AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #12

[FrayedKnot]

I also don't think at least the older son was as "supervised" as one might want before any of this happened. JMO

I have seen evidence to support that. Pretty shocking. IMO


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[cluciano63]

I wonder if one parent or the other, or a child, has made another 911 all this week...we wouldn't know, probably, if we don't know where they are staying. But maybe one parent threatened the other? Something like that?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If one of the parents was breaking down in grief, and unable to function, then CPS would make certain that the kids had someone in the family to take control, like the other parent or a grandparent or an Aunt. But to cease contact with that parent, makes me believe it is something other than just a parent having grieving issues. JMO

I had a friend whose child was dying of brain cancer, at age 5. She was inconsolable, and virtually useless as a mother for her older children at that time. Even after the funeral, it took a full year for her to snap back. Her husband did the best he could, but had to keep his job for the benefits. Many of us in the neighborhood pitched in and helped the grandmother with the two older elementary school kids. CPS was never involved, even though the older daughter would break down and cry at school, and was unable to really take part in class.

I think those are different circumstances though Katy.

I think one of them finally had an emotional breakdown and no, CPS wouldnt allow that parent to have contact with the boys until they get help and can prove they are stable.

If Sergio was threatening to kill himself it could have been Becky who called LE and then LE got CPS involved.

IMO

 

[Starry Night]

I'm back on the scanner thanks to Clu-Keeping it real-keeping it focused on Isabel-thanks Clu

 

[Lovejac]

If one of the parents was breaking down in grief, and unable to function, then CPS would make certain that the kids had someone in the family to take control, like the other parent or a grandparent or an Aunt. But to cease contact with that parent, makes me believe it is something other than just a parent having grieving issues. JMO

I had a friend whose child was dying of brain cancer, at age 5. She was inconsolable, and virtually useless as a mother for her older children at that time. Even after the funeral, it took a full year for her to snap back. Her husband did the best he could, but had to keep his job for the benefits. Many of us in the neighborhood pitched in and helped the grandmother with the two older elementary school kids. CPS was never involved, even though the older daughter would break down and cry at school, and was unable to really take part in class.

What a sad story That was so caring of you to help your friend. I hope she is doing better now.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

As my BDE signature suggests, "Fasten your seatbelts. It's going to be a bumpy night."

I'm not the least surprised with these developments

:seeya: I am NOT surprised either, Bette ...

I remember the Parents 1st Presser, which was almost a week after Isabel went missing : When I saw the parents and "listened to" what they said, "my radar went off big time" ... and it has been going up and up ever since !

The "Behavioral Analysis Unit" was brought in, so there was something that "obvious" to LE ... the BAU would NOT be wasting their time IF they thought this was a "stranger kidnapping" ...

:moo::moo::moo:

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I wonder in what type of place the other parent is staying? With friend/family or as an in-patient somewhere?

May have been Baker Acted and is being assessed by the mental health officials.

I have always thought Sergio was the weaker one of the two..emotionally.

IMO

 

[4Jacy]

Something about all this reminds me of a song, "Hello darkness, my old friend."

Very scared!

 

[katydid23]

I think those are different circumstances though Katy.

I think one of them finally had an emotional breakdown and no, CPS wouldnt allow that parent to have contact with the boys until they get help and can prove they are stable.

If Sergio was threatening to kill himself it could have been Becky who called LE and then LE got CPS involved.

IMO

If he was making threats like that, then it makes me kind of suspicious of him.
I would probably feel suicidal if one of my kids was taken out of their bed one night. But if I was not guilty or involved, then I would put my other kid at the top priority, and never consider doing that to them, especially after they just lost their sibling.

So if he did have a total breakdown, then maybe where there is smoke, there is fire. JMO

p.s.
my friend who watched her little girl die of a brain cancer, she talked about ending her own life too. But she did niot have a total emotional breakdown. She talked about it rationally, and emotionally, but kept it together for her two older kids.

 

[FrayedKnot]

May have been Baker Acted and is being assessed by the mental health officials.

I have always thought Sergio was the weaker one of the two..emotionally.

IMO

Isn't Baker Act only in FL? IDK, I am a native Floridian and I remember hearing once that FL was the only state that had such a thing.....


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[Cazzie]

May have been Baker Acted and is being assessed by the mental health officials.

I have always thought Sergio was the weaker one of the two..emotionally.

IMO

But if that's what happened (even if it's her, not him), would LE announce it to the media?

Or maybe this happened days ago, on the hush-hush, and now the assessment has resulted in a hospitalization for however long.

 

[Theforeigner]

From the very first moment I saw Sergio Celis speak out, and all other public appearances of SC, I have sensed/belived STRONGLY that somthing was odd/wrong with him...
I could be wrong... but I guess time will tell...

 

[Pensfan]

No contact. None. That is a major red flag.

I have a friend with severe bipolar who has been periodically hospitalized for attempted suicide and suicidal thoughts.

She has a wonderful supportive husband. And she has never ONCE been restricted from seeing their son due to her mental instability. Obviously he did not see her while she was sedated or restrained, but CPS never removed him from having contact with her.

That is not what this is, IMHO.




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When I've heard about CPS's involvement with psych patients' children, it is only required that the mentally ill parent not be left alone with the children.

In domestic violence cases, CPS always tells the non-violent parent that if they do not kick out the violent parent (or move out from living with the violent parent), their children will be immediately removed from their custody.

Pensfan
verified psychiatric mental health nurse

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If he was making threats like that, then it makes me kind of suspicious of him.
I would probably feel suicidal if one of my kids was taken out of their bed one night. But if I was not guilty or involved, then I would put my other kid at the top priority, and never consider doing that to them, especially after they just lost their sibling.

So if he did have a total breakdown, then maybe where there is smoke, there is fire. JMO

p.s.
my friend who watched her little girl die of a brain cancer, she talked about ending her own life too. But she did niot have a total emotional breakdown. She talked about it rationally, and emotionally, but kept it together for her two older kids.

I am so sorry for your friend, Katy,

But everyone is not as strong as others. If they threaten suicide the experts always say to take it very seriously. I believe Sergio has finally fallen apart and as a nurse Becky would call someone to get him help and by doing that then CPS would step in and be more involved because of the boys.

I think I would have a nervous breakdown if my child was missing and its going on close to a month now with no resolution. And especially if I let myself think that my precious child was never going to return again alive. I would hold it together as long as I could but everyone has a breaking point......children or not...and I think I would just lose it and kick and scream, cuss and yell and may even throw things against the wall because I felt such hopelessness and helplessness.

So until we really know what happened I am not going to judge Sergio or Becky.

IMO

 

[Dr. Know?]

Here it's called involuntary commitment instead of Baker Act. Similar.

 

[FrayedKnot]

When I've heard about CPS's involvement with psych patients' children, it is only required that the mentally ill parent not be left alone with the children.

In domestic violence cases, CPS always tells the non-violent parent that if they do not kick out the violent parent (or move out from living with the violent parent), their children will be immediately removed from their custody.

Pensfan
verified psychiatric mental health nurse

That makes sense. My friends were very good parents, and she was an excellent mother in spite of her illness. She, in fact called me one day to come over and sit with her until her husband came home so that if she fell apart, I would be there with her son.

And again, I say, CPS never felt the need to remove that sweet boy from her care or contact.

MOO is that this is pretty bad for CPS to allow zero contact.


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[Prof]

Is KVOA a reliable news source? I ask because they were bold in saying that one parent is not allowed contact. Why would Pacheco tell KVOA this (when the other sources aren't stating things as boldly)? Or am I being naive?

http://www.kvoa.com/full-coverage/finding-isabel/#fcanchor

Maybe I am being naive as well....

I want to know why KVOA has this "exclusive" from TPD, when TPD has been "close to the vest" and essentially treating all local media equally.
IN this case, we have not heard one local media outlet have a TPD scoop on another.

"Tucson Police tell News 4 the parents are living separately because of this and one of the parents is not allowed any kind of contact"

This part after 22 days of watching endless pressers with no information --really puts the H in hinky for me.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Wow! My first thought was the parent who is not allowed contact is implicated in Isabel's disappearance. But it is also possible that one of the parents has had a breakdown of some kind because of the disappearance and is not allowed contact with the other children for that reason.

Yes but its better to think of the worst possible thing and conclude the father is a monster.

 

[Pensfan]

Where is Ransom tonight? IIRC, she stated that she had worked as a CPS social worker at one time. She will have lots of insight.

 

[katydid23]

What a sad story That was so caring of you to help your friend. I hope she is doing better now.

She is. And her kids are both in college and doing well too. But the parents divorced and that was really sad, imo. The Dad started drinking and is not doing so great from what I hear. sigh :rose: