CA - 14 killed in San Bernardino mass shooting, 2 Dec 2015 #2

[ninij9]

Sounds like a Greek surname to me.

There is a population of Greek Sephardic Jews. They are not all Christians. My girlfriend is Greek and Jewish.

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[Dogface]

Lol!!
My dad used to call the cops if anyone parked in front of our house. Cuz, ya know, he owned the street.

Exactly! Everyone has their own threshold for what would push them to call the cops, but I would hate for this neighbor of theirs to feel guilty for the rest of her life because she didn't call the cops. Suspicious behavior at its worst usually never results in something like this. And it wasn't like they had a neon sign pointing to their garage saying "we are making explosives in here and will soon go on a murderous rampage".

I just hope everyone affected by this has someone to lean into and help them through this unspeakable tragedy. There are two people to blame for this, and they were the ones pulling the trigger.

 

[Momoffourboys]

There is a population of Greek Sephardic Jews. They are not all Christians. My girlfriend is Greek and Jewish.

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His last name is not one of Jewish or Sephardic descent.
His first name is not Jewish, either. JMO.

Didn't mean to start a "thing". I just don't believe it's accurate.

 

[popsicle]

From your link, popsicle:

... there is no official definition for “mass shooting.”

IMO, the number 355 mass shootings is being reported in order to create hysteria about gun control.

For at least the past decade, the F.B.I. regarded a mass shooting as a single attack in which four or more victims were killed. (In 2013, a mandate from President Obama for further study of the problem lowered that threshold to three victims killed.)

 

[justanother]

His last name is not one of Jewish or Sephardic descent.
His first name is not Jewish, either. JMO.

Didn't mean to start a "thing". I just don't believe it's accurate.

His social media profile confirms his beliefs IMO.

 

[Deleted member 110058]

Raymond Wetzel, a father of six, was one of 14 people killed in the mass shooting at Inland Regional Center in San Bernardino Wednesday.

A family spokesperson said Wetzel, an environmental specialist, was in a small meeting when suspected shooters Syed Rizwan Farook, 28, and Tashfeen Malik, 27, burst inside the social service center and opened fire.

His widow, Renee Wetzel, learned of his death late Wednesday night.

"They are very overwhelmed," family spokesperson Celia Behar said. "There are six kids that have lost their father and Renee is a stay-at-home mom, so they've also lost all of their financial support, and the kids are just finding out today."

http://abc7.com/news/father-of-6-killed-in-san-bernardino-mass-shooting-/1108336/

There is a family photo at link. Get your tissues. You will need them.

Someone set up a donation link for this family. They are already at $115,000 with a goal of $125,000. Really amazing!

 

[sorrell skye]

For at least the past decade, the F.B.I. regarded a mass shooting as a single attack in which four or more victims were killed. (In 2013, a mandate from President Obama for further study of the problem lowered that threshold to three victims killed.)

I think the definition of "mass shooting" is ill-defined. IMO, the definition is devised in order to promote an agenda.

 

[Chuz Life]

Federal officials said all four weapons were purchased legally in the United States four years ago - the handguns by Farook himself and the assault rifles by a third party.

This reminds me of what I said in the Colorado 'Planned Parenthood' thread.

There is nothing to keep a person from buying a gun legally and then using them in some sort of a crime much later in life. There is nothing about the legally ownership of a gun and an extensive background check that will prevent someone from losing their mind or from being otherwise corrupted at some point long after they already have a gun.

 

[bluesneakers]

I think the definition of "mass shooting" is ill-defined.

Much like the definition of "terrorism."

 

[Momoffourboys]

His social media profile confirms his beliefs IMO.

I guess we can't discuss it. But...people who believe in Jesus are not Jews. JMO

AND...not that it matters what he believed in. He didn't deserve to die. For any reason.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Jeez it's so hard to see the actual victims. May their souls be at peace and may their loved ones find a way to pick up the pieces of their broken hearts. So senseless and awful.

And as far as calling the cops, I think hindsight is 20/20 and it's easy to say what you would do in that situation but I think it's unfair to put blame on her. In most people's minds people are not crazy, sadistic murderers, even if they are strange. And heck, even my hubby and I disagree over calling cops all the time. He is so cop calling happy it drives me nuts! "Oh there is a car I haven't seen outside" he calls the cops. A while ago I came inside from walking the dog, and I was like "oh my gosh, Lu just jumped out of his skin because someone's shooting a gun" and he instantly freaked out and called the cops, but I grew up in the country, so a gun being shot in the distance didn't even register with me as something to call the cops about. For me, it would have to be something very obvious, like a guy loading a tv in to his car with no plates at my neighbors house who happen to be out of town, IYKWIM.

I don't blame her whatsoever. I believe the reason she did not call is because of all the political correctness atmosphere our country is enduring more than ever before. I truly believe it is changing this country and not for the better. Imo, society as a whole is being brainwashed into believing someone/anyone/everyone may be offended even if one does the right thing or they feel they will be labeled as a bad person. Look at how our country treats whistleblowers. It seems the whistleblowers are the ones who suffer and very little is done on an individual or company they blew the whistle on. Often the government will make the whistleblower's life hell when instead they should be rewarded for speaking out.

Who knows maybe she was afraid if she was wrong and nothing was really happening.... these two would sue her saying she was anti-Muslim. We seem to be caught up in a sue happy society now and being offended about something is resulting in civil lawsuits. Its sort of has become a new type of lottery. So I am sure this woman did have misgivings thinking it could blowup in her face if she turned out to be wrong. I am sure she is devastated and will live with this the rest of her life.

I wish more people would report things like these but I don't see them doing it...not in this climate anyway. I think many are afraid to do so and may feel there will be backlash/retaliation from the actual residents or someone that knows the people. Its sort of like 'snitches get stiches' and that is the very reason a lot of decent law abiding people don't call the police about gang members.

Witnesses have been murdered before so I am sure she thought about that too. She had no guarantee that something was illegally going on in the home.

IMO

 

[justanother]

I guess we can't discuss it. But...people who believe in Jesus are not Jews. JMO

AND...not that it matters what he believed in. He didn't deserve to die. For any reason.

I completely agree. Nothing justifies his death. It's purely speculation that he was the one the supposed disagreement was with. I can see how they would butt heads, that's for sure.

 

[LietKynes]

He sure showed him.

It's one thing for a peaceful person to argue this. I totally get that! It's another for someone planning a bombing and shooting to argue this....

Weird how our brains can hold so many completely contradictory ideas in them at the same time.

RSBM

I'd be somewhat interested in the kind of websites/magazines that are catering to or promoting anger.
What kind of website convinces someone to plan an attack ?
Was there someone or some site that S. F. was directly influenced by ?

Years ago I was friends with a woman in the neighborhood who counseled people who were struggling with various issues and helped some to reintegrate with society.
She said, and I'll paraphrase; "...some of the most frightening people I've encountered were 'supremacists' ... their hatred was literally clouding their judgement and affecting their physical and mental health..."

Infuriating to think that some people will antagonize someone who is maybe weaker than they are , and then sit back and watch as the younger or more influenced person implodes.
Just thinking out loud.
Wish there was a way to shut down sites that make broad threats -- even if not specific ones -- and incite violence ; no matter what race or ideology.

:moo:

 

[SnoopyDawgDawg]

Just a point to ponder but if you make a call your neighbor is not going to be privy as to who exactly made the call.

Not necessarily. I once found out the hard way that any time a tenant called the police (be it due to a domestic issue or be it something involving a neighbor), the police notified the landlady who in turn told other apartment staff. So if you called on your neighbors, odds were they'd find out about it eventually. It was definitely something to take into consideration before calling in.

 

[Momoffourboys]

I completely agree. Nothing justifies his death. It's purely speculation that he was the one the supposed disagreement was with. I can see how they would butt heads, that's for sure.

