breach of promise

[SyraKelly]

I believe it's still technically illegal for any of the grand jurors to talk to the media about what happened. I have 2 theories on it:

One of the grand jurors saw John doing his book tour, and it was the last straw, and contacted Brennan.

Someone tipped off Brennan, and he started contacting grand jurors, who told him what the indictment was.

Thanks Eileen-so if the judge allows all the transcripts to be release
the grand jury can then talk all they want-right??

 

[SyraKelly]

Other question

If the grand jury saw AH and the Ramseys/lawyers on TV 17 yrs ago saying-No indictment was handed down
Could the jury go on TV and say-wait a minute..thats a lie...we did indict??

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Other question

If the grand jury saw AH and the Ramseys/lawyers on TV 17 yrs ago saying-No indictment was handed down
Could the jury go on TV and say-wait a minute..thats a lie...we did indict??

No, I believe that's illegal. It's illegal to talk to the media at all due to the secrecy laws. I'm guessing though that going after the GJ members 13 years later for simply saying we indicted (and not giving out any other information) is just a waste. But if one of them was all over the media, maybe writing a book, then it would turn into a criminal matter. And I believe only a few of the GJ members actually said anything back in January, so even now, a lot of them do not want to speak out (probably worried about any repercussions).

 

[Tadpole12]

Lifetime gag order is likely
Ramsey grand jury members may be issued lifetime gag order
May 4, 1999
http://web.dailycamera.com/extra/ramsey/1999/04arams.html

"The oath taken by jurors includes the pledge to "keep secret your own counsel and that of your fellows touching the present service." Witnesses, though, must only keep quiet "until and unless an indictment or report is issued."

But such lifetime gag-orders, while mandated by law, are rarely enforced, legal experts say. "Nobody pays any attention to their oath of secrecy," University of Denver law professor Frank Jamison said."

 

[dodie20]

Lifetime gag order is likely
Ramsey grand jury members may be issued lifetime gag order
May 4, 1999
http://web.dailycamera.com/extra/ramsey/1999/04arams.html

"The oath taken by jurors includes the pledge to "keep secret your own counsel and that of your fellows touching the present service." Witnesses, though, must only keep quiet "until and unless an indictment or report is issued."

But such lifetime gag-orders, while mandated by law, are rarely enforced, legal experts say. "Nobody pays any attention to their oath of secrecy," University of Denver law professor Frank Jamison said."

I don't know if a situation with these kinds of circumstances has ever come up though. Here you have the indicted parties and their attorneys lying on, manipulating and misrepresenting the jurors. Shouldn't this be enough to nullify a gag order? Shouldn't they have the legal right to defend the truth about themselves?

 

[madeleine]

"Mr. Ramsey will have no access to whatever evidence the prosecutors presented to the grand jury and will have no ability to disprove those allegations in a court of law. Nor will the public have any ability to evaluate the propriety of the indictment unless the entire grand jury record is unsealed and opened to public view."

he wants to get his hands on ALL the evidence IMO

 

[madeleine]

http://www.dailycamera.com/news/bou...nd-jury-record-not-only-indictment?source=rss

Chief Trial Deputy Sean Finn filed a notice to the court with Ramsey's letter on Monday. However, he wrote, "This filing does not alter the position of the office of the District Attorney as stated in its response to order to show cause."

 

[UKGuy]

http://www.dailycamera.com/news/bou...nd-jury-record-not-only-indictment?source=rss

Chief Trial Deputy Sean Finn filed a notice to the court with Ramsey's letter on Monday. However, he wrote, "This filing does not alter the position of the office of the District Attorney as stated in its response to order to show cause."

madeleine,
If the indictment was released it would probably be redacted with a minimum amount of forensic evidence.

The R's appear to be suggesting the legal basis for the release is contradicted via the redacting process, so all the evidence and paperwork should be released.

JR appears to be rolling the dice on this one, lets hope he gets his wish, since he might still end up in court!

.

