AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #20

[Prof]

They had a house in foreclosure that they suddenly managed to save, Sergio's parents had health issues, he worked only part time, and, as it has been asked before, how could they afford the Lexus and 2 other cars*, plus that kind of mortgage payment when he wasn't working full time and she was a nurse. Nurses are fairly well compensated, but I can't imagine it was enough to support their lifestyle. Even something as minor as 3 kids in sports can get expensive.

* I think the 4th vehicle reported to be there when LE arrived was the person who brought the oldest son home.

Good point about the 4th car.

Hmm.. Sergio and part time...I must have missed the evidence that Sergio only works part time. Can anyone point me to that?

I do know the Lexus is a 2000 Lexus from the police reports. The other cars are old as well. IMO they are probably owned free and clear.

Of course, the police report also showed that the person who reported this alleged loan does not work where she said she did, and there was no loan, but I would still like to know what evidence we have that Sergio only worked part time?

TIA

 

[joedotnet]

Good point about the 4th car.

Hmm.. Sergio and part time...I must have missed the evidence that Sergio only works part time. Can anyone point me to that?

I do know the Lexus is a 2000 Lexus from the police reports. The other cars are old as well. IMO they are probably owned free and clear.

Of course, the police report also showed that the person who reported this alleged loan does not work where she said she did, and there was no loan, but I would still like to know what evidence we have that Sergio only worked part time?

TIA

I'd like to see some evidence Sergio actually worked.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

 

[Eileen730]

is the bedroom in the northeast portion of the house (referencing the twin bed, pillow and gaming chair) the boys room?

Im not sure!
Not sure who sleeps where in that home!

 

[Pensfan]

A lot to absorb in these documents. Thank you to everyone posting stuff.
I (personally )am as confused as ever but with that said I have a few thoughts:


I find it very troubling about first- obvious and immediate observations by detectives of the victim's bedroom ( pillow footboard gaming chair around bed???) AND the K9 hits and analysis hits in the house-in the garage( !!!!!! ) between the cars? and the trunk? and the vacuum cleaner????::thud: and lumenol reactions( either way + or -) I wonder if what is blacked it is evidence of cleaning agents.

My antennae has always been up on the cars. I am not surprised. But,

**What does everyone make of RSR and this blackberry business- screen shots of his phone texts etc etc???through window etc etc??? ( truck knife??)

And in no way to sleuth minors... "My son has ____" must be like ADD or ADHD. ( one of mine does too btw) IMHO Becky does toss that in -in an odd place in her conversation with the officer. justsayin'

Also, I keep thinking the footprints around electrical boxes had to do with finding and disabling the video cams. Both, possibly were checked at first "they" tried to find a way to disconnect it but then realized they didn't know which box and wire was which (- because it was dark - and because the dogs were freaking out) so they climbed up onto the roof and aimed the camera to the sky instead- quicker solution)

Sorry about being all over the place...I think we need Dexter.

Wow....good call.

 

[Pensfan]

So we have ppl hearing dogs at 2 am and then another neighbour hearing dogs barking like crazy at 6:30 am.

hmmmmmmm

Before the tracking dog(s) had to be put up because it was so hot, the dog tracked to a home on East Cooper Street. East Cooper Street was the place reported to have the dog barking like crazy at 2 am. Somewhere in the documents the owner of that home is listed as Min Hahn. Why did the dog track to Min Hahn's home?

 

[Eileen730]

I just think something hinky is going on here....
I do not think its money!
Dont think its drugs
Not the Cartel either!

Now I do think someone possibly 2 ppl in that house knows exactly what happend.

 

[LisaB]

Why would a perp wear those boots ? They are not designed for speed and agility ? When he jumped down into the yard, wouldn't it be kind of loud ? If the ground is packed dirt ? Also, IMO, they would be hard to run in...if the need arose.

No, I could see a hypothetical abducter wearing what peeps in my home town call "felony shoes "... AKA sneakers..... JMO

Someone here... Joe? said he used to disconnect people's cable TV for nonpayment (IIRC) and used to have to jump over walls like this sometimes to do so. Maybe he can tell us what footwear he wore, and perhaps it will indicate whether a cable installer or meter reader wearing work boots may have used that box to get over the fence at some point.

 

[liz b.]

Does anyone know the meaning of "apparent" blood stains on her bedroom floor? Is it apparent to the naked eye, or apparent with luminol testing? TIA

The LEO used a light to look for blood.The kind of light which detects blood that has been cleaned up. Then he wrote about finding blood on the floor.

This could have been blood which had been there for a while,and had been cleaned up during normal house cleaning. But, since the blood is on the floor of the bedroom of a missing child, IMO it COULD POSSIBLY be fresh blood that someone tried to clean up. Interesting that LE also used luminol in the boys room...I have no recollection of reports of luminol being used in other areas of the house. So, I wonder if LE believes that something happened to Isabel,either in her room or in the boys room...JMO

 

[Isabelle]

I have 2 questions, anyone can help me please?
1)did the police check whether the screen at the window has been moved from the inside to the outside of the house?
2)if you're going to wake up
your daughter
and do not find her what
's the first thing you would do
I´d like to know everyone´s opinion please[/QUOTE]

BBM


I'm pretty sure the first thing I'd do is look around her room and I am sure I would notice an open window with the screen missing and curtains pulled to one side.

Then I would leave her room and call her name, checking all the other rooms/bathrooms.

I would check the interior of the house, then the yard, all the while calling their name and once I got to the yard, my voice would be a hysterical pitch. Then I'd call 911 if I could stop shaking enough to dial the number and continue screaming!

 

[GutFeeling!]

The hospital would be able to confirm what time she got to work, would they not and then be back tracked from there depending on how long it takes her to get to work? If she was at work at 7 for example, and it takes her 30 minutes to get there, then she would've left the home at 6:30 and so on. So if she claims she left at 7:30, she would've been at work at 8.

In the 911 call, she says she left at 7 but I think that was just an estimate and not thinking straight. Sergio said his wife had just left for work which leads me to believe 7:30 would've been the time she left. Sergio then goes to Isa's room at 8 and doesn't find her there and calls his wife.

Personally, I don't think it makes a difference because Isa was already gone by then and I believe the neighbour who heard the voices outside and the barking dogs.

Just bumping off your post n/t

Remember these are initial reports taken by as quickly as possible by police, and given by stressed people that are put on the spot - later they would go back and straighten it all out - that may be in the next 500 pages lol

 

[txanmom]

The LEO used a light to look for blood.The kind of light which detects blood that has been cleaned up. Then he wrote about finding blood on the floor.

This could have been blood which had been there for a while,and had been cleaned up during normal house cleaning. But, since the blood is on the floor of the bedroom of a missing child, IMO it COULD POSSIBLY be fresh blood that someone tried to clean up. Interesting that LE also used luminol in the boys room...I have no recollection of reports of luminol being used in other areas of the house. So, I wonder if LE believes that something happened to Isabel,either in her room or in the boys room...JMO

I recall they used it in the garage, the toyota, between the cars in the garage and on some vacuum cleaner accessories.

I guess about IC floor, I just wondered if it was apparrent to the naked eye, and if so why didn't SC see it when he started looking for her. That would have been very concerning to me.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

This is what I found about the red car per Nancy's Show

GRACE: Do they always have that red car parked in their driveway?

STARDEVANT: Yes. Yes. They do.

GRACE: Does it work, or is it just sitting there?

STARDEVANT: It`s just sitting there. Yes, it`s been sitting there, I`m pretty sure, since I moved in about eight months ago.

PACHECO: And since you already know that that vehicle is not operable, but that`s part of what was included in the overall search warrant. And also to clear up a couple of things. Everything that we`ve done in terms of search of the -- of the home has been done with a search warrant and according to the law.


http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/26/ng.01.html


Now I have an answer to my lingering thoughts about the car not operable.

Phew, now I can free up some brain cells. :crazy:

DH and I :floorlaugh: last night when Nancy kept on saying that "the car wouldn't crank". How long has it been since folks had to "crank" a car?

 

[~n/t~]

There was an episode on Criminal Minds where a young boy killed his brother he had
anger issues. The police chief was a very good friend of the family and they covered it up and tried to make it look like the resident sex offender did it!

:what:

 

[~n/t~]

I just think something hinky is going on here....
I do not think its money!
Dont think its drugs
Not the Cartel either!

Now I do think someone possibly 2 ppl in that house knows exactly what happend.

I think the whole family knows.....now.

 

[txanmom]

I think the whole family knows.....now.

You took the words right outta my mouth, errr hands! Totally agree with this. :moo::twocents:

 

[Eileen730]

:what:

It was a very good episode of criminal minds!

Was Called
A shade of Gray!

 

[liz b.]

I recall they used it in the garage, the toyota, between the cars in the garage and on some vacuum cleaner accessories.

I guess about IC floor, I just wondered if it was apparrent to the naked eye, and if so why didn't SC see it when he started looking for her. That would have been very concerning to me.

I am *speculating* that the blood had been cleaned up. When and by whom are the interesting questions...JMO

Do you know if any of the other luminol tests were positive ? I read about the black gloves and knife with blood on it found in the uncle's car. But anything else ?

JMO

 

[~n/t~]

I hate to bring up the <the one who got away with murder case> but I see this case as perhaps heading that way. I did from the very beginning. Sergio telling his wife to get her butt home was just the tip of the iceberg. That's something you say to someone when there is trouble at the homefront.

:moo:

 

[A_News_Junkie]

Hi, thanks. It seems to be a problem with the website itself on iOS devices. I can read PDFs no problem but can't get that far. That's okay, they will get there someday.

Would one of you guys having problems seeing the docs try my link and see if it works for you and let me know. If it works and you guys who can't see them can view them, I can do this for all 6.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/121431458/Isabel-Celis-Packet-1

For late readers - all six packets are now done and the links are here:
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - AZ Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 Media & Document Dump (No Discussion)

 

[txanmom]

I am *speculating* that the blood had been cleaned up. When and by whom are the interesting questions...JMO

Do you know if any of the other luminol tests were positive ? I read about the black gloves and knife with blood on it found in the uncle's car. But anything else ?

JMO

just going off memory, the positives were the toyota driver's seat and her bedroom floor but I will go back and re-read and make sure. I was really tired last night when I was reading the whole thing.

I agree with you that the blood was cleaned up. I would like to know by whom as well. A stranger/intruder could probably care less about cleaning up after himself, don't you think? IMO/JMOO