GUILTY AZ - Timothy Romans, 39, & Vincent Romero, 29, slain, St Johns, 5 Nov 2008 - #6

[trofanji]

The children, "10,11 Year old boys torture younger boys" being discussed here 10,11 Year old boys torture younger boys - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community were actually horribly abused. I'm extremely curious were all of the supporters of this boy are in their support of them?


BBM

Would you have preferred the child walk away without any consequence at all? Based on a "technicality" that YOU determined?

Of course they do a horrible crime but the different is, they are in Europe, they can't be tried as adults and that is the main different to the US, the case will stay in juvenile court and their names will not be released, also Britain signs the children rights Charta. So they will definitely once be out to society same like the boy's in the Bulger Case. I'm happy that they will have a second chance because they are children!
I feel for the abused and harmed victim more as for the kids who does the crime, but I never will give up a child, regardless what they have done. So what consequences did you like for the kid's suffering in prison or help? I always plead for help and for a second chance for every kid.

http://www.unicef.org/crc/

the interesting question again is who and what led the kids to do the crime?

 

[trofanji]

BBM

Two men were brutally and coldly executed...in other words MURDERED. It doesn't matter a bit to me what he was charged with or plead to. He did it, and everyone knows it.

Here's an example...OJ was never convicted of murdering Nicole & Ron. No one was ever convicted for those murders. Does that mean Ron & Nicole weren't MURDERED?

It's no secret, I tend to be a victim's advocate and most of my opinions reflect that here on Websleuths.

I don't need a public diagnosis to form an opinion. I based that opinion on the video, the horrific nature of the boys crimes, witness statements, his lawyers own statements as well as the original recommendations for out of state placement in a locked residential treatment facility and my own experience as well as education. When his own lawyer says to ask him in three years, that's incredibly telling. I believe, without a doubt that this child was diagnosed with severe conduct disorder.

In this case, I have no doubts that CR will have a good outcome, and the diagnosis of the evaluation's is, -and I'm sure, different then the online diagnosis posted here based on a video tape of a very questionable interrogation.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Of course they do a horrible crime but the different is, they are in Europe, they can't be tried as adults and that is the main different to the US, the case will stay in juvenile court and their names will not be released, also Britain signs the children rights Charta. So they will definitely once be out to society same like the boy's in the Bulger Case. I'm happy that they will have a second chance because they are children!
I feel for the abused and harmed victim more as for the kids who does the crime, but I never will give up a child, regardless what they have done. So what consequences did you like for the kid's suffering in prison or help? I always plead for help and for a second chance for every kid.

http://www.unicef.org/crc/

the interesting question again is who and what led the kids to do the crime?

So at what magical age do you believe human beings are responsible for their actions and deserving of consequences for those actions?

 

[trofanji]

So at what magical age do you believe human beings are responsible for their actions and deserving of consequences for those actions?

Not before 12 or 13, than only in juvenile court until they are 18! As long they are children, for me the adults are responsible. Each kid 's behavior is the product of the environment where the child grows up.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Not before 12 or 13, than only in juvenile court until they are 18! As long they are children, for me the adults are responsible. Each kid 's behavior is the product of the environment where the child grows up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chargergal
Conduct disorder" refers to a group of behavioral and emotional problems in youngsters. Children and adolescents with this disorder have great difficulty following rules and behaving in a socially acceptable way. They are often viewed by other children, adults and social agencies as "bad" or delinquent, rather than mentally ill. Many factors may contribute to a child developing conduct disorder, including brain damage, child abuse, genetic vulnerability, school failure, and traumatic life experiences.

http://www.aacap.org/cs/root/facts_f...nduct_disorder

Why does everyone want to blame the child. He is a product of his enviornment. He needs help and yet so many people want to just throw away the key for this child. I do not. I still believe that our children can be rehabilitated.

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I don't know where the two of you ever got that idea ..........even the link above, claims no such thing.
__________________

 

[trofanji]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chargergal
Conduct disorder" refers to a group of behavioral and emotional problems in youngsters. Children and adolescents with this disorder have great difficulty following rules and behaving in a socially acceptable way. They are often viewed by other children, adults and social agencies as "bad" or delinquent, rather than mentally ill. Many factors may contribute to a child developing conduct disorder, including brain damage, child abuse, genetic vulnerability, school failure, and traumatic life experiences.

http://www.aacap.org/cs/root/facts_f...nduct_disorder

Why does everyone want to blame the child. He is a product of his enviornment. He needs help and yet so many people want to just throw away the key for this child. I do not. I still believe that our children can be rehabilitated.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't know where the two of you ever got that idea ..........even the link above, claims no such thing.
__________________

??? what has this to do with the answer of your former question?

So at what magical age do you believe human beings are responsible for their actions and deserving of consequences for those actions?

again here is the answer of your question
Not before 12 or 13, than only in juvenile court until they are 18! As long they are children, for me the adults are responsible. Each kid 's behavior is the product of the environment where the child grows up.

 

[trofanji]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chargergal
Conduct disorder" refers to a group of behavioral and emotional problems in youngsters. Children and adolescents with this disorder have great difficulty following rules and behaving in a socially acceptable way. They are often viewed by other children, adults and social agencies as "bad" or delinquent, rather than mentally ill. Many factors may contribute to a child developing conduct disorder, including brain damage, child abuse, genetic vulnerability, school failure, and traumatic life experiences.

http://www.aacap.org/cs/root/facts_f...nduct_disorder

Why does everyone want to blame the child. He is a product of his enviornment. He needs help and yet so many people want to just throw away the key for this child. I do not. I still believe that our children can be rehabilitated.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't know where the two of you ever got that idea ..........even the link above, claims no such thing.
__________________

and for me it's unfair to quote a person ( Chargergal ) who is not able to answer your question at this message board

 

[doublestop]

An Arizona boy who admitted shooting and killing his father and his father's friend aged just eight could soon be released into foster care and allowed to attend public school following a judge's ruling.
Christian Romero, who is now 15, became one of America's youngest murder suspects in 2008 when he used a .22 caliber hunting rifle to kill father Vincent Romero, 29, and Timothy Romans, 39.....

