Found Deceased CA - Fang Jin, 47, flew to LA from China, train to Palm Springs, Morongo Basin, 21 Jul 2023, w/ John Root Fitzpatrick, 55, (fnd dec.), 30 Jul ‘23 #3

[cenazoic]

How do you read "general vicinity"? Just somewhere in the AB park?
I must say it doesn't mean much to me, sounds rather vague...

Well, ‘general vicinity’ does sort of imply nearby, but I think JRF’s body was also described as ‘near’ his truck, but was actually 2-2.5 miles away. So I agree that it’s fairly vague, likely to keep gawkers away.

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

LE didn't release any info regarding evidences that both Fang and JRF were in the truck in Thermal on July 22nd, right ?


How do you read "general vicinity"? Just somewhere in the AB park?
I must say it doesn't mean much to me, sounds rather vague...
(non native speaker here)

Usually the word "vicinity" indicates that two or more things are quite close to each other. I certainly wouldn't say "in the general vicinity" if JRF was found in Harper Canyon and JF was found on the other side of the park.

My guess is that both were in the area around Harper Canyon, but that is only a guess. And it's still quite a few square miles of area.

 

[cenazoic]

Usually the word "vicinity" indicates that two or more things are quite close to each other.

(Pointless quibble as we wait for more news ):

All location-based adjectives (‘near’, “general vicinity’ (ok, not an adjective; an adjectival phrase, perhaps?), ‘nearby’, ‘close’, etc) are fundamentally relative. If you’re in the US, then I’m in your general vicinity, at least compared to someone else in Mumbai.

My guess is that both were in the area around Harper Canyon, but that is only a guess. And it's still quite a few square miles of area.

Well said.

 

[Sundog]

Considering the weather conditions, I highly favor misadventure with a severely disabled vehicle and not enough water or shade to hike out to the road.

Had the trip been in February, I might have a different opinion, but with high temperatures of 117 in the area and very little shade, hyperthermia and heat stroke sound the most likely.

I have been leaning that way, too, but if we take into account the decomp and homicide investigation attached to the sealed search warrant, then that leaves open other possibilities as well. I also find it disconcerting that the Toyota was discovered in early September and it is still there. If LE wanted to have it air lifted as part of their investigation, it seems that they would have done that by now. Hopefullly, we will get some more information soon. It's possible that the condition of the remains are making it difficult for the ME to conclude its findings and this is keeping LE from publicly saying more at this stage. I think CS8 will do another news story since they are now following this case and it has been confirmed that FJ's remains have been discovered, sadly.

 

[10ofRods]

10ofRods:

I think you have your directions mixed up. Here is how I look at the area: Harper Flat is a rhomboid or parallelogram shape, angled towards the east. If you identify the four corners, you end up with 3 roads and one small hiking trail or scramble. NONE of the roads actually are driveable into the flats area, so you cannot drive across Harper Flat in any direction. However, you could hike across it, with varying degrees of rock scrambling or trail-less walking through lots of cactus and sharp-thorned scrub. Harper Flat is about 3 miles wide in the W to E dimension and 1.5 miles long in the N to S dimension.

NW: Pinyon Wash Road off of Highway 78. Road ends in rocks that prevent driving into Harper Canyon. No fence there. Popular drive for camping and exploring Harper Flat. This is where the A-B Desert State Park mentions is closed for the "maintenance" taking place. Several here are postulating that's where the vehicle is and is being removed by helicopter, but we don't know for sure.

SW: Pinyon Mountain Road in SW corner, where the fence is. Cannot drive into Harper Flat because of the fence. This is where the off-road trips through The Squeeze and Heart Attack Hill end before turning into the Hapaha Flat/ Fish Creek Wash area.

NE: Harper Canyon: No road, only a walking trail not much used. His remains were found in two places along this and there is the report that a backpack was found in this general region, but LE not confirming it. By elevation, Harper Flat flooding would drain NE down Harper Canyon to the Old Kane Road area near Ocotillo Wells

SE: Dave McCain Spring / Hapaha Flat / Fish Creek Wash area The Dave McCain Spring is probably the road closest to Harper Canyon, but you still can't drive into the flat or into the Canyon, and it would not be a particularly good trailhead at all. Rough rocks hills between there and Harper Canyon area. See my link to a trip report of driving in this area at post #389. This area also has traces of Native American activity. The Pinyon Mountain Road turns into Hapaha Flat in this area and then into Fish Creek Wash road. This is the end of the popular Fish Creek Wash with lots to see and do and what appears to be fairly flat and unchallenging driving save a few rocks, narrow places, or soft sand.

