Found Deceased CA - Fang Jin, 47, flew to LA from China, train to Palm Springs, Morongo Basin, 21 Jul 2023, w/ JohnRoot Fitzpatrick, 55, missing, 30 Jul ‘23

[slowpoke]

I’m trying to be understanding and supportive but admit it’s a little frustrating. Maybe someone with knowledge can comment but I’m thinking the behavior that appears odd to us- not actively distributing flyers and failure to support sharing of information- is possibly related to their culture of being private. Especially the negative criticism of the family is likely creating cautious approach. I’m 100% speculating. I’ve not yet given up, hoping to be finished with medical tests soon to again closely follow.

Maybe part cultural, but maybe just a young daughter (in her 20s?) being scared and overwhelmed at her mom disappearing in a country far away, and not knowing what she should be doing, or who to entrust to help her.

If I recall from the Chinese articles, the person who is assisting the family here didn’t know the family prior, and is just volunteering. So, for the daughter to even trust this volunteer must feel uncertain to her.

Just some thoughts, but not confident I’m correct In my thinking.

 

[slowpoke]

Since there’s been no movement or progress in finding Fang (that we know of, anyway), I was rereading our posts to see if any new thoughts came to me.

So, that last video Fang shared (7/21) was determined to be in Twentynine Palms riding north on Adobe Rd, and passes the Palms Baptist Church before the video ends. There was speculation here that they may have been heading to Wonder Valley to the East.

But maybe they were just heading to a gas station to fill up? On Google Maps, I see a Fastrip gas station beyond the church on the left side of Adobe Rd, about a half mile.
Then maybe after that they went westward on Hwy 62 to JRT’s Morongo Valley mobile home to spend the