CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #10

[shanadk]

Can we discuss motive? While Mojave weather and Barbara's clothing are important , they have dominated the dialogue today.
Why was she there? Just a few days before trip overseas ..

 

[K9Enzo]

If LE still believed BT was lost in the desert, they'd likely still be searching.

Honestly, not really. Families of those missing in outdoor areas will tell you official searches are typically suspended and you’re kind of on your own. They will deploy again if new information is discovered.

If she’s considered a missing person, no foul play suspected, many folks are going to be disappointed on how this will most likely go idle.

 

[artsy1]

Found this on National Park website. Not sure if helpful, but thought i post it. It just gives a general idea of average temps throughout the year and it seems that temps can really vary within the area based on elevation...

Thank you so much for finding this! <modsnip: Let it go.>

 

[shanadk]

They said they do not suspect foul play and there is no evidence that she was kidnapped.

The same was said about the McStay family.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

bbm

I don't think LE ever said they did not think she was lost in the desert. They said they do not suspect foul play and there is no evidence that she was kidnapped.

They also said the search was based on the last location RT had seen her.
That they spent so much time and effort searching there it would seem they considered it possible that she got lost. Imo

If LE still considers BT as a possible-lost-in-the-desert victim and are no longer searching for her in the broader area then something is amiss.

 

[artsy1]

What's left? This?

http://www.nuforc.org/webreports/147/S147518.html

Well, the military DID release video of them chasing a UFO....

 

[ChuckMaureen]

Well, the military DID release video of them chasing a UFO....

Was that UFO transporting a beer?

 

[artsy1]

Was that UFO transporting a beer?

Maybe - it appeared to be FUI - Flying Under the Influence.

 

[MsBetsy]

bbm


If LE still considers BT as a possible-lost-in-the-desert victim and are no longer searching for her in the broader area then something is amiss.

Yes, as far as we know it is still a missing persons investigation.
LE has not indicated that there is a criminal element, but I don't know why they can't do another search of the area.
I keep asking about the Drone Search request and whether or not LE has ever responded but I still don't know the answer. I would think they would at least respond. IMO

 

[MsBetsy]

The same was said about the McStay family.

The same can be said about a lot of cases but at this point there is no evidence that we know of.
Every case is unique and we have no way of knowing what leads LE has.
They may not know anything until a body is found, which is why I wish they would do a Drone Search. Imo

 

[MsBetsy]

Thank you so much for finding this! <modsniip: Let it go.>

Yes, I saw the same chart. Averages are 73 for the high and 52 for the low in October.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

Two earthquakes, one a 6.4- and the other a 7.1-magnitude, hit Trona, CA (epicenter) one week before BT went missing while walking near Kelbaker and Hidden Hill roads. Trona is 120 miles as the crow flies from that intersection.

BT and RT were exploring one of the large 'rock formations'; I'm wondering if some of those stacked-high huge boulders had loosened from their perches, wondering if it was possible that one fell completely just as BT was walking by? The boulders could have shifted during the earthquakes and many aftershocks and eventually gave way so many days later.

Given that "no evidence of Barbara Thomas was found" on each search day, and LE does not believe there was an abduction and they don't believe RT is good for this case, what's left other than maybe BT was crushed under a huge boulder as it fell? Many of those buggers are large enough to conceal a small vehicle.

Article dated July 10, 2019, two days before BT went missing:
Following earthquakes, no reports of missing adventurers in Mojave Desert – San Bernardino Sun

 

[artsy1]

Two earthquakes, one a 6.4- and the other a 7.1-magnitude, hit Trona, CA (epicenter) one week before BT went missing while walking near Kelbaker and Hidden Hill roads. Trona is 120 miles as the crow flies from that intersection.

BT and RT were exploring one of the large 'rock formations'; I'm wondering if some of those stacked-high huge boulders had loosened from their perches, wondering if it was possible that one fell completely just as BT was walking by? The boulders could have shifted during the earthquakes and many aftershocks and eventually gave way so many days later.

Given that "no evidence of Barbara Thomas was found" on each search day, and LE does not believe there was an abduction and they don't believe RT is good for this case, what's left other than maybe BT was crushed under a huge boulder as it fell? Many of those buggers are large enough to conceal a small vehicle.

Article dated July 10, 2019, two days before BT went missing:
Following earthquakes, no reports of missing adventurers in Mojave Desert – San Bernardino Sun

I thought about it, too. We're about 100 miles or less from Trina, and the quakes knocked me on my butt.

It's quite possible, imo, that could be the answer. Maybe drone could look for evidence of rock collapse.

 

[Reasonable & Just]

Two earthquakes, one a 6.4- and the other a 7.1-magnitude, hit Trona, CA (epicenter) one week before BT went missing while walking near Kelbaker and Hidden Hill roads. Trona is 120 miles as the crow flies from that intersection.

BT and RT were exploring one of the large 'rock formations'; I'm wondering if some of those stacked-high huge boulders had loosened from their perches, wondering if it was possible that one fell completely just as BT was walking by? The boulders could have shifted during the earthquakes and many aftershocks and eventually gave way so many days later.

Given that "no evidence of Barbara Thomas was found" on each search day, and LE does not believe there was an abduction and they don't believe RT is good for this case, what's left other than maybe BT was crushed under a huge boulder as it fell? Many of those buggers are large enough to conceal a small vehicle.

