GUILTY Bali - Sheila von Wiese Mack, 62, found dead in suitcase, 12 Aug 2014 #2

[Kamille]

Heather tells them they need to take her to the US embassy. Wish some one understood Indonesian, It's completely different from any western language

The police reports of randomly having strange people in the house make more sense now & that started when HM was really young I think -& when neither Sheila or she were home....

BBM

Just watched that video again and it sounds like she's saying "He was going to take us to the US Embassy". So who is she referring to? The taxi driver? I'd love to hear the story as told to the cops there in that hotel room.

MOO

 

[RR0004]

Little confused by the conflicting reports- ie, one report saying luggage was found in the garden, another saying it went downstairs on the trolley (silver suitcase on bottom)...many more examples along the way- just makes me wonder what the truth is. Never thought I'd wish that we had someone based over there. Guess all of our MSM is waiting for the trial.

 

[Kamille]

Little confused by the conflicting reports- ie, one report saying luggage was found in the garden, another saying it went downstairs on the trolley (silver suitcase on bottom)...many more examples along the way- just makes me wonder what the truth is. Never thought I'd wish that we had someone based over there. Guess all of our MSM is waiting for the trial.

I believe it was bloody towels and perhaps pillows etc that were found in the garden. Probably dropped over the balcony during the clean up. I have seen video of the police putting things into green garbage bags. Likely these were items found outside, not in the room, in order for people to get footage of it?

MOO

 

[Kamille]

Another video showing more of the same from BaliTv news...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFNDeujzSFk&list=UUu51YwFPlgeGkaEhDziI4QA

 

[Mountain Misst]

Excellent find Quester!! HM really did think she was untouchable as a US citizen didn't she?

Her birthdate is shown on that still of her passport. October 11, 1995

MOO

Thanks team... :loveyou:

 

[tarjessi]

When I hit the captions button, it said "Portuguese". Not sure if it is being translated into Portuguese...but we may have a better chance finding someone who speaks that language.

I tried the captions and tried to convert them from Portugese into English and it comes out as nonsensical rubbish unfortunately :/

 

[Kamille]

I wasn't aware that Bali police are alleging that HM and TS had sex both at the St Regis after the murder and again at the hotel that they were located in. So which room are they suggesting they had sex in? The one where SWM was killed or the one where TS lugged her body to?

http://www.news.com.au/world/heathe...la-von-wiesemack/story-fndir2ev-1227024982347

 

[tarjessi]

I always thought they took strong offence to drug transporting through airports because they don't want to be seen as some weak country - that all the tourist westerners feel they can take advantage of... & that it's more to do with pride for their country than anything.
Since one person isn't going to be able to smuggle that much in on their body or suitcase compared to the actual shipments hidden in concrete blocks & things. & if people are addicts, or want to try some drugs they'll find some way to take them. Marijuana cannot even kill a person - I swear to god they take it as a complete offence against their country - as if tourists just think they can casually walk even the mildest drug through their airport - hence the OTT harsh sentences for that.
Makes more sense to me ....since everyone seems to get away with more by paying bribes to get out of things there.

Bali does run a lot on bribes unfortunately from what I have heard. A good friend of mine visited years ago with her partner and they ended up playing soccer with some of the local kids. Anyway my friend's partner kicked the ball and it hit one of the kids on the head (complete accident - just as part of the gameplay) and the kid went to get his father who was a cop. The cop demanded 5000 rupiah up front (this was 10 years ago) or they would be taken to the police station and charged with assault. True story...and it is not the first I have heard from friends who have visited. It really depends, some people I know love it and have a great experience. I don't have any interest in visiting Bali because unfortunately a large number of Australians treat it as a toilet destination and I find the entire attitude completely appalling. Such a shame as the Bali people seem quite decent but I would get sick of drunken lout dickheads all over our streets all night, all year round as well. The thing is though bribes make a lot of things move in this world and Bali isn't the only place where this occurs. It occurs all over the world but I only have no desire because of the way Aussies treat Bali. I don't want to add to the ire...

