers were trying to fit Kelly up, you would think those witnesses wouldn't be recalling a bunch of stuff that (as far as we can tell) does not fit the forensic evidence or other witness accounts.

Police might not have had the full facts at the time of recording, but I'm pretty sure they were aware early on that it happened in view of the house and no horse was shot. It wouldn't make much sense to record the witness making such obviously discreditable claims if they intended to fit the evidence to the crime.

 

[shotgun09]

Is there a reason why only 6 minutes were recorded?

I don't know the protocols over there. Where I am usually a witness will give a written statement. If there is a need for a translation. A professional translator will be used who will have to also write a statement.

If a witness account cannot or is for whatever reason better given in spoken form (for example, young kids.) It is done by a specifically trained officer in a camera and mike equipped special room and the whole thing is recorded.

Though, this is far from a universal protocol. I do hesitate to suggest the witness testimony was influenced in those 34 minutes. For the simple fact that if the police officers were trying to fit Kelly up, you would think those witnesses wouldn't be recalling a bunch of stuff that (as far as we can tell) does not fit the forensic evidence or other witness accounts.

It is clear to me, that at least one of the witnesses was going on the 'fluff' they must have learned in the media. His horse story was all over the place, and the 'writing materials' found by the body was complete nonsense.....unless you were fed a story that 'someone' may have read...about George Kelly's history of 'writing a book'....and got your translations mixed up... and suddenly the writing materials " appeared"....at the site where the deceased was found no less!

Lordy....that one was bad....

Just my clarity, as I see it.

 

[Telltale]

It is clear to me, that at least one of the witnesses was going on the 'fluff' they must have learned in the media. His horse story was all over the place, and the 'writing materials' found by the body was complete nonsense.....unless you were fed a story that 'someone' may have read...about George Kelly's history of 'writing a book'....and got your translations mixed up... and suddenly the writing materials " appeared"....at the site where the deceased was found no less!

Lordy....that one was bad....

Just my clarity, as I see it.

I would hope that the witnesses were interviewed with professional translators who were required to write their own accounts of interviews or statements given. A lot of care would need to be taken to make sure the asking or answering of questions were free of confusion, mistranslation or misinterpretation.

Hence why it would have been real helpful to record these interviews in full. So they can be reviewed to see if any translation issues could be confusing either parties understanding of questions or their answers.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

At the very minimum the 6 minutes out of 40 recording shows us a very sloppy and unprofessional police investigation. JMO.

 

[shotgun09]

Inquiring minds want to know what exactly LE is looking for in today's THIRD served search warrant of Mr Kelly's property. And, obviously what did they find, if anything. Curious...said skepticat.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Inquiring minds want to know what exactly LE is looking for in today's THIRD served search warrant of Mr Kelly's property. And, obviously what did they find, if anything. Curious...said skepticat.

I just watched today's hearing and noted that there was another search warrant served for Mr Kelly's property today. So the State is still investigating what happened.

I wouldn't be surprised that they are very nervous about their case and understand that they need to tie Mr Kelly's gun to the victim. I bet they are looking for the bullet.

The judge set a trial date for September 6th and will read transcripts of the probable cause hearing so he can rule on the defense motion.

Here's a link to today's short hearing. Begins at 19:28.