 

[madeleine]

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingn...nd-jury-record-not-only-indictment?source=rss

Garnett said he filed Ramsey's letter with the court because "My office's position is as a custodian of archival documents, and it is my duty to handle them in a way that's fair and forthwith with the court and doesn't interfere with the possibility we could prosecute this case in the future for a charge in which the statute of limitations has not run."





yeah,like they got the b@lls to do that

 

[madeleine]

of course we were all ticked off back when M.Lacy "exonerated" the Ramseys but I am afraid we will witness the consequences of her stupidity&bias only from now on...she complicated everything and probably ruined all the chances (which were slim anyway) of a future prosecution.

 

[Nom de plume]

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingn...nd-jury-record-not-only-indictment?source=rss

Garnett said he filed Ramsey's letter with the court because "My office's position is as a custodian of archival documents, and it is my duty to handle them in a way that's fair and forthwith with the court and doesn't interfere with the possibility we could prosecute this case in the future for a charge in which the statute of limitations has not run."





yeah,like they got the b@lls to do that

There's only one crime where the statute has not run out, nor ever will.

But yeah, you're right, never happen.

 

[madeleine]

There's only one crime where the statute has not run out, nor ever will.

But yeah, you're right, never happen.

I think there are two,murder and sex offense against a child...IMO they got better chances with the second...dunno....
if you can prove who abused JB and if this was indeed chronic maybe you got the murder motive?

 

[BOESP]

I could be wrong but I got the impression from Kolar's book that kidnapping would be an available charge based on a technicality of how kidnapping is defined.

 

[dodie20]

I've been thinking about JR's request and I'm sitting here wondering, 'who does he think he is'? Does he really think he's still in charge of this show? Does he still think he has power through his multi million dollar business? It's not 1996 anymore. Speaking of money, what exactly has he done to earn a living besides write books about his murdered daughter? I remember awhile back he was crying poor and said he had to live on his boat...well, good grief! I doubt it was a raggedy little row boat, probably a fancy houseboat or yacht. moo

 

[madeleine]

I've been thinking about JR's request and I'm sitting here wondering, 'who does he think he is'? Does he really think he's still in charge of this show? Does he still think he has power through his multi million dollar business? It's not 1996 anymore. Speaking of money, what exactly has he done to earn a living besides write books about his murdered daughter? I remember awhile back he was crying poor and said he had to live on his boat...well, good grief! I doubt it was a raggedy little row boat, probably a fancy houseboat or yacht. moo

was thinking of posting the same thing earlier!~he was used to treat the DA people like they were his toys,he has to understand that this won't work forever,it's not all about JR wants this,JR wants that.

his "letter" ...pfff....how did they dare NOT ask for his permission?!how did they not consult him first?wth?who does he think he is in this?he's the SUSPECT fgs

 

[dodie20]

was thinking of posting the same thing earlier!~he was used to treat the DA people like they were his toys,he has to understand that this won't work forever,it's not all about JR wants this,JR wants that.

his "letter" ...pfff....how did they dare NOT ask for his permission?!how did they not consult him first?wth?who does he think he is in this?he's the SUSPECT fgs

I hope they do nothing more than file his letter right along with all the other nuisance/crackpot letters they get. We've always heard about JR's arrogance, and here it is! He wants to talk about defaming reputations now, but maybe he should have worried about that when he spread the lie that the jury voted Not to indict. Now there's some defamation, imo! I sure wouldn't want somebody accusing me of thinking and acting in a way that I didn't, especially regarding something as serious as a 6 year old little girl's murder. It was bad enough watching him walk around unindicted, with his reputation unsullied, but he couldn't just thank his lucky stars and shut up about it. He had to brag. moo

 

[madeleine]

I hope they do nothing more than file his letter right along with all the other nuisance/crackpot letters they get. We've always heard about JR's arrogance, and here it is! He wants to talk about defaming reputations now, but maybe he should have worried about that when he spread the lie that the jury voted Not to indict. Now there's some defamation, imo! I sure wouldn't want somebody accusing me of thinking and acting in a way that I didn't, especially regarding something as serious as a 6 year old little girl's murder. It was bad enough watching him walk around unindicted, with his reputation unsullied, but he couldn't just thank his lucky stars and shut up about it. He had to brag. moo

once again it's all about HIM ,his reputation,his defence.NOT A SINGLE WORD ABOUT JONBENET OR HER DEATH OR LET'S FIND OUT WHO DID THIS.