O/T when I visited Malaysia in 2010 I met up with some other Aussies at the backpackers the first night and was so appalled by their behaviour I didn't hang out with any other Aussies for the rest of my two months overseas. I know a lot of tourists can be shockingly ignorant when visiting other countries and it happens everywhere but these girls were just straight up blatantly disrespectful constantly and wondered why they were treated poorly. I had a great time because I made friends with the locals and was even invited back to someone's place for Deepavali. I might not be Muslim but I purchased a hijab, learned how to wear one and abided by their rules of wearing them in places of worship or other special areas when visiting. It's like the tourists who visit Buddhist temples and walk around in their bikinis :/

 

[Orange Tabby]

Little confused by the conflicting reports- ie, one report saying luggage was found in the garden, another saying it went downstairs on the trolley (silver suitcase on bottom)...many more examples along the way- just makes me wonder what the truth is. Never thought I'd wish that we had someone based over there. Guess all of our MSM is waiting for the trial.

My recollection is this: what was unloaded from the trolley and put in the taxi was the silver murder suitcase (placed in the trunk) and two other bags (positioned in the back seat). That would hardly amount to the full complement of luggage for the three of them, particularly as Sheila and Heather had arrived with plans of being there for approximately two weeks.

I don't agree with any suggestion that bloody evidence was simply tossed from a balcony. That would be too easy for others to stumble upon quickly, and might easily have been discovered before the two perpetrators ever saw that fateful taxi they hoped would carry them away from the scene of their terrible crime. Again, from my recollection, the news reports specifically referred to suitcases "hidden" in the garden of the hotel. These would be the cases which kept from view the bloody towels and other evidence of the murder they had committed, which they hoped would not be noticed until they had made good their escape.

 

[Orange Tabby]

:welcome4:

Welcome Tabby! We are always glad to have new people to join us in our discussions. I am sure u will fit in just fine.

Thank you. But my teeth hurt just looking at all those carefree smiles being smashed repeatedly on the pavement! (Ha ha ha.)

 

[Orange Tabby]

Her [Heather's] birthdate is shown on that still of her passport. October 11, 1995

That's good information to have. Thanks for pointing it out. Note how many articles in the MSM are still wrong about this, and continue to refer to Heather as already 19 years old.

It has also been the case that in the last couple of days Sheila's new Chicago address on LSD has been revealed obliquely on this forum, but I note no one has explicitly pointed it out. Is it inappropriate or against this board's policy to do that? There has been discussion here of the Oak Park home on Linden and what it sold for, which I see as useful information if one considers money the motive or part of the motive. Is the Chicago condo amenable to the same discussion here? I won't disclose that address until I'm assured that this is appropriate and wanted. As I said earlier today, as a newbie, I don't want to get spanked!

 

[Kamille]

My recollection is this: what was unloaded from the trolley and put in the taxi was the silver murder suitcase (placed in the trunk) and two other bags (positioned in the back seat). That would hardly amount to the full complement of luggage for the three of them, particularly as Sheila and Heather had arrived with plans of being there for approximately two weeks.

I don't agree with any suggestion that bloody evidence was simply tossed from a balcony. That would be too easy for others to stumble upon quickly, and might easily have been discovered before the two perpetrators ever saw that fateful taxi they hoped would carry them away from the scene of their terrible crime. Again, from my recollection, the news reports specifically referred to suitcases "hidden" in the garden of the hotel. These would be the cases which kept from view the bloody towels and other evidence of the murder they had committed, which they hoped would not be noticed until they had made good their escape.

You're right. According to this article the gardeners found three suitcases hidden in the gardens with belongings and blood soaked hotel towels in them. There is also a lot of other information in this article, including that the taxi driver only waited an hour for them before he got a hold of hotel security, he arrived at the police station at about 1:45pm. I remember us trying to figure out the timing of when the body was discovered earlier in the other thread.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/bali-po...se-mack-murdered-in-bali-20140814-103xzv.html

 

[Curious Me]

You're right. According to this article the gardeners found three suitcases hidden in the gardens with belongings and blood soaked hotel towels in them. There is also a lot of other information in this article, including that the taxi driver only waited an hour for them before he got a hold of hotel security, he arrived at the police station at about 1:45pm. I remember us trying to figure out the timing of when the body was discovered earlier in the other thread.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/bali-po...se-mack-murdered-in-bali-20140814-103xzv.html

Thanks. I notice in this article they said they'd been kidnapped by six gangsters. I read in another article it was three armed men. Well, guess it doesn't matter because it was all a lie.

