AZ - Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, 26 Dec 2009 - last seen in Texas - #10

[not_my_kids]

OK, seems like all the productive stuff is over with, so I bid you all adieu and I will see you tomorrow.

 

[Bratlings]

if he left town, i believe they would still have to run it the paper before the court date. did they adopt in TN or AZ , did they up and move in the middle of the adoption

It was in AZ. He first said they up and moved and adopted her in AZ, then he says he found out it was done in TN. This was years ago and he just found out now it happened in TN? That say it all!

 

[RJA00]

When the State moves to terminate your parental rights you have the legal right to surrender them or go to trial. It sounds like the mother surrendered hers and that they asked him to do the same which he refused so the State acted to sever them.

yes my sons bio mom surrender hers before they terminated her rights,
then they worked on terminating the fathers, not a short process, lots of steps took about year after she surrendered

 

[Bratlings]

yes my sons bio mom surrender hers before they terminated her rights,
then they worked on terminating the fathers, not a short process, lots of steps took about year after she surrendered

I have heard that the trial usually lasts 1 or 2 days. Maybe it took longer because they had to give him a year to work on a permanency plan? Or serve him notice?

 

[RJA00]

I have heard that the trial usually lasts 1 or 2 days. Maybe it took longer because they had to give him a year to work on a permanency plan? Or serve him notice?

the bio father was never found, they had to run it in the paper and send letters and make phone calls. it took about a year

 

[OneLove]

What you are not getting is this... The State had an obligation to notify him of a trial to terminate his rights. No one else! If he was defrauded it was by the State of TN and the district attorneys office who handles it! But I do not for 1 minute believe that happened! AND it has never been anyones obligation to notify a grandparent (Travis' parents) of any pending trial, They have absolutely no standing in it.

What you are not getting is this.... IF the state's notification went to a bogus or no-longer-valid address and never did reach him, but he was actually talking to both H's mother AND the Smiths prior to that hearing, who did have full knowledge of the date of the hearing AND they intentionally lied in order to insure that he never made it to that hearing, I would want a consultation with a VERY good family law attorney.

Way too many people with fraudulent intentions shrug off their legal and moral obligations too easily. Isn't it so easy for SOME people to feel smugly self-righteous? We are getting to see an example of that and its pretty ugly.

I say that if they really felt H, or Gabriel for that matter, would be placed with them based on the TRUE facts of the case, then why in the world would they risk so much to lie, cheat, scheme, and fabricate lies that weren't even necessary?

TAW's parents, H's real flesh and blood grandparents, were brought into it by Jack himself, who stated that he called them and talked to them about H and their role in her life, as I understand the Examiner article to say. I never said the state had an obligation to notify grandparents of hearings. But I do believe they should have had as much legal standing to be heard as the maternal grandparents.

And you are totally right; people lie, cheat, and steal every day and shrug it off as someone else's fault. If they can sleep with themselves at night just because they can point the blame elsewhere, I don't want to know them personally. I just want the children to have a home that is honest and loving.

 

[Mels3kidz]

Very nice catch.

Well JS said that they took "a" laptop that hadn't been turned on in 8 months. That doesn't mean that TammiJack didn't have another one (or two) that had been used more recently.

Melissa

 

[Bratlings]

What you are not getting is this.... IF the state's notification went to a bogus or no-longer-valid address and never did reach him, but he was actually talking to both H's mother AND the Smiths prior to that hearing, who did have full knowledge of the date of the hearing AND they intentionally lied in order to insure that he never made it to that hearing, I would want a consultation with a VERY good family law attorney.

Way too many people with fraudulent intentions shrug off their legal and moral obligations too easily. Isn't it so easy for SOME people to feel smugly self-righteous? We are getting to see an example of that and its pretty ugly.

I say that if they really felt H, or Gabriel for that matter, would be placed with them based on the TRUE facts of the case, then why in the world would they risk so much to lie, cheat, scheme, and fabricate lies that weren't even necessary?

TAW's parents, H's real flesh and blood grandparents, were brought into it by Jack himself, who stated that he called them and talked to them about H and their role in her life, as I understand the Examiner article to say. I never said the state had an obligation to notify grandparents of hearings. But I do believe they should have had as much legal standing to be heard as the maternal grandparents.

And you are totally right; people lie, cheat, and steal every day and shrug it off as someone else's fault. If they can sleep with themselves at night just because they can point the blame elsewhere, I don't want to know them personally. I just want the children to have a home that is honest and loving.

