Bruce Jenner Becoming a Woman and more...#2

[Kimberlyd125]

Shouldn't we be showing some respect for Caitlyn and referring to her using the correct pronoun?

I don't see it as disrespect. I see it as using the proper pronoun. I believe we are what we were born as. We will never agree on that subject. So we will have to agree to disagree.

JMO

 

[SophieRose]

My friend is transgender. She uses the 'proper' pronouns for her 'two lives.' If we talk about something from her former life then she says 'he' is the proper pronoun. 'HE' had a hard time before she made the transition. It wouldn't make sense to say 'she ' was a college football star and fathered a child.

It is disrespectful to call Caitlyn, 'he.' But it is not disrespectful to call Bruce 'he' , when referring to his past actions.

I think each individual has a preference. I read another forum and there is a transgender man and he prefers that his current name and he/him be used for the past because he feels he was always a male. I was reading a blog by a transgender woman and her preference is that her male name can be used for the past but she also wants she/her used for past and present.

 

[JerseyGirl]

Caitlyn Jenner Is Off The Market; She Is Reportedly Dating a 21-Year-Old College Student

http://celebrityinsider.org/caitlyn...d-college-student-check-out-the-photos-91849/

 

[gitana1]

Caitlyn Jenner Is Off The Market; She Is Reportedly Dating a 21-Year-Old College Student

http://celebrityinsider.org/caitlyn...d-college-student-check-out-the-photos-91849/

I can't stand Caitlyn Jenner and this is gross to me. Old enough to be her granddaughter.

 

[grammieto5]

So has he had his penis removed?

 

[animlzrule]

So has he had his penis removed?

She has been said to have transitioned, but I have never read to what extent; it's really nobody's business. I don't like her, but I have a feeling this is a mutually beneficial relationship. This 21 year old is likely benefiting from the support and comfort of being with someone who has undergone the same process. Jenner is likely lonely, given that I've read that the Kardashians have pretty much ceased communications with her. As much as I think Caitlyn is an a*****e, I do have a tremendous amount of empathy for her and anyone who has struggled with their body not matching their gender. I hope this relationship is a positive source of strength for them both, because they probably really need it to survive.

 

[grammieto5]

She has been said to have transitioned, but I have never read to what extent; it's really nobody's business. I don't like her, but I have a feeling this is a mutually beneficial relationship. This 21 year old is likely benefiting from the support and comfort of being with someone who has undergone the same process. Jenner is likely lonely, given that I've read that the Kardashians have pretty much ceased communications with her. As much as I think Caitlyn is an a*****e, I do have a tremendous amount of empathy for her and anyone who has struggled with their body not matching their gender. I hope this relationship is a positive source of strength for them both, because they probably really need it to survive.

He really made it the business of others when he said he was going to have the surgery done on his TV show...way back when.

 

[MaryG12]

So has he had his penis removed?

http://people.com/books/caitlyn-jen...nt-gender-reassignment-surgery-in-new-memoir/

“I just want to have all the right parts. I am also tired of tucking the damn thing in all the time.”

Mr. Sad?

Couldn't tell you if she/he still has her prostate though...

 

[RosalindaA]

I have to say I don't know much about Caitlin Jenner, but I find the transgender issue interesting as to why it's become more prominent in our society at the moment. I can think of a few individuals who have lived contrary to the gender they were born into in the past, but it seems more prevalent now.

I find it easier to imagine reasons why males might wish to live as female, ie they can show emotions more, perhaps have less career pressure, not have to be part of an agressive male culture and be more expressive as to how they look. But I must admit I can't fathom why women would chose to live as men as in general I think we (women) have a lot more leeway as to how feminine we want to be, or to be more androgynous. It's unfair but on the whole "tomboyish" women are just accepted.

So I have no problem with people doing whatever they want in terms of expressing their identity but I don't believe you can alter your genetic sexual gender (well not yet!). Even with surgery and hormones if I have 2 X chromosomes I'm female and if someone has an X and a Y they are male. That is just the way the human species exists.
Obviously some people are born with genetic sexual ambiguity in the same way that other chromosomes can become disrupted but they are pretty rare.

So fundamentally I don't believe that a man "can become a woman", just as if I were to have surgery, take a load of testosterone, start washing my car a lot and leaving the toilet seat up, I would not ever "become a man".

And as I think Germaine Greer and others have said, our whole lives/personality and development are dependent on which gender we are born and raised in. You can't erase all that history from your self.

 

[Tawny]

I should not have opened this thread.

 

[TeaTime]

In order to believe that a person can change their gender, one has to suspend the facts of biology. A man can have as many surgeries as he wants, and take as many hormones as he wants in order to appear to look more like a woman, but he is still a man. The same applies, of course, to women who want to be considered men. They are still women.

Gender dyshmorphia is a mental disorder and I refuse to pretend that any transgender has actually changed their gender.

That said, I really do not care one way or the other what people want to do to their bodies or how they wish to present themselves. It isn't any of my business but don't tell me I have believe that anyone actually changed their gender.

You do you. I'll do me.

 

[grammieto5]

I should not have opened this thread.

Why? It's an interesting topic.

 

[Tawny]

Why? It's an interesting topic.

Because it's full of hate, ignorance, and transphobia.

 

[grammieto5]

Because it's full of hate, ignorance, and transphobia.

I see it as people who have different opinions. I like to read everyone's opinions, especially when it differs from mine. There's a lot to be learned from this thread, if one chooses to do some research. I for one am glad you started it.

They didn't change their gender, they changed their bodies to MATCH their gender. This right here, what you wrote, I thought was very interesting. There's a lot to learn from this one statement, if one chooses to.

 

[meanmaryjean]

Having a differing opinion is not hateful, ignorant or any type of phobic. It is a difference of opinion. Period.

 

[Tawny]

I see it as people who have different opinions. I like to read everyone's opinions, especially when it differs from mine. There's a lot to be learned from this thread, if one chooses to do some research. I for one am glad you started it.

There is definitely a lot to be learned if one is open to the idea that their deeply held beliefs about gender and binary and human psychology are incorrect. What I'm seeing is a lot of people insisting that biology is biology and to hell with the mindset, mental health, and preferences of the trans* community. Misgendering a person because one is "of the opinion" that the person is still male even if they have fully transitioned is a form of subtle violence against the most vulnerable group within our society.

It's so easy to just respect the wishes of others since their preference as to whether we address them as he or she has zero bearing on our own lives. Why does it bother us so much if a human with a penis believes they are a woman? Does that affect our daily routine? Does it harm us in some way? We easily accept that Robert prefers Bob but if Robert prefers Melissa, we refuse to accept it and force Melissa to be Robert for our own comfort. Why?

 

[human]

I feel weird always prefacing my statements with this, but here I go again. (Thanks Ronald Reagan).

I no longer live in the US. I live in a Third World Nation where lots of men walk around wearing women’s clothing, I know one man had a breat operation but know nothing else of his body. He still looks like a man. He is very popular with the people. He has a great personality. He does things for the public so he is seen a lot and no one says anything except to a newbie who may be new in town.

My neighbor and precious friend is a 14 year old boy who as long as I have known him wants to be a girl.

He wears a bra, female clothing, and has long hair. He is totally precious to me.

Truthfully, it enrages me that people make comments that do apply to my precious friend.

I asked how the kids are at school. An adult friend told me that kids want to beat him up, but he does not care. I do a lot with him and his friends so I am in the community with him. One time I told some peers to knock it off. They apologized.

For the Christmas program, he is going to wear a long , beautiful dress that one of the men who dresses as a woman is making for him.

Some men who dress as women are married with children.

I would really like to know what difference it makes to anyone’s life if Bruce Jenner had a sex change operation?

It makes a difference to those that wish to do it, but to anyone else, how does it impact your life?

 

[Trident]

I feel weird always prefacing my statements with this, but here I go again. (Thanks Ronald Reagan).

I no longer live in the US. I live in a Third World Nation where lots of men walk around wearing women’s clothing, I know one man had a breat operation but know nothing else of his body. He still looks like a man. He is very popular with the people. He has a great personality. He does things for the public so he is seen a lot and no one says anything except to a newbie who may be new in town.

My neighbor and precious friend is a 14 year old boy who as long as I have known him wants to be a girl.

He wears a bra, female clothing, and has long hair. He is totally precious to me.

Truthfully, it enrages me that people make comments that do apply to my precious friend.

I asked how the kids are at school. An adult friend told me that kids want to beat him up, but he does not care. I do a lot with him and his friends so I am in the community with him. One time I told some peers to knock it off. They apologized.

For the Christmas program, he is going to wear a long , beautiful dress that one of the men who dresses as a woman is making for him.

Some men who dress as women are married with children.

I would really like to know what difference it makes to anyone’s life if Bruce Jenner had a sex change operation?

It makes a difference to those that wish to do it, but to anyone else, how does it impact your life?

It makes absolutely no difference to me what Bruce Jenner turns into. No skin off my behind. However, wouldn't it have been better if he/she just went ahead and did it without all the fanfare and publicity?

 

[human]

It makes absolutely no difference to me what Bruce Jenner turns into. No skin off my behind. However, wouldn't it have been better if he/she just went ahead and did it without all the fanfare and publicity?

He was a Decathalete. He can give courage to those who may wish to live on instead of committing suicde like some do.He was telling them it was OK to be different

A famous athlete. That has to be empowering.

 

[grammieto5]

There is definitely a lot to be learned if one is open to the idea that their deeply held beliefs about gender and binary and human psychology are incorrect. What I'm seeing is a lot of people insisting that biology is biology and to hell with the mindset, mental health, and preferences of the trans* community. Misgendering a person because one is "of the opinion" that the person is still male even if they have fully transitioned is a form of subtle violence against the most vulnerable group within our society.

It's so easy to just respect the wishes of others since their preference as to whether we address them as he or she has zero bearing on our own lives. Why does it bother us so much if a human with a penis believes they are a woman? Does that affect our daily routine? Does it harm us in some way? We easily accept that Robert prefers Bob but if Robert prefers Melissa, we refuse to accept it and force Melissa to be Robert for our own comfort. Why?

I can only speak for myself. I could not care less what others do, as long as what they do does not harm another. DNA is confusing, for me with transgender. I believe you keep your DNA. If you’re born a male regardless if you choose to become a female you will always have male DNA. As far as the penis issue, if one does not want to look like a male then have the penis removed. The way I see it, if one is born male he is expected to act like a male, which would be horrible for someone who believes he’s a female. In reality he is changing roles. If a male chooses to change his body to female he’s still a male on the inside. Is everyone expected to believe when a male changes his body to look like a female then he is female, as in The Emperor’s New Clothes?