Bosma Murder Trial 02.18.16 - Day 11

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  • #201
My problem is, that I am trying to use logic where DM is concerned. :) What would of changed in availability between 2011 and 2013 for fuel availability in Mexico ? Probably worse, not better.
DM had already made the trip to Baja in his red ram with a 5th wheel in tow. You're not going to get to Mexico from Southern Ontario without doing some pretty serious mountain driving so IMHO, the 2011 trip with a trailer in tow would have been enough for DM and Baja gang to know that if they were going to make the trip again, they should probably be taking a diesel. MOO
 
  • #202
With all the evidence this morning centering around the incinerator I have more questions that have popped into my mind.

Dr. Rogers stated that the Eliminator had been cleaned out. She came to that determination because they should have found more of TB.

Where was it cleaned out? Who cleaned it out? Did they have to wait for it to cool (I think yes) before carrying out this task? What did they do with the remains?

I think it was cleaned out at the Hangar and we may see evidence of that coming up with the Security Footage. That may be what finally ties MS into everything. We will actively see him being culpable.

Just guessing, but, I have a terrible feeling that they bagged what they got out of there and quite simply threw it in the garbage. They would have had commercial dumpsters at their disposal at the Hangar and it would be simple to just bag it and toss it.

Unfortunately, TB's remains are somewhere and I don't think we will ever find them.

I am so sad for this family.
 
  • #203
And DM had put an order in for a rush black to red paint job on TB's truck. IMO, he may have had concerns about the engine in his 2005 making the trip and was just going to do a VIN swap between the two vehicles. Nice fresh paint, new interior and 'ya good to go. Could have been much easier than trying to switch the engines. MOO


Doesn't the VIN give information such as the year, make and model when LE look them up? How would he expect to pass off a cummins diesel as a hemi gas model, does he have a way to change the background records for the VIN as well?

I am only asking because I know someone who wanted to do this to a vehicle years ago, and they were told that they wouldn't be able to fool a cop or boarder guard who looked up the VIN. And that was technology from 25 years ago, so I would think it would get more detailed, not less.

All my personal opinion only.
 
  • #204
Questions here have been asked about items found on the two burn sites, its quite possible that personal items were left in the center consol/seat when or if the seats were burned there.

Imho only.

I do believe they were talking about the larger burn site where the seat belt buckles were found so I think this is entirely possible and quite likely what the items were from. I am curious as to why they didn't talk about the other burn site and what, if anything, was found there. :waitasec:

MOO
 
  • #205
Tomorrow was supposed to make up for the holiday this past Monday.

And it will. The attorneys have legal arguments. The day started off today with legal arguments. The judge obviously made a decision to postpone those arguments until tomorrow and not call in the jury. So it is a court day, the reporters will be there, but the jury won't. So nothing can be tweeted.

HTH
 
  • #206
DM, SS and AM went to Baja, Mexico in May 2012 with the red Ram truck, the trailer that TB's truck was found in, and one of his two modified Jeeps to enter the Baja 500 off road race. FWIW, DM was driving, AM was riding shotgun and SS was the official mechanic. DM rolled the Jeep within the first 6 miles so he did not complete the race. However both he and AM got tattoos to mark the occasion.

The 45th Annual Baja 500 race started on May 30th, 2013. The official pre running of the course started May 15th, 2013. So during the first week of May, it appears that DM was getting his "employees" to build a new trailer with special compartments (looks like the one he hid TB's truck in had seen better days) and was looking for a diesel Dodge Ram truck to pull it, telling IT that he was going to car races in Calgary. Stands to reason to me that he was going to head down for the Baja 500 race again or he really was going to another off road race in Calgary. We haven't researched what race would be going on out there in May 2013 as this is just new information during the trial.

Personally I still think that he was heading back to Baja. He mixes some truth in with his lies it seems. And he had the tattoo but had not yet completed the race. ;)

MOO

I would love to hear of DMs body language and reactions when or if this epic 45th Baja race is discussed. He missed it and it would be interesting to see how that affects him.
 
  • #207
It was stated when the trial started - I believe by Adam Carter, but possibly someone from the Spec - that the trial would be Monday-Thursday throughout, so no trial activity on any Fridays.

Doesn't the VIN give information such as the year, make and model when LE look them up? How would he expect to pass off a cummins diesel as a hemi gas model, does he have a way to change the background records for the VIN as well?

I am only asking because I know someone who wanted to do this to a vehicle years ago, and they were told that they wouldn't be able to fool a cop or boarder guard who looked up the VIN. And that was technology from 25 years ago, so I would think it would get more detailed, not less.

All my personal opinion only.

Uh, well, DM hasn't been shown to be good about the details. He probably did not know that (not common knowledge anyway) and probably didn't take that into account when he planned this crime...just like he didn't pre-plan to hide phone activity, fingerprints, the incinerator...
 
  • #208
WI think it was cleaned out at the Hangar and we may see evidence of that coming up with the Security Footage. That may be what finally ties MS into everything. We will actively see him being culpable.