Soooo. Where was the vehicle and what was JRF trying to accomplish by ending up on Harper Canyon? I can understand reasons why all 3 driving routes might have been used. We do know that the vehicle was not in the NE corner near Harper Canyon or parked to the east outside the canyon.
I have not yet read that LE has disclosed where JF's remains were located.

I'm no longer assuming they drove on Harper Flat. And in fact, I'm not sure the truck was found in a wash or canyon (I think JRF's body may have been found in Harper Canyon). From the pictures of the skeleton, I am assuming that the body was found in some kind of wash/canyon. LE said the body was "several" miles away from the truck.

It does sound like they're trying to retrieve the truck from Pinyon Wash (which is consistent with what people have been posting on the Anza-Borrego FB page).

This could mean that they did hike the 3-4 miles across Harper Flat to get to Harper Canyon. Is that how far you estimate it to be?

I think I posted about that day before yesterday. I thought I had a map saved that showed Pinyon Flat Road, but can't find it. But here is a map that shows a possible hike from what is called PInyon Canyon Road (80 mile marker on the 78) and then a hike up Pinyon Wash, around Harper Flat, and then back down Pinyon Wash. So perhaps it's actually Pinyon Canyon Road. The directions given with the map say the parking is 2.4 miles from the highway. They would then have hiked up Pinyon Canyon as show on the map, looped around Harper Flat and come back.

But then, I have a hard time explaining the damage to the truck. If we take the view that the truck was damaged by flood waters in late August, then that would mean the truck was still operable and unwrecked when they took off on a hike. It's a fairly long hike (7.4 miles with Harper Flat loop included; viewing the archaeological sites up there would take time too).

This could be a case even more similar to the Yosemite case I posted about earlier (where the family was not that far from their car but just couldn't make it - and the temperatures for that family were lower than what Anza-Borrego records for July 24). Nearly every day in July up to mid-August was hotter than the day when that family died (three people).

That family had an 85 ounce water bladder and their planned hike was about 6-7 miles.

Cause of death revealed for Calif. family found dead on hike

The announcement caps a three-month investigation.

www.sfgate.com

In that same year, one hiker perished on a hike in Anza-Borrego as well.

Other links to the Yosemite story:

The tragic missteps that killed a young California family on a hike

The incident serves as a reminder to thoroughly map, plan ahead and be well-prepared when hiking, no matter the season

www.theguardian.com

They were just 1.6 miles from their car; tried to send a rescue text which failed to deliver:

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/18/us/california-family-yosemite-final-moments-trnd/index.html#:~:text=Jonathan%20Gerrish%2C%20Ellen%20Chung%20and,dehydration%20due%20to%20environmental%20exposure.

And it was 105, not 117F that day. Reading the last two links shows how the person who organized this tragic Yosemite area hike had done most of the hike before - but at a different time of year, and before a fire went through the area, removing all shade. A simple lack of knowledge about trail conditions was responsible for three deaths there.

Could JRF have fallen or otherwise injured himself hiking up Pinyon Wash? Maybe they never made it to Harper Flat. It definitely sounds like a similar kind of desert/heat misadventure to me.

 

[iamshadow21]

I'm no longer assuming they drove on Harper Flat. And in fact, I'm not sure the truck was found in a wash or canyon (I think JRF's body may have been found in Harper Canyon). From the pictures of the skeleton, I am assuming that the body was found in some kind of wash/canyon. LE said the body was "several" miles away from the truck.

It does sound like they're trying to retrieve the truck from Pinyon Wash (which is consistent with what people have been posting on the Anza-Borrego FB page).

This could mean that they did hike the 3-4 miles across Harper Flat to get to Harper Canyon. Is that how far you estimate it to be?

I think I posted about that day before yesterday. I thought I had a map saved that showed Pinyon Flat Road, but can't find it. But here is a map that shows a possible hike from what is called PInyon Canyon Road (80 mile marker on the 78) and then a hike up Pinyon Wash, around Harper Flat, and then back down Pinyon Wash. So perhaps it's actually Pinyon Canyon Road. The directions given with the map say the parking is 2.4 miles from the highway. They would then have hiked up Pinyon Canyon as show on the map, looped around Harper Flat and come back.

But then, I have a hard time explaining the damage to the truck. If we take the view that the truck was damaged by flood waters in late August, then that would mean the truck was still operable and unwrecked when they took off on a hike. It's a fairly long hike (7.4 miles with Harper Flat loop included; viewing the archaeological sites up there would take time too).

This could be a case even more similar to the Yosemite case I posted about earlier (where the family was not that far from their car but just couldn't make it - and the temperatures for that family were lower than what Anza-Borrego records for July 24). Nearly every day in July up to mid-August was hotter than the day when that family died (three people).

That family had an 85 ounce water bladder and their planned hike was about 6-7 miles.

Cause of death revealed for Calif. family found dead on hike

The announcement caps a three-month investigation.

www.sfgate.com

In that same year, one hiker perished on a hike in Anza-Borrego as well.

Other links to the Yosemite story:

The tragic missteps that killed a young California family on a hike

The incident serves as a reminder to thoroughly map, plan ahead and be well-prepared when hiking, no matter the season

www.theguardian.com

They were just 1.6 miles from their car; tried to send a rescue text which failed to deliver:

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/18/us/california-family-yosemite-final-moments-trnd/index.html#:~:text=Jonathan%20Gerrish%2C%20Ellen%20Chung%20and,dehydration%20due%20to%20environmental%20exposure.

And it was 105, not 117F that day. Reading the last two links shows how the person who organized this tragic Yosemite area hike had done most of the hike before - but at a different time of year, and before a fire went through the area, removing all shade. A simple lack of knowledge about trail conditions was responsible for three deaths there.

Could JRF have fallen or otherwise injured himself hiking up Pinyon Wash? Maybe they never made it to Harper Flat. It definitely sounds like a similar kind of desert/heat misadventure to me.

Just because it might have been damaged in the floods, doesn't mean it wasn't out of action before then. Break an axle, crack your sump, heck, even bust a tyre or two if you don't have a replacement, and you can be royally screwed.

MOO

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

If JRF was indeed found in Harper Canyon, any explanation has to account for how he ended up there. And it does seem to be a slightly strange place to end up if the car was in Pinyon Wash.

I still wonder if JF and JRF were somewhere on the ridges above Harper Flat, and the storm water washed them down. Harper Canyon is at the lowest point of Harper Flat, so IMO it's the most likely place for a heavy(ish) object to be carried by the water flow.

 

[iamshadow21]

If JRF was indeed found in Harper Canyon, any explanation has to account for how he ended up there. And it does seem to be a slightly strange place to end up if the car was in Pinyon Wash.

I still wonder if JF and JRF were somewhere on the ridges above Harper Flat, and the storm water washed them down. Harper Canyon is at the lowest point of Harper Flat, so IMO it's the most likely place for a heavy(ish) object to be carried by the water flow.

I strongly believe their remains were carried some distance by water. John's skull missing pretty much all teeth makes me think it was rolled with some force along a rough, unyielding surface, like a rocky creekbed by floodwater. I know teeth coming loose happens with decomposition, but all of them? I think they had help from Mother Nature.

MOO

 

[10ofRods]

Just because it might have been damaged in the floods, doesn't mean it wasn't out of action before then. Break an axle, crack your sump, heck, even bust a tyre or two if you don't have a replacement, and you can be royally screwed.

MOO

True. It could be either way. In one hypothesis, their car is disabled and they are out there without sufficient water (and perhaps they took what water they had with them, which is why LE didn't find much or any in the truck).

If they parked at the Pinyon Wash trailhead, though (instead of trying to offroad up or down a wash or canyon), there's no reason to suspect a broken axle or flat tire. So that's one scenario (in which JRF has to drive some place that end up damaging his truck). Because if the truck was only 2.6 miles from Highway 78, I feel as if they could have gotten cell service AND a good chance of making it out alive (especially if they knew to wait until dark in some shaded spot and then walk out).