Bali police questioning daughter of American tourist Sheila Von Wiese Mack murdered in Bali
Date August 14, 2014
http://www.smh.com.au/world/bali-po...se-mack-murdered-in-bali-20140814-103xzv.html

Of the suspects' initial statement that they had been kidnapped by six gangsters, Mr Djoko said: "That is inconsistent with the facts we found at the scene".

Guess the fame was going to her head.

Heather Mack was laughing and joking as she was led from one room to another the police lockup on Thursday, smiling and saying "Britney Spears" at one point, and later, "Oh my God" as she laughed, apparently at the media attention.

 

[gitana1]

Capital punishment is practiced in the US, so I can't see anyone having serious objections if it is applied to a US citizen convicted of murder in another country ... that is, Bali and the US seem to have the same philosophy about what to do with murderers, so there aren't really any grounds for objections. If someone from Germany, where capital punishment is perceived as barbaric, was subjected to capital punishment in the US, that would be huge international news.

It's simple: We Americans generally believe that our system of justice is the fairest and best. We tend to believe that those executed in the states usually are guilty and also that the laws and legal systems of most other nations, especially in the third world can be arbitrary, draconian and barbaric. Americans absolutely flip out when one of their own faces execution in a foreign, third world nation.

I am just incredulous at how very stupid these 2 "masterminds" were in the things they did. Hard to believe there was a lot of premeditation going on (in the sense of real planning) but a definite premeditated acts of in the years before as the police were called 86 times, HM assaulted her mother, stole from her and obviously believed that her mother was denying HM all of the money that she believed she had a right to. She was obviously very hostile, aggressive and abusive towards her mother and saw her mother as an obstacle in her life. Well, now her big "obstacle" is gone and she is now alone, pregnant and facing life/death in a notoriously rough foreign prison.

It will be interesting to see how she deals with her sudden change in circumstances as she no longer has her mother to bail her out and look out for her as she also faces becoming a mother herself. Not that i think becoming a mother will suddenly make HM see how much her mother went thru for her, no, she seems the type that will consider her child to be more of a prop while she continues to put herself first. I understand they said that it is possible for her to keep the baby with her in prison but I would hope the child would be taken away. Considering how HM treated her mother, she should not be allowed to have control over a helpless infant.

People like this astound me. Just like Dellon Millard who was very affluent and privileged yet committed a stunningly stupid and senseless crime when he killed a man over a truck worth a few thousand dollars that he could have easily bought, many times over. To brazenly throw away your life, freedom and everything because you insist on having your way.

Me too. It's bizarre and fascinating to me.

 

[gitana1]

Just jumping off your post...

I believe someone was quoted as saying Tommy was into the drama. Remember his heart story and that he only had a short time to live. While I don't underestimate the effects of losing someone whom you were close to especially at such a young age when the deceased person is also very young, he may have over embellished his grief just a little. Or maybe not. But it can in no way be tied into what he chose to do in Bali, whatever his role may have been.

MOO

BBM: Can you refresh my memory about that fake story he told and where we heard about it??

Interesting video about HM from the perspective of young neighbours who grew up with her and other friends. Didn't know she wanted to be an actress and move to LA.

http://www.myfoxchicago.com/video?clipId=10471783&autoStart=true

You and Quester are coming up with some incredible finds!!!

Hi. Newbie here. I've read all the posts in this thread and the one before it, which is now closed.

Thought I'd join the discussion. If I slip up in any way, please be gentle with me!

WELCOME NEW FRIEND!!!!!!!!!!!!

Someone yesterday asked about foreigners executed in Indonesia.