Just guessing, but, I have a terrible feeling that they bagged what they got out of there and quite simply threw it in the garbage. They would have had commercial dumpsters at their disposal at the Hangar and it would be simple to just bag it and toss it.

Unfortunately, TB's remains are somewhere and I don't think we will ever find them.

I am so sad for this family.

<rsbm>

This is exactly what happened to Billy Mason, another young Hamilton-area father who went missing in 2006. He was shot and incinerated by two men, Jeremy Hall and Jason Lusted, and his remains have never been found.

&#8220;Over the next couple of hours, Billy Mason&#8217;s body was incinerated,&#8221; Fraser told the jury. The ashes were placed in animal feed bags.

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2098640-billy-mason-s-murder-may-be-tied-to-rip-off/


The similarities between the two cases are eerie. Susan Clairmont even tweeted that the Bosma case was "like the Billy Mason case all over again".

https://twitter.com/susanclairmont/status/334311166631370752
 
  • #209
<rsbm>

This is exactly what happened to Billy Mason, another young Hamilton-area father who went missing in 2006. He was shot and incinerated by two men, Jeremy Hall and Jason Lusted, and his remains have never been found.



http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2098640-billy-mason-s-murder-may-be-tied-to-rip-off/


The similarities between the two cases are eerie. Susan Clairmont even tweeted that the Bosma case was "like the Billy Mason case all over again".

https://twitter.com/susanclairmont/status/334311166631370752

Wow, no joke:
On Feb. 24, 2006, William James Mason was &#8220;abducted at gunpoint from his apartment in downtown Hamilton by Jeremy Hall and Jason Lusted. Billy was never seen again,&#8221; the Crown began.

That day Hall, who rented a farm in Alma, near Guelph, and Lusted, who lived near Sarnia, met in Hamilton. They were &#8220;business partners of a sort,&#8221; said Fraser. &#8220;Their business was crime.&#8221;

Together they had stolen cars and committed other thefts.

Hall asked Lusted to go with him &#8220;to speak with a guy.&#8221; They drove Hall&#8217;s truck to Billy&#8217;s apartment on Main Street East in Hamilton. A person visiting Billy let them in.

Hall pulled a sawed-off shotgun from under his coat, the Crown said. Lusted hadn&#8217;t known it was there.

Hall ordered Billy, 27, to come along. In the truck, Hall allegedly asked Billy why he set him up. Billy answered that he hadn&#8217;t.

On a desolate road in Haldimand County, Hall ordered Billy out of the truck then &#8220;shot him once in the torso,&#8221; according to Fraser. Billy &#8220;stumbled off the dirt road into a field where he died.&#8221;

Lusted panicked. Hall allegedly fired a shot into the air and said to him: &#8220;Do you want to be next?&#8221;

Hall then pulled out a knife and said he wanted to make sure Billy was dead. Lusted will testify he did not see what happened next.

The men left Billy&#8217;s body in the field, drove back to Hamilton to pick up Lusted&#8217;s car. They caravanned to the Niagara region, stopping to fill a jerry can with gas. They parked the truck &#8212; stolen weeks earlier &#8212; in a farm field and torched it. A passing school bus driver reported the blaze to police.

Lusted got rid of the shotgun by putting it in a car at the East End Auto shop on Barton Street, where Hall knew the owners. Hall retrieved it from there, the Crown said.

On the evening of March 1, Hall and Lusted met in downtown Hamilton, drove to Billy&#8217;s body, wrapped it in plastic, placed it into the back of another pickup and drove it to Hall&#8217;s farm. He ordered Lusted to build a bonfire.

&#8220;Over the next couple of hours, Billy Mason&#8217;s body was incinerated,&#8221; Fraser told the jury. The ashes were placed in animal feed bags.
 
  • #210
Thanks to everyone for spelling out the follow-the-trucks game.

So they were highly motivated to get a truck AND a new trailer built with a short deadline (Baja in late May).

Buying a truck wasn't feasible, so it had to be theft and murder.

Millard was able to pay $15k for the incinerator in summer 2012, but not $25k for a truck he REALLY wanted, less than a year later. Definitely confused about the financial situation.

As I found out when I went to buy a new car, you can't put a vehicle on a credit card. Their limit was $2000. They don't want to pay the credit card fees on a large credit purchase. I just wanted to get the points on my credit card. :)

So...everything else for this trip could likely be purchased mainly on credit. DM's credit cards, not MillardAir cards. I believe he also called his "business" Millard Properties. Where he was doing the buying, renting and selling of real estate as seen on the cards that were in his possession. But there might have been a hold on any more large purchases through MillardAir at the time while WM's estate was being sorted out? Considering that in May, there was no income coming in and a whole lot of debt likely needing to be paid?

So perhaps today's witness is the first we're seeing of a motive and why he didn't just "buy a truck".

MOO
 
  • #211
  • #212
Feb 18 2016 2:02 PM
Court now back in session. Waiting on the jury.
Adam Carter

Feb 18 2016 2:02 PM
Jury being led in now.
 