If they parked at the Pinyon Wash trailhead without damaging the truck, then the flood waters did the damage and something else happened to them on the hike. Such as an injury to JRF, since JF seems to have been found closer to the road.

A flat tire out there could definitely mean that one is royally screwed, although I've watched people decide to go onward on a flat (damaging their wheels/rims - but better than being stranded?)

So I wish we knew if he was trying to offroad UP Pinyon wash (it seems to me there'd be no way of turning around - but it's also possible he didn't know that and thought he could indeed to get to Harper Flat, when in fact, he could not.)

 

[Herat]

Yes, he and/or she could have actually died anywhere on Harper Flat, and had the flooding been strong enough, had their bodies washed/rolled in strong floodwaters into and down Harper Canyon.

So we are still relying on the vehicle location to give an idea of where they started from.

 

[Herat]

Remember that adage: One flat tire is an inconvenience, two can be a disaster.

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

True. It could be either way. In one hypothesis, their car is disabled and they are out there without sufficient water (and perhaps they took what water they had with them, which is why LE didn't find much or any in the truck).

If they parked at the Pinyon Wash trailhead, though (instead of trying to offroad up or down a wash or canyon), there's no reason to suspect a broken axle or flat tire. So that's one scenario (in which JRF has to drive some place that end up damaging his truck). Because if the truck was only 2.6 miles from Highway 78, I feel as if they could have gotten cell service AND a good chance of making it out alive (especially if they knew to wait until dark in some shaded spot and then walk out).

If they parked at the Pinyon Wash trailhead without damaging the truck, then the flood waters did the damage and something else happened to them on the hike. Such as an injury to JRF, since JF seems to have been found closer to the road.

A flat tire out there could definitely mean that one is royally screwed, although I've watched people decide to go onward on a flat (damaging their wheels/rims - but better than being stranded?)

So I wish we knew if he was trying to offroad UP Pinyon wash (it seems to me there'd be no way of turning around - but it's also possible he didn't know that and thought he could indeed to get to Harper Flat, when in fact, he could not.)

If JF was found closer to the road, does that mean she was likely found in the vicinity (that word again!) of where her backpack was reportedly found?

It may be that JF was able to walk further than JRF. But if they were both washed down the canyon by floodwater it's also possible that JF's lighter weight might have resulted in her being carried further by the wash.

 

[nao]

Moo.. it could overheat also 2017 has had 5 recalls

 

[Herat]

True. It could be either way. In one hypothesis, their car is disabled and they are out there without sufficient water (and perhaps they took what water they had with them, which is why LE didn't find much or any in the truck).

If they parked at the Pinyon Wash trailhead, though (instead of trying to offroad up or down a wash or canyon), there's no reason to suspect a broken axle or flat tire. So that's one scenario (in which JRF has to drive some place that end up damaging his truck). Because if the truck was only 2.6 miles from Highway 78, I feel as if they could have gotten cell service AND a good chance of making it out alive (especially if they knew to wait until dark in some shaded spot and then walk out).

If they parked at the Pinyon Wash trailhead without damaging the truck, then the flood waters did the damage and something else happened to them on the hike. Such as an injury to JRF, since JF seems to have been found closer to the road.

A flat tire out there could definitely mean that one is royally screwed, although I've watched people decide to go onward on a flat (damaging their wheels/rims - but better than being stranded?)

So I wish we knew if he was trying to offroad UP Pinyon wash (it seems to me there'd be no way of turning around - but it's also possible he didn't know that and thought he could indeed to get to Harper Flat, when in fact, he could not.)

Here is the description of that hike that you mention, 10ofRods. The hike appears to have been during March 2014, with some photos from March 2016.