Wikipedia has an entry that lists the people executed in Indonesia in the Post-Suharto era. There were no executions in 1999, 2000, 2002, 2003, 2009, 2010, 2011, or 2012.

Most of those executed appear to be Indonesian. Exceptions are the executions of Chaubey (from India) in 2004, Prasad (Thailand) 2004, Sirilak (Thailand) 2004, Okoye (Nigeria) 2008, Nwaliosa (Nigeria) 2008, Wilson (Malawi) 2013. Note that none of these people are from first world (read: rich tourist) countries. They are also quite likely all to be people of color.

The total number of people executed from 1999 to 2013 is 25. Their crimes are broken down into three categories: murder (16), drugs (6), terrorism (3).

It appears there can be a very long time between conviction and execution. Of the three murderers executed in 2013, one was convicted in 1991 (so 22 years from conviction to execution) and the other two were jointly convicted in 2003 (a decade from conviction to execution).

The Wikipedia article also claims that among those on death row in Indonesia are citizens of 18 different countries. Five of the countries represented (Australia, France, Great Britain, Netherlands, and the U.S.) would be seen by Indonesia as the source of rich tourists. Wikipedia also says of all foreign nationals currently on death row, all but one are there for drug offenses.

I don’t place wholesale trust in Wikipedia, but some sources and enough details are laid out that anyone who wanted to confirm the material could probably do so. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_Indonesia

I am certain neither of them will be executed. They may be sentenced to death but not executed.

I am truly confused by this I have to say. That both of them would have made the same "racial profiling" complaint from two different police stations. They are both mixed race children. Are they really offended by someone offering them KFC or was that just a convenient excuse to throw out the racism card against the Bali LE? I actually do "get it" with HM. I get everything she was trying to do to make herself an international example of someone they better not mess with. Trying right from the beginning to throw them off and to get them to be scared of her as a young, black, pregnant, wealthy American woman. She was pulling out all the stops to make someone of importance believe she was being abused and mistreated and I guess she expected this to be a benefit to her and that legal eagles would just swoop right in there and save her and get her home pronto. Or at least work to her advantage as far as how she was going to be treated right from the get go. And in the US it probably would have. They would have seen her for the "PITA" that she is and they would have handled her with kid gloves. And perhaps in Bali it did too, for a while. I think the sexual assault accusations, unexplained needle marks and prenatal vitamin complaints might have been the point of going too far. I'll bet she learned that's what you do to get better treatment from her time spent with other juvies and just from hanging around her "bad crowd". But was Tommy part of that "bad crowd"?

It just seems strange to me that he also made the racism remarks about the KFC. Although we haven't heard of any other complaints he's made. Doesn't mean he didn't make them, just that he didn't have a blowhard US attorney on speed dial to announce them to the press I suppose.

MOO

I have a feeling either one or the other made the statement and they just attributed it to both. BTW, where did you get the info that they were taken to two, separate police stations? I missed that!

Whoa! This video has some footage of what looks like HM & TS in the room in which they were discovered the day after the assault:

8/14/14: http://www.balitv.tv/index.php/seputar-bali/item/4686-pembunuh-bule-as-dibekuk-di-kamar-hotel

Another great find. Boy, she is really something. The imperious, arrogant and snotty manner of speaking right after being arrested for the investigation of her own mother's murder.

This is the kind of thing about this case that fascinates me and makes me relish the thought of her trying to bully or strong arm the authorities there. I'm a very sensitive person and never get off on the suffering of others, but I must admit...here, the thought of HM throwing major tantrums in a Bali jail, and having everything she cherished in life taken from her while she sits there, waiting to be judged by people who will not be swayed my her mother;s efforts to protect her, by her identity, etc., it is an extremely satisfying feeling.

I know that is probably terrible but I can't help it.

 

[Orange Tabby]

Ice in the Cooler?

Heather Mack craves ice cream. So says news.com.au (link at the bottom of this post). Excerpts:

"...sources say she has been craving ice cream since being locked up."

This weekend "she was taken to a police hospital for treatment, suffering laryngitis..." [OMG, was she whining too much?!]