For sure. This guy was a Zionist and very vocal about it by all accounts. That is enough to make some people very angry.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I think the definition of "mass shooting" is ill-defined. IMO, the definition is devised in order to promote an agenda.

It seems well defined to me. What is ill-defined if I may ask?

For the longest time it was always four victims or more during the same attack. I always felt it was very well defined as to what constitutes a mass shooting/murders.

Now I see from the post you quoted its three now since BO changed it but I am not sure I agree with it being lowered to three instead of four. I didn't even know he changed it or why when the FBI has always been the ones to define types of shootings and its been four shot in one attack for a very long time now.

Was there a specific case at the time that BO wanted it to be listed as a mass shooting when the shooter shot three people in total?

I didn't even know it had been changed until Popsicle just now posted it. I wonder if he changed it because it would seem like more mass shootings were happening because it now includes three or more instead of four or more. Strange. So you may be exactly right and lowering it may have more to do with politics and agendas.

Learn something new everyday.

IMO

 

[Ellie9]

RSBM

I'd be somewhat interested in the kind of websites/magazines that are catering to or promoting anger.
What kind of website convinces someone to plan an attack ?
Was there someone or some site that S. F. was directly influenced by ?

Years ago I was friends with a woman in the neighborhood who counseled people who were struggling with various issues and helped some to reintegrate with society.
She said, and I'll paraphrase; "...some of the most frightening people I've encountered were 'supremacists' ... their hatred was literally clouding their judgement and affecting their physical and mental health..."

Infuriating to think that some people will antagonize someone who is maybe weaker than they are , and then sit back and watch as the younger or more influenced person implodes.
Just thinking out loud.
Wish there was a way to shut down sites that make broad threats -- even if not specific ones -- and incite violence ; no matter what race or ideology.

:moo:

bold mine

I do not know what this shooter was influenced by (I might be behind in data I've been working in the house and checking sporadically). I do know that many terrorist groups have used social media to spread their hatred. In fact, Anonymous (rag-tag and ever-changing hacker group) has been hacking and removing tons (I think over 5000) Twitter feeds that are pro-ISIS. I'm not sure if ISIS has any connection to SF, but I'm saying that's what feeds Anonymous is targeting for removal. Lately they've been going to find pro-ISIS websites and photoshopping the heads from the photos of terrorists and replacing them with cute rubber duckies (removing fear and making them look ridiculous.)

So there's so much out there, and there's not much the any gov't can do. That's why hackers are doing it. For example, if Twitter removes what they THINK is a pro-IS twitter feed, but they're wrong, they could get in trouble. But if Anonymous makes even a hundred mistakes there aren't any consequences. Users from Anonymous could be caught, but I have a suspicion that Twitter won't take any legal action since they're actually doing Twitter a huge favor here.

 

[popsicle]

FYI PC in 30 minutes

 

[Momoffourboys]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/3/syed-farook-tashfeen-malik-erased-digital-footprin/

San Bernardino killers erased digital presence day before the attacks

The husband and wife who carried out a deadly shooting spree in San Bernardino, California, began erasing their digital footprint a day in advance of the attack — deleting email accounts, disposing of hard drives and smashing their cell phones, according to law enforcement sources involved in the investigation.

Officials are still working to determine what motivated Syed Rizwan Farook and his wife Tashfeen Malik to storm a conference room inside the Inland Regional Center as a holiday party was taking place Wednesday and spray the room with bullets.

Snip

Officials involved in the investigation say the couple appeared to have gone to great lengths to conceal their plans — a cell phone recovered from Ms. Malik’s body was newly purchased and had had been used only recently. Two other cell phones that were recovered had been smashed with a hammer and were expected to be sent to the FBI’s forensic lab in Washington for examination.

Authorities also noted that a hard drive and motherboard are missing from a computer found at the Redlands, California, home the couple rented

 

[popsicle]

News 13 ‏@MyNews13 3m3 minutes ago
Updates on San Bernardino shooting expected around 8:30 p.m., watch it LIVE on News 13. http://goo.gl/gP3L5X