Pinyon Wash - Harper Flat Loop

borregohiking.com

It honestly, is not that interesting of a hike and it appears the original hiker was interested in identifying and photographing wildflowers. I didn't see any references to pictographs, metates, morteros, or other findings of Native Activity there. There is an interesting feature he mentions: The Dike. If you look on the Harper Flat maps, there is a sandy are on the north-northeast area that appears consistent with this photo. The lower altitude sand is behind a dike-like natural rise of rocky terrain that runs for a short distance, maybe 1.5 miles along the northwest rim of Harper Flat. To me, the depth of the sandy bottom is such that a flood might not be able to wash objects over the top of the dike area and flush out down Harper Canyon, although it's presence implies water washes through here during flood times. There appear to be tread tracks there, like dirt bike tracks, not 4 wheeled vehicles.

Sandy area in front of the dike-like rise of rocks

I was hoping to see photos of the rocks that separate Pinyon Wash from Harper Flat and make the road impassable, but I don't see them. There appears to be a lot of rock-boulder scrambling. This can be really hard work and it's easy to get a leg entrapped or break an ankle in that kind of stuff. Still doesn't really explain where the remains were found.

Considering all the other hikes and drives that people have noted, this seems boring and featureless. The easiest, safest, and most varied would appear to be Fish Creek Wash into Hapaha Flat. This seems like an easy 2.4 mile drive in, but lacks shade, wildflowers, petroglyphs or and shade at all during July.

 

[Herat]

If JF was found closer to the road, does that mean she was likely found in the vicinity (that word again!) of where her backpack was reportedly found?

It may be that JF was able to walk further than JRF. But if they were both washed down the canyon by floodwater it's also possible that JF's lighter weight might have resulted in her being carried further by the wash.

I think it just means that the backpack was lighter at the time of the flood and more easily transported by floodwater. I don't see FJ as carrying a heavy pack with things like a Swiss Army knife, or safety equipment. I think they would have drunk all the water they brought, so only empty plastic bottles, some sunscreen, snacks, a light jacket, maybe a wallet. It seems as though JRF's pack would be more likely to carry survival type stuff- knife, fire-starter, rope or twine, extra shoes, a space blanket, signal mirror, maybe a tarp or such. Or maybe he just jettisoned things for water. I don't recall reading that his pack has been found.

I also, sadly, guess that they were both carrying their phones in hand, likely searching for a signal up until the end.

 

[10ofRods]

If JF was found closer to the road, does that mean she was likely found in the vicinity (that word again!) of where her backpack was reportedly found?

It may be that JF was able to walk further than JRF. But if they were both washed down the canyon by floodwater it's also possible that JF's lighter weight might have resulted in her being carried further by the wash.

Yes - either is possible and it may never be clear or "known."

Truck telemetry - will it function if the truck's electronics got wet? I have no clue - but maybe someone else does?

The Coroner may try to get JRF's phone records in hand to help establish approximate time of death (a window).

It's possible he had a heart attack; it's possible he had a stroke; it's possible he had heat stroke, etc, etc. But if the truck was down below them and they were walking *up* Pinyon Wash toward Harper Flat, I'd think that JF would have been able to make it to the truck - and @mark1969 has said that she knew how to drive (she would need not to panic and would have to remember to take the keys).

Does a 2020 Tacoma have that keyless system where you have to know a code to open it? If JRF was rendered unconscious, had he entrusted the code to JF?

I think these cases can be scrutinized to aid all of us in giving better advice to our friends and family who are wilderness lovers. If he did have a truck that was opened by a code (and left the keys in the car or whatever), did she remember the code in such horrific circumstances? I know I have had to write such things down since I was about 50 - my memory for pins and codes is maxed out.

The Coroner will be examining all of this and trying to come to what may be a tentative conclusion - MoD may be unknown and CoD as well. But the report will tell a harrowing tale and probably get the attention of desert goers who need a reminder about all the safety things.

I think the family is owed as many facts as can possibly be gleaned or gotten together.

 

[Herat]

The truck could have been in Pinyon Wash and the flooding caused it to roll or crack a window and fill with sand and mud, or have it's nose wedged into or under big rocks.

I sure hope we get to see photos of the truck in situ, before they remove it.

 

[10ofRods]

Here is the description of that hike that you mention, 10ofRods. The hike appears to have been during March 2014, with some photos from March 2016.

Pinyon Wash - Harper Flat Loop

borregohiking.com

It honestly, is not that interesting of a hike and it appears the original hiker was interested in identifying and photographing wildflowers. I didn't see any references to pictographs, metates, morteros, or other findings of Native Activity there. There is an interesting feature he mentions: The Dike. If you look on the Harper Flat maps, there is a sandy are on the north-northeast area that appears consistent with this photo. The lower altitude sand is behind a dike-like natural rise of rocky terrain that runs for a short distance, maybe 1.5 miles along the northwest rim of Harper Flat. To me, the depth of the sandy bottom is such that a flood might not be able to wash objects over the top of the dike area and flush out down Harper Canyon, although it's presence implies water washes through here during flood times. There appear to be tread tracks there, like dirt bike tracks, not 4 wheeled vehicles.

Sandy area in front of the dike-like rise of rocks
View attachment 458020

I was hoping to see photos of the rocks that separate Pinyon Wash from Harper Flat and make the road impassable, but I don't see them. There appears to be a lot of rock-boulder scrambling. This can be really hard work and it's easy to get a leg entrapped or break an ankle in that kind of stuff. Still doesn't really explain where the remains were found.

Considering all the other hikes and drives that people have noted, this seems boring and featureless. The easiest, safest, and most varied would appear to be Fish Creek Wash into Hapaha Flat. This seems like an easy 2.4 mile drive in, but lacks shade, wildflowers, petroglyphs or and shade at all during July.

See, for some reason, I don't see JRF as the kind of person who carefully researches his hikes. And, while Pinyon Wash itself doesn't have many artifacts, the fun of going up toward a place like Harper Flat/Winter Village is that bones and artifacts still erode down onto Harper Flat. And if they had explored the area enough, they could have found the actual petroglyphs and some of the ancient grinding sites. I feel as if JF wanted to see some of those spots. Going up Pinyon Wash would be one way to get up there - and a lot of people don't choose the most direct way to do something. They go with the flow.

Yet, in the hot months, it is indeed crucial to plan and have plan B and C. IMO. But somehow I doubt that JRF went on AllTrails and scoped out the pro's and con's of the hikes up there.

 

[Herat]

"I iSee, for some reason, I don't see JRF as the kind of person who carefully researches his hikes. And, while Pinyon Wash itself doesn't have many artifacts, the fun of going up toward a place like Harper Flat/Winter Village is that bones and artifacts still erode down onto Harper Flat. And if they had explored the area enough, they could have found the actual petroglyphs and some of the ancient grinding sites. I feel as if JF wanted to see some of those spots. Going up Pinyon Wash would be one way to get up there - and a lot of people don't choose the most direct way to do something. They go with the flow."

Yet, in the hot months, it is indeed crucial to plan and have plan B and C. IMO. But somehow I doubt that JRF went on AllTrails and scoped out the pro's and con's of the hikes up there.

I agree. For a camping trip, it is not apparent, yet, that there was camping gear or an abandoned campsite that gave anyone notice they were missing. Of course, if the vehicle is filled with mud or sand, there may be stuff underneath it, or found on a more extensive search of the floodplain.

Did LE find JRF or FJs laptops or ipads in his trailer? A computer search might give some indication of what exactly he or she were researching and his most likely route. This was the first time in the short week she had been there that they were planning to camp, as I understand. I assume he has drive Highways 86 and 78 from Thermal to Julian before, perhaps the Pinyon Wash turnoff was the only one he remembered seeing. From her interest in spirituality, I have no doubt that visiting ancient Native American habitat sites would be of peak interest to her.

No LE notes or reports of any campgrounds or campsite spottings of his vehicle after the Thermal CCTV photo.

 

[ch_13]

It's quite the mystery how they ended up where they did. There are other nearby spots that are probably more scenic for a first time visitor than Anza-Borrega. And even among sites in the park, that area by Harper Flat is a relatively obscure corner. For example, here's a list of "Best Things to Do" in A-B and it's not listed.

I was wondering if they could have had the idea to find a quiet camping spot to do some stargazing as the park is well known for its dark skies. But the new moon was on July 17th, so July 21st wouldn't be ideal (although the moon would only be a crescent so it would be the best opportunity to see the stars for the next 25 days.)