  • #213
Feb 18 2016 2:06 PM
Next witness is Evan Snider.

Feb 18 2016 2:07 PM
He's a resident of Ayr, Ont. He's a hog farmer.
 
  • #214
Doesn't the VIN give information such as the year, make and model when LE look them up? How would he expect to pass off a cummins diesel as a hemi gas model, does he have a way to change the background records for the VIN as well?

I am only asking because I know someone who wanted to do this to a vehicle years ago, and they were told that they wouldn't be able to fool a cop or boarder guard who looked up the VIN. And that was technology from 25 years ago, so I would think it would get more detailed, not less.

All my personal opinion only.
IMO, DM would have had the truck legally registered. It's possible. MOO

"3. Where a vehicle for which a permit is currently validated is modified so that it does not correspond to the description of the vehicle on the permit, the owner of the vehicle shall apply to the Ministry for a new permit for the vehicle within six days after the modification. R.R.O. 1990, Reg. 628, s. 3."
https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/900628
 
  • #215
Feb 18 2016 2:07 PM
Ayr is also the area where the incinerator was found.

Feb 18 2016 2:08 PM
Back in 2013, Snider also had a cash crop on Rosedale Road. He spoke with police on May 13, 2013.

Feb 18 2016 2:09 PM
He leased land on a property in Ayr. Initially he leased the farm from a cousin - then after two years he had sold the farm to Dellen Millard. So he was leasing from Millard, in the end.

Feb 18 2016 2:10 PM
Snider points out Millard in the courtroom. Millard waves to him from his seat.
 
  • #216
With all the evidence this morning centering around the incinerator I have more questions that have popped into my mind.

Dr. Rogers stated that the Eliminator had been cleaned out. She came to that determination because they should have found more of TB.

Where was it cleaned out? Who cleaned it out? Did they have to wait for it to cool (I think yes) before carrying out this task? What did they do with the remains?

I think it was cleaned out at the Hangar and we may see evidence of that coming up with the Security Footage. That may be what finally ties MS into everything. We will actively see him being culpable.

Just guessing, but, I have a terrible feeling that they bagged what they got out of there and quite simply threw it in the garbage. They would have had commercial dumpsters at their disposal at the Hangar and it would be simple to just bag it and toss it.

Unfortunately, TB's remains are somewhere and I don't think we will ever find them.

I am so sad for this family.

I believe that if the missing remains had been thrown in the garbage that they would have been much easier to locate. Police can track which trucks came at which times, estimate which load it would have been in, and than would have been able to map it out at the dump. There was a neat tv show called Popular Mechanics for Kids that showed how this is done in Canada.

If DM wanted to ensure that the remains were never found, he could have hopped into one of his planes or helicopters and scattered the ashes. Similarly, MS could have dumped them from a speeding car in the country and they would have been very hard to find. Much harder than if they were put in a bag that was then collected by a stranger and brought to a controlled facility, anyway.

I am so sad for this family too, on that I think we all agree. Is it possible that they (or one or the other) are witholding the information on the whereabouts of the missing remains to use as a bargaining chip for a lesser sentence if they are convicted?

My opinion only
 
  • #217
Feb 18 2016 2:11 PM
He rented land for a cash crop on 57 acres. You'd plant it in a week, and then harvest it once the crop had grown.
Adam Carter

molly hayesVerified account &#8207;@mollyhayes 2m2 minutes ago
Originally it was his cousin John Snider that owned the property, and when it was sold to Dellen Millard. #Bosma

Feb 18 2016 2:12 PM
Planting would be done by May 10, he says, then harvesting would start in October.
 
  • #218
I think this refers back to yesterday...

There was a question about a long pole with a flat piece on the end. The question was vague and DM's lawyer made a comment about it (about assuming or something?).
They were talking about the clean-out pole for the incinerator. It can be seen in the image below. Wonder if there were prints on it, or residue from the clean-out.

http://i.cbc.ca/1.3452584.1455749140!/fileImage/httpImage/image.png_gen/derivatives/4x3_620/millard-farm-the-eliminator.png

Someone speculated earlier that perhaps MS (or DM?) is on video using it.
 
  • #219
God, I would be mortified if there were still 'engagement' pics of me online, with that man in that hangar.

And she'll get to see his face again when she testifies, but IIRC they were still friends at the time of his arrest
 
  • #220
Feb 18 2016 2:07 PM
Ayr is also the area where the incinerator was found.

Feb 18 2016 2:08 PM
Back in 2013, Snider also had a cash crop on Rosedale Road. He spoke with police on May 13, 2013.

Feb 18 2016 2:09 PM
He leased land on a property in Ayr. Initially he leased the farm from a cousin - then after two years he had sold the farm to Dellen Millard. So he was leasing from Millard, in the end.

Feb 18 2016 2:10 PM
Snider points out Millard in the courtroom. Millard waves to him from his seat.

Of course he does.....
 
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