 

[princesspjs]

What John Ramsey thought yesterday:

John Ramsey says release the whole grand jury file! Not sure that's really what he wants to happen but I see the RST manipulation kicking into full force...

http://www.dailycamera.com/ci_24350597

What John Ramsey thinks today:

John Ramsey says he's opposed to the possible release of documents in an indictment related to the 1996 killing of his 6-year-old daughter, JonBenet.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/10/2...ase-indictment-in-16-death/?intcmp=latestnews

Could it have to do with the fact that the JonBenet indictment has been turned over to the judge now?

http://www.dailycamera.com/news/bou...a-turns-over-jonbenet-ramsey-indictment-judge

 

[midwest mama]

Yes, with the evidence as we know it, and the evidence that was handed to the GJ, I will agree with those here who look at Reasonable Doubt and cross finger pointing as stumbling blocks to charges and prosecution.

But here's something to ponder: Michael Kane said (in my words): what the public knows is not as it seems. There are more secrets being guarded and I would bet my house on the fact that the evidence brought before the GJ was barely what AH HAD to hand over in order to satisfy those who were pressuring him to call the GJ. From what I've learned, any DA who was worth a plug nickel would have withheld things that would have been used later when building a case. All that is needed to be used by the GJ is enough evidence to find Probable Cause to indict. The case can then be fully pursued and investigated with all the plugs pulled out.

It's even been disclosed that there have intentionally been things redacted from any sources that are being held exclusively for questioning a charged suspect.

So, before we give up on assuming that this case might still find it's way to a courtroom, we have to believe that IF JR is brought in, there will be no open ends leaving ANY reasonable doubt. Felony murder does not require absolute proof that he tied the ligature.....just that he was there when it was and did nothing to stop it. And circumstantial evidence that IS available to us, is pretty damning in convincing me that JR was awake and participating in everything that happened to JB from at least after the time of the head blow. Though I happen to also believe he was involved prior.

I cannot accept that he knew nothing about her death until he might have discovered her body sometime that morning. IMO, because he knew she was already dead and stashed in the WC, he put on the Mr. Cool presentation to all who arrived that morning in order to appear as if he was prepared to be the stoic kidnapper contact and be able to look like a hero. IMO, R's simply thought the cops would go away after no call came and all assumed it was the 27th when the call would come.....that the cops would set up the taps, maybe post surveillance, then disappear until the next morning.

Their friends coming in took care of crime scene contamination and a way to get Burke, and maybe even later, Patsy, away from the house so John would be alone to take care of the ransom details (and disposal of JB's body), Glitch was LE calling in Arndt, and her decision to stick tight calling for assistance. She could have done some things differently, yes, but she knew not to leave because of her intuition.

I would like to blame JR alone, but admit that in the past few months I have come to think PR could have also been involved. It is my OPINION that there were several family members in the R house that were sick to the core and what went on behind closed doors was being carefully controlled and managed for a privileged group of people...some very close to the R's. I doubt we'll ever know the full details, but I am hoping that J. Kolar is right about this case being prosecutable even though he, too, feels it would be a tough one for any DA.

 

[midwest mama]

Caught up on link articles. Madeleine has posted some of this, but take a look:

Garnett said he filed Ramsey's letter with the court because "My office's position is as a custodian of archival documents, and it is my duty to handle them in a way that's fair and forthwith with the court and doesn't interfere with the possibility we could prosecute this case in the future for a charge in which the statute of limitations has not run."

"We felt it was appropriate to file this with the court," he said.

Translation: We just might want to prosecute now????

And if so, HALLELUJAH!!! Mr. Ramsey just might have a chance to try to dispel ANY accusations that might "defame" him.