It is not a defense that the foster mom, bio mom or paternal step grandparent or even future adoptive parent did not tell you! It was the State's obligation! And it does not matter if it went to an address where he was no longer living at. They are required to make every possible attempt to notify him and sometimes that means the last known address and an ad in the paper. It means a reasonable attempt and that is it. It is legal! It does not mean they must hunt him down personally and make sure he gets a notice in hand under any means necessary wherever in the world he may be. Although its blatantly obvious that he believes that is the States obligation... it is not! What part do you not understand? It seems you just want to make this Tammie's fault no matter what because you do not like her and while I would agree she is not too likeable I still will not enable someone who abandoned his child and now wants to make excuses for it!

 

[RJA00]

What you are not getting is this.... IF the state's notification went to a bogus or no-longer-valid address and never did reach him, but he was actually talking to both H's mother AND the Smiths prior to that hearing, who did have full knowledge of the date of the hearing AND they intentionally lied in order to insure that he never made it to that hearing, I would want a consultation with a VERY good family law attorney.

Way too many people with fraudulent intentions shrug off their legal and moral obligations too easily. Isn't it so easy for SOME people to feel smugly self-righteous? We are getting to see an example of that and its pretty ugly.

I say that if they really felt H, or Gabriel for that matter, would be placed with them based on the TRUE facts of the case, then why in the world would they risk so much to lie, cheat, scheme, and fabricate lies that weren't even necessary?

TAW's parents, H's real flesh and blood grandparents, were brought into it by Jack himself, who stated that he called them and talked to them about H and their role in her life, as I understand the Examiner article to say. I never said the state had an obligation to notify grandparents of hearings. But I do believe they should have had as much legal standing to be heard as the maternal grandparents.

And you are totally right; people lie, cheat, and steal every day and shrug it off as someone else's fault. If they can sleep with themselves at night just because they can point the blame elsewhere, I don't want to know them personally. I just want the children to have a home that is honest and loving.

if the state send him a certified letter and it was never received or signed by him, the state should of ran it in the paper. I dont think it matter if he had been to some hearings or not. tpr hearing is very serious and and he should of been notified either my letter or pubilc notice

 

[Bratlings]

It doesnt matter if someone did not tell you there was a hearing, legally they do not have to. Legally there is nothing wrong with them not telling you, not reminding you, and even hoping you dont come. Legally it is your responsibility to know what is going on with your own childs well being and be actively involved in it when the State takes custody. Hopefully so you can get your child back! He admitted that he knew that the child was in State custody, and that he had attended hearings and then left town! He could have filed papers in court notifying the State of his new address and that is exactly what he should have done to avoid this. I do not care if he didnt have legal representation and didnt know better! There is no more important time to find out your rights than when the State takes your child away from you! And if you dont, then oh well! You never deserved that child if it was not worth your effort!

 

[RJA00]

It doesnt matter if someone did not tell you there was a hearing, legally they do not have to. Legally there is nothing wrong with them not telling you, not reminding you, and even hoping you dont come. Legally it is your responsibility to know what is going on with your own childs well being and be actively involved in it when the State takes custody. Hopefully so you can get your child back! He admitted that he knew that the child was in State custody, and that he had attended hearings and then left town! He could have filed papers in court notifying the State of his new address and that is exactly what he should have done to avoid this. I do not care if he didnt have legal representation and didnt know better! There is no more important time to find out your rights than when the State takes your child away from you! And if you dont, then oh well! You never deserved that child if it was not worth your effort!

I guess everybody different, I made sure my sons bio mom was at court the day they terminated her rights so, she would know what she was doing,
the judge talked to and explained everything to her before she signed , so i dont have a guilty conchies (sp) spell check just aint helping

 

[OneLove]

(snipped) It is legal! It does not mean they must hunt him down personally and make sure he gets a notice wherever in the world he may be. Although its blatantly obvious that he believes that is the States obligation... it is not! What part do you not understand? It seems you just want to make this Tammie's fault no matter what because you do not like her and while I would agree she is not too likeable I still will not enable someone who abandoned his child and now wants to make excuses for it!

It is not blatantly obvious that he believes its the state's obligation to hunt him down! It IS blatantly obvious that he believes he was personally lied to, cheated, and betrayed by the people who were caring for his child while he was working and while the child's mother was drug addicted and unable to care for the child herself. What part of this do you not understand?

I have no interest in making this Tammi's fault, neither do I dislike her as I have never even met her. In H's case, I only saw TAW mention Jack and Jack's daughter as spewing lies in order to strip him of his parental rights.

I am curious as to why Jack would offer him money to 'disappear' if he felt he could legally gain custody of H without a payoff? And since TAW claims to have turned good money down for a child you SAY he had already abandoned, it seems an odd coincidence there was an ensuing hearing for which TAW says he wasn't notified, and a hasty and secretive move out of state.

As to Tammi, I AM seeing her pursue media outlets for public displays of untruthfullness concerning another child's parental rights. I'm pretty sure I'm not imagining that!

I am taking none of this personally, just looking at the facts that are out there in the public about these cases. I think that a good look at what has really happened is warranted, considering what we are seeing for ourselves in a very public venue. Nothing to worry or fret about if everything was indeed handled as it should have been, right?

 

[bessie]

Well JS said that they took "a" laptop that hadn't been turned on in 8 months. That doesn't mean that TammiJack didn't have another one (or two) that had been used more recently.

Melissa

That was my initial thought, as well. Then I read the article.

"Detectives searched two computer hard drives and confiscated a laptop, the couple said."

One laptop. JS says it hasn't been turned on in eight months. TS says it's the one she regularly uses to post to her "fan club". The assumption is that JS is lying to give the impression that the laptop is clean, nothing to find because it hasn't been used in ages. Perhaps, TS is the one who is lying (imagine that).

"Oh, you see faithful followers, I really wanted to answer your messages, but woe is me, those mean, bully detectives took my laptop, and I type sooooooo much slower sitting at my desktop."
:innocent::innocent:
http://www.kpho.com/news/22251939/detail.html

 

[Bratlings]

The law in TN.

(d) (1) Other biological or legal relatives of the child or the adult are not necessary parties to the proceeding and shall not be entitled to notice of the adoption proceedings unless they are legal guardians as defined in § 36-1-102 or legal custodians of the person of the child or adult at the time the petition is filed.

http://www.state.tn.us/tccy/tnchild/36/36-1-117.htm

 

[Bratlings]

It is not blatantly obvious that he believes its the state's obligation to hunt him down! It IS blatantly obvious that he believes he was personally lied to, cheated, and betrayed by the people who were caring for his child while he was working and while the child's mother was drug addicted and unable to care for the child herself. What part of this do you not understand?

I have no interest in making this Tammi's fault, neither do I dislike her as I have never even met her. In H's case, I only saw TAW mention Jack and Jack's daughter as spewing lies in order to strip him of his parental rights.

I am curious as to why Jack would offer him money to 'disappear' if he felt he could legally gain custody of H without a payoff? And since TAW claims to have turned good money down for a child you SAY he had already abandoned, it seems an odd coincidence there was an ensuing hearing for which TAW says he wasn't notified, and a hasty and secretive move out of state.

As to Tammi, I AM seeing her pursue media outlets for public displays of untruthfullness concerning another child's parental rights. I'm pretty sure I'm not imagining that!

I am taking none of this personally, just looking at the facts that are out there in the public about these cases. I think that a good look at what has really happened is warranted, considering what we are seeing for ourselves in a very public venue. Nothing to worry or fret about if everything was indeed handled as it should have been, right?

You are assuming that anything he says is true! He is a convicted criminal! He left of his own free will knowing his child was in the custody of the State and came back to discover he was no longer a parent. Those are the facts.

 

[OneLove]

I guess everybody different, I made sure my sons bio mom was at court the day they terminated her rights so, she would know what she was doing,
the judge talked to and explained everything to her before she signed , so i dont have a guilty conchies (sp) spell check just aint helping

You are my hero! Once upon a long ago time, among many other child advocacy tasks, I taught foster parent certification classes and know how much these children need a good home. Doing things the right way allows everyone to move forward with peace and goodwill (well, sometimes anyway, lol). I bet your sons are very blessed to have your love and care.

 

[Marigold]

To all my dear WS friends....
can we all please make sure this thread stays on topic so that we don't have to worry about it being shut down?

Thanks for everyone's cooperation.

 

[OneLove]

You are assuming that anything he says is true! He is a convicted criminal! He left of his own free will knowing his child was in the custody of the State and came back to discover he was no longer a parent. Those are the facts.

So if Tammi and Jack become convicted criminals, we can assume that nothing they have said is true? Hmmm...that kinda puts us back to square one.

 

[Bratlings]

(l) If a person has surrendered that parent's parental rights or guardianship rights, if a person has filed a parental consent and the consent has been confirmed as provided herein, if a person has executed a waiver of interest pursuant to this part, if a person or agency has consented to the adoption of the child who is the subject of the adoption proceeding, or if a person's parental or guardianship rights to the child have been properly terminated, no notice of the adoption proceeding or service of process shall be made to that person or agency

http://www.state.tn.us/tccy/tnchild/36/36-1-117.htm

 

[OneLove]

You are assuming that anything he says is true! He is a convicted criminal! He left of his own free will knowing his child was in the custody of the State and came back to discover he was no longer a parent. Those are the facts.

So nothing to worry or fret about if this case is thoroughly reviewed. You should feel very comfortable knowing that everything was done right and justice has prevailed. :angel: