AZ - Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, 26 Dec 2009 - last seen in Texas - #2

[time]

I think money may be a problem for them. I don't know how much money is in the colon cleansing business but for some reason they do not want to go through traditional adoption means, either it is too expensive or they fear they won't pass a home study. There are babies to adopt out of country if you have the money. They seemed to be doing everything on the cheap. If someone told me they wanted me to adopt their baby I would have had a lawyer involved, instead of just downloading some official looking documents off the internet as they seem to have done with the guardianship papers. And contacting the teen wannabe surrogate because the price is right.

DG... I don't know how much money either is in the colon cleansing business.

I also haven't decided whether they are doing the adoption/surrogate thing on the cheap and are desperate or if they are collecting possibilities or even buying/brokering children for adoption and surrogates (not desperate, just busy working these folks all the time and it appears to us they are desperate to find one baby). How much of this do you really have to do to find just one baby to adopt? If that's all they are/were doing, it sure seems like overkill. I'm really thinking they weren't going to adopt anytime soon because if they did, then the whole "our little girl just wants a sibling to love" story doesn't work anymore.

 

[pghbrandi]

wonder if we will hear from some high price lawyer representing them tomorrow!

Passion, sadly, that would not surprise me one bit.

 

[time]

So if the Smiths have given some sorry tale about EJ and Gabriel being abused to some underground person who helps abused woman and they've arranged for Gabriel to go to Mexico with them for a while, would this person even know what is going on in this case? Would that news even filter down into Mexico? Could someone actually be down there waiting to hear from the Smiths about what to do next and when? I haven't seen anything that says that the FBI are working with Mexican LE.

I wondered if the reason they are smiling on NG is because they are pretty certain they can't be touched. Gabe may be in Mexico or handed off several times and just went through Mexico to get to some other country? Or, yes, he could have been placed with some family that is not going to go to LE or has no idea what is going on and/or is waiting to hear. Gotta wonder... maybe they can produce him at a moments notice or maybe they have also arranged it so no one can really connect them. I don't know - what if they told Elizabeth they will produce him if she cooperates and if neccessary. If some connection to them is made, they can plead they thought he was in danger to get a minimal sentence (just the nice loving, caring couple who looks out for the worlds children).

 

[pghbrandi]

So if the Smiths have given some sorry tale about EJ and Gabriel being abused to some underground person who helps abused woman and they've arranged for Gabriel to go to Mexico with them for a while, would this person even know what is going on in this case? Would that news even filter down into Mexico? Could someone actually be down there waiting to hear from the Smiths about what to do next and when? I haven't seen anything that says that the FBI are working with Mexican LE.

I thought of that also. Or, if an American family took Gabriel and went to Mexico for a "vacation" they probably wouldn't know of anything going on here about him.

 

[Nocgirl]

I think I found Logan's facebook page. His profile pic is of Gabe

http://www.facebook.com/#/profile.php?id=100000568071299&ref=search&sid=1170461487.2946380980..1

 

[LogicalMinds]

Perhaps like any good businessperson Tammi figured "buy low sell high"

I find it very telling that she was eager to meet the young gal on the surrogate forum..when other "yearning" moms to be were discouraging the girl

If Tammi gets a girl who only wants $2000...and finds some desperate infertile parents for $10,000, or $20,000 there could be a nice finder fee there

similarly, arrange an adoption...give the girl a small amount of money and collect ? 20, 30k or ?? I don't know the figures since I never tried to price black market babies

I am not sure how much colon cleansing brings in...seems to be about $100 a session or ?? Ironically only ONE state requires a license and training to do it LOL

guess where...yeah Florida...I guess we are a leader in clean colons among other crazy things haha

 

[Courtney1981]

I wonder about Mexico....wouldn't blond blue eyed Gabe "stand out" there ???

Respectfully snipped by me

Not necessarily--I went to Juarez with my church a few yrs ago for missions (not baby shopping ) and there was a little boy there light skinned, light brown hair and green eyes--he was beautiful-his name was Pablo...
Soooo, although it's rare, it's not completely out of the question!
\

 

[pghbrandi]

I wondered if the reason they are smiling on NG is because they are pretty certain they can't be touched. Gabe may be in Mexico or handed off several times and just went through Mexico to get to some other country? Or, yes, he could have been placed with some family that is not going to go to LE or has no idea what is going on and/or is waiting to hear. Gotta wonder... maybe they can produce him at a moments notice or maybe they have also arranged it so no one can really connect them. I don't know - what if they told Elizabeth they will produce him if she cooperates and if neccessary. If some connection to them is made, they can plead they thought he was in danger to get a minimal sentence (just the nice loving, caring couple who looks out for the worlds children).

What is killing me the most is thinking of innocent Gabriel just as happy as can be going through all of this. (Better I must say than thinking of him not being with us) Somewhere in his eight month old mind knowing something, someone(dad, momster) is missing from his life. Just so sweet and innocent.
Oh, I am getting more angry by the second!:furious:

 

[darlin gal]

Originally Posted by DairyGirl
I think money may be a problem for them. I don't know how much money is in the colon cleansing business but for some reason they do not want to go through traditional adoption means, either it is too expensive or they fear they won't pass a home study. There are babies to adopt out of country if you have the money. They seemed to be doing everything on the cheap. If someone told me they wanted me to adopt their baby I would have had a lawyer involved, instead of just downloading some official looking documents off the internet as they seem to have done with the guardianship papers. And contacting the teen wannabe surrogate because the price is right.

I think his age may be a reason they wouldn't be able to adopt through traditional adoption. He is in his 60's I think.

 

[CHICANA]

at this point I fear the worse, and it PMO that baby Gabe was not taken from EJ when she first trashed the apartment and started makeing theats agianst him when he was 3 weeks old.

Does anybody know how EJ's parents died? drug overdose?

Unless the baby was hurt when EJ trashed the apartment, that wouldn't be a reason to take him. We also don't know if there was proof that EJ threatened the baby. When couples are arguing or in custody fights, it can come down to he said/she said, and that wouldn't be grounds to take him. IDK what dad's criminal history is, but that likely wouldn't have helped his credibility.

 

[time]

LogicalMinds ... exactly!

 

[AmyinTheHam]

I have not read all the threads so excuse me if this has been covered but do we know how she got to FL? Did she fly?

And my gut feeling is that the Smith's know more than they are saying. I keep thinking at some point the Mom will decide to spill the beans if they were involved. She won't go down on a murder charge if she can put the blame on someone else. Kind of like Casey, if she could blame anyone else she would, no way she would have been sitting in jail this long unless she has no one to point to but herself.

 

[SusanB]

What is Elizabeth going to get out of all of this? Money? Revenge? Freedom? Any thoughts?

 

[time]

I think his age may be a reason they wouldn't be able to adopt through traditional adoption. He is in his 60's I think.

Also, Tammi may have issues related to past custody of the kids with her ex - just speculation based on what she wrote on the web.

 

[LogicalMinds]

I think his age may be a reason they wouldn't be able to adopt through traditional adoption. He is in his 60's I think.

His age....

her background (the first kids that she gave up ?)

psychology tests/interview etc would disqualify them pretty quick JMO

money ?? they seem to be living on the edge

they already have a child who was NOT adopted thru regular means

ring ding ding..so many reasons to disqualify them

 

[Searchfortruth]

I don't get Nancy's attitude tonight and it's making me furious. I know you guys already watched the show (I am watching the repeat)...just venting. She was so so rude to the Tempe PIO. I am really tired of this.

 

[pghbrandi]

I think his age may be a reason they wouldn't be able to adopt through traditional adoption. He is in his 60's I think.

I have to respectfully disagree. I think her losing her OWN three children is the reason she could not traditionally adopt.

 

[LogicalMinds]

Respectfully snipped by me

Not necessarily--I went to Juarez with my church a few yrs ago for missions (not baby shopping ) and there was a little boy there light skinned, light brown hair and green eyes--he was beautiful-his name was Pablo...
Soooo, although it's rare, it's not completely out of the question!
\

I meant IF they had news bulletins and stories and internet stories in Spanish and people there were "looking" for him as a missing baby...then he surely would stand out

JMO on the chance that Gabe is alive and in Mexico I hope they get some coverage of this story there

 

[time]

What is Elizabeth going to get out of all of this? Money? Revenge? Freedom? Any thoughts?

Susan... I don't have any idea. Is this just something that got out of hand for her (maybe with some prodding). Maybe she's not telling everything she does know, but maybe all she knows is that she did hand Gabe off to someone (prearranged, but she's not going to rat out the Smith's for whatever reason?). I'm not standing up for her, I just have to wonder what state of mind she's in and was in when she did this - for some reason I keep wondering if she was taking drugs.

 

[STEADFAST]

NG showed this video tape.
http://www.foxsanantonio.com/newsroom/top_stories/videos/vid_903.shtml

We're working the San Antonio connection to the nationwide search for a missing 8-month-old boy.
Our Yami Virgin talked to a local man who may be the last person to have contact with the boy's mother before she hopped a bus and left San Antonio.


Local station KABB, Fox

So, are you, as they claimed on NG, telling the Smiths everything you find out?