"Denpasar police say they hope to question her again today (Monday) about her mother’s killing. It comes as authorities in Bali say that an American lawyer, who had said he was coming to Indonesia to represent Mack, is no longer representing her." [He's in hospital too, right? Hoping for a medical infusion of cash perhaps.]

"But now another Bali lawyer has been appointed to act for the young woman."

Mack and Schaefer "are now being held in different Bali police jails."

The photos are all the same old stuff. See:

http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/b...ce-cream-in-jail/story-fnh81fz8-1227043816212

 

[Orange Tabby]

Thanks for the welcome Gitana1.

... I'm a very sensitive person and never get off on the suffering of others, but I must admit...here, the thought of HM throwing major tantrums in a Bali jail, and having everything she cherished in life taken from her while she sits there, waiting to be judged by people who will not be swayed my her mother;s efforts to protect her, by her identity, etc., it is an extremely satisfying feeling.

I don’t think Heather Mack knows just how bleak her future really is. I suspect that there will be a continuous slide down in her conditions:

1. Right now, she appears to be receiving possibly the best treatment Indonesian authorities ever offer a suspect. They want her to talk and she is pregnant, so they give her McDonald’s and hustle her off to the doctor whenever she moans and groans too much.

2. At some point they will decide she has said all that she is going to say before trial. At that juncture they will continue to offer her better than average access to a doctor, not for her sake, but for her unborn child. Her food will be noticeably nutritious, but probably not what she’d prefer. McDonald’s will be out. So too will be any jail-provided cigarettes (if that's where she's getting them).

3. After the baby is born, her incarceration situation will decline again. It will probably be more spacious than that of the average inmate, but again only because of the child. I doubt she’ll have private quarters; she’ll share with a few other moms. She won’t be happy with the diapers provided, as she’ll likely be given the cloth type and be expected to wash them herself.

4. After the baby is six months old it will be expelled from incarceration, and Heather will then face the true conditions which will be her lot for many long years to come: a crowded dorm room with lots of other women, no privacy, a squat toilet, no AC, no decent food, no friends, at least some women willing to return her bullying with even more harsh attacks, only black market shopping for which she probably will have no funds, access to the internet only if she can scare up the money, and impossibly long dreary years ahead of her with no one caring when or if she gets out.

My guess is that her trial and conviction will take place sometime between (2) and (3).

 

[RR0004]

Hey Gitana!
Here's info about TS....

The mother of the young woman who dated Schaefer for two years said he told tall tales, including that he had a heart condition and was perhaps going to die.

http://www.oakpark.com/News/Articles/8-19-2014/Complex-portrait-emerges-of-Tommy-Schaefer/

 

[tristessa]

"Heather Mack was laughing and joking as she was led from one room to another the police lockup on Thursday, smiling and saying "Britney Spears" at one point, and later, "Oh my God" as she laughed, apparently at the media attention. "

I bet she was thinking of the insanity defence - Which they probably don't even have in Indonesia - even so they both tested for NO psychiatric conditions.

I have a feeling she'll make at least some casual indonesian friends in prison though - not with everyone and she will get hostility and be blackmailed by guards and other inmates because she's a westerner, but she seems able at being sociable enough - wonder if she will learn Indonesian. Some foreigners become fluent - some only speak a few words still after years.

I bet they'll only get 15 years unfortunately...hope they don't, because it means she gets out at around 45 & probably still able to go off and have another child/family at that age...not fair that some of the bali9 (Who are non-violent and repentant) get 'death'. Not like she won't be traumatised by it though

 

[SouthAussie]

Looking back through some old articles, it is the first time that I have noticed this .... it is just in two early articles .. I must have missed it somehow.

"While suspicion remains on both young people, as they were the only ones seen entering the room on CCTV footage, police said their initial inquiries suggested the perpetrator of the crime was the daughter."

http://www.coloradonewsday.com/news...ocialite-62-was-found-dead-in-a-suitcase.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ter-luxury-hotel-lobby-just-hours-murder.html