More at link:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3239230/Teen-admitting-shooting-father-man-dead-aged-just-eight-attend-public-high-school-adopted-judge-s-ruling.html

 

[Cubby]

Wow, I remember this case. There was a thread here for this case. It's not currently open, but the mods may want to open it again since there is "new news" regarding the case.

Here is thread 6 for this case.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Johns-double-homicide-6&p=4499918#post4499918

 

[ohiogirl]

Wow, I truly hope he has been helped. Of course, the foster home will be allowed to know all about his story. The Daily Mail interviewed his ex step-mom, and she seems to think his new foster home or school might not be told about his past. This is hogwash, imo.
I am torn about letting him out in the public, but hopefully, they know more about him than me, lol.

 

[steelman]

To everybody living at the foster home......you might want to lock your bedroom door at night.

This has gotten "bad idea" written all over it.

 

[ninij9]

If I found out my 15 year old son had a classmate that committed murder and was being allowed to attend school with him, I would raise holy hell. Schools are dangerous enough. It doesn't sound like he is cured, or rehabilitated enough. 25 probation violations is alot. 15 years old is not old enough for him to have been rehabilitated to the point where he should be exposed to other children. BAD idea. JMO. I hope if they do this they will have a community/public school meeting to let these parents know who will be among them (though I seriously doubt it). JMO


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[Cappuccino]

If I found out my 15 year old son had a classmate that committed murder and was being allowed to attend school with him, I would raise holy hell. Schools are dangerous enough. It doesn't sound like he is cured, or rehabilitated enough. 25 probation violations is alot. 15 years old is not old enough for him to have been rehabilitated to the point where he should be exposed to other children. BAD idea. JMO. I hope if they do this they will have a community/public school meeting to let these parents know who will be among them (though I seriously doubt it). JMO


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And that's why none of the parents should be told. There's no way he'll ever be able to live a normal life if people are raising holy hell because of his past everywhere he goes. The principal of the school and the foster parents are the only people who should be told about who he is.

 

[trex]

And that's why none of the parents should be told. There's no way he'll ever be able to live a normal life if people are raising holy hell because of his past everywhere he goes. The principal of the school and the foster parents are the only people who should be told about who he is.

I am new to this case, sorry if this has been covered already.. What was his motive for shooting & killing his father & his fathers friend? Was there a motive like continued abuse or did he do it "just because"?

 

[Cappuccino]

I am new to this case, sorry if this has been covered already.. What was his motive for shooting & killing his father & his fathers friend? Was there a motive like continued abuse or did he do it "just because"?

From memory, (and its five years ago so forgive me if my memory isn't accurate), it was a dysfunctional family in various ways, but not to the extent that would be described as "continued abuse." Maybe emotional abuse, but I wouldn't accuse the father of anything sexual or physical, (beyond spankings).

I also wouldn't accuse the boy of having done it "just because." It seemed like more of a grey area than that.

 

[Trino]

Don't know if you need to tell parents/teachers. His name is plastered on the release stories. People will know very soon.

 

[LaborDayRN]

In 2012, Whiting filed court papers against Romero after he moved to a group home in the Phoenix area, alleging he had breached his probation 25 times.

Among the allegations were that he had made a handgun gesture at a counselor while threatening to shoot her, shoved her against a wall, threatened to kill a roommate, destroyed a clock and attempted to run away. Of the initial 25 complaints, three were upheld.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ool-adopted-judge-s-ruling.html#ixzz3mIRFJTuc
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

 

[michmi]

I'm not convinced he's a safe person for the community and I pity the foster family and school he's placed in.

From what I'm reading he never really explained the motive other than he said his father was "suffering".

 

[sallye818]

In 2012, Whiting filed court papers against Romero after he moved to a group home in the Phoenix area, alleging he had breached his probation 25 times.

Among the allegations were that he had made a handgun gesture at a counselor while threatening to shoot her, shoved her against a wall, threatened to kill a roommate, destroyed a clock and attempted to run away. Of the initial 25 complaints, three were upheld.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ool-adopted-judge-s-ruling.html#ixzz3mIRFJTuc
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Wow, this sounds like a troubled person. Why not just wait until he is 18 or 21? I don't think public school and a foster home with other children is the appropriate place for him. Maybe some type of group home/juvenile halfway house? And if he continues to have probation violations, particularly violent ones, he will have to continue to be in custody. Sounds like he continues to need PROFESSIONALS to deal with him 24/7, and while I love and admire foster parents, they are not trained or equipped to deal with this ... nor are public school teachers with a room full of other kids to teach and discipline.

 

[ninij9]

And that's why none of the parents should be told. There's no way he'll ever be able to live a normal life if people are raising holy hell because of his past everywhere he goes. The principal of the school and the foster parents are the only people who should be told about who he is.

I am all for giving children a second chance, however the violence of his crimes tell me it is unacceptable to give him a chance at being normal if it endangers the safety of our children. Never mind the size of the lawsuit if this kid hurts another student or teacher and they were unaware that he was attending the school.

I say revisit the issue when he is 18 or 21. He is not old enough yet to understand the magnitude of his crime, if he was old enough, we would have incarcerated him for a long time. Can't have it both ways I think. I'm not trying to argue, every life of every child matters to me, including his, I just think the risks are astronomical.

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