Article dated July 10, 2019, two days before BT went missing:
Following earthquakes, no reports of missing adventurers in Mojave Desert – San Bernardino Sun

Good "outside of the box" thinking! Not disagreeing at all, but wondering - wouldn't it make a noise loud enough for RT (or even others in the parking lot a little ways off) to hear?

 

[kkdj]

Good "outside of the box" thinking! Not disagreeing at all, but wondering - wouldn't it make a noise loud enough for RT (or even others in the parking lot a little ways off) to hear?

I live in earthquake country and believe you me I felt those quakes. Now, had there been a percursor that day I would certainly think RT would have mentioned it and to look around boulders. But he didn't. He said someone must have taken her to Las Vegas because she was in a bikini with a beer in her hand.

 

[artsy1]

Good "outside of the box" thinking! Not disagreeing at all, but wondering - wouldn't it make a noise loud enough for RT (or even others in the parking lot a little ways off) to hear?

Wonder if he has any hearing problems?

 

[kkdj]

Wonder if he has any hearing problems?

and balance?

 

[al66pine]

Why No Current Searches in Mojave for BT (AFAIK)?

They searched for nine days because that is the longest time anyone could possibly be alive in those conditions. Imo They said they will search again if there is any new evidence.

Honestly, not really. Families of those missing in outdoor areas will tell you official searches are typically suspended and you’re kind of on your own. They will deploy again if new information is discovered. If she’s considered a missing person, no foul play suspected, many folks are going to be disappointed on how this will most likely go idle.

Thanks, peeps for the ^ posts. bbm
Why not do we not see any news about county sheriff's personnel continuing to search?

1) Nine days in desert w/out prep & supplies is not compatible w life (sadly), so further searches would be recovery, not a rescue operation as of ~2 mo's. ago. Without further info re foul play, LE gen'ly do not continue searching.

2) County sheriff's personnel, esp deputies, have other duties, like 911 calls & other known crimes to work.

3) Per info* below, a lot/most of the boots on the ground are volunteers. Sheriff ofc coordinates/commands SAR, has some staff & command posts like RV on scene, etc. When 80+ ppl on some days were out looking for BT, IDK how many were deputies. I venture to say a minority.

(Locally our fire & rescue team is all volunteer, many/most w full time jobs, so participating in a search usu means time off from work. Some employers are more lax than others. They have weekly training sessions/drills/various certifications requirements**/continuing ed, etc. On fire-fighting side, they personally each pay their own turnout gear - jacket, pants, boots, helmet, gloves etc, $1500-2000. II think ditto for most/all of their SAR gear.) Not a hobby they take up on a whim.

I've read about numerous ppl on the initial SAR team who return w a partner or group to the 'last place seen' off and on week-ends, long after the official search is discontinued. Dedicated ppl.
{{{ETA: It's possible BT will be found, whether by LE, SAR thru deliberate search, or others accidentally, imo.}}}
---------------------------------------------------------------
* "In the United States there are many organizations with SAR responsibilities at the national, state and local level. Most day-to-day SAR missions in the US are run by the County Sheriffs [140] except in states like Alaska,.... They in turn, can request help from state and national resources, if they think they need them. A typical Sheriff's Office has a volunteer SAR team that matches the terrain and population of that county. SAR members are typically trained in the Incident Command System (ICS),[141] first aid, and the outdoor skills needed in that terrain and climate...."
Search and rescue - Wikipedia
**Education - NASAR
{ETA: idk what the extra attachment /file is}

 

[slowpoke]

Snipped:

A day ago I posted, since the extreme heat is gone and so many people here are interested in this case, BT having family and friends, why not form a group, contact volunteers, people with drones, realise some profisory headquarter and do something instead of discussing a bikini day after day.

While some WS members may be more than willing to involve themselves in proactive ways you’ve mentioned, there are others who may not be, and I hate to think they’d feel bad for not participating in such an active manner.

There can be many reasons they may not be willing or able to get involved outside of this forum, but I think there ought to be enough room here at WS for ALL to participate, whether it is solely by brainstorming their ideas here on the forum, or doing the things you list such as forming a group to search, etc.

I will admit I am speaking for myself, as a member who is strictly a poster. But I must set my limits on what I can/will do as part of taking care of myself. That’s all I will say about that. Just thought that maybe I’d be speaking for others, as well. Maybe not, and I’m an oddball...! But, JMO, and hope others will be understanding.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

bbm

Good "outside of the box" thinking! Not disagreeing at all, but wondering - wouldn't it make a noise loud enough for RT (or even others in the parking lot a little ways off) to hear?

Not necessarily. Variables would be at play, such as shape, position and direction of the 'fall'. What if a boulder only rolled off the top of other boulders, much like a ball rolls down a hill. Or maybe a very irregularly-shaped boulder pivoted on its downward-facing 'end' and collapsed on a flat side?

We do not know specific and relative locations of BT and RT to the rock formation and to each other when BT 'disappeared'. RT could have been at the end of the formation farthest from the Kelbaker/Hidden Hill intersection while BT was approaching an area closer to the intersection. That could be a significant distance and depending on the how the boulder(s) shifted, the 'noise could have been only a brief, low rumble or impact sound. RT could have been so wrapped up in what he was doing or so distraught after not finding BT that he either did not hear a noise loud enough to cause notice or he forgot hearing it while under stress of searching for an eventually-missing BT. Who knows what other sounds occur within the confines of the larger desert, near and distant and how they simply go unnoticed in the broader context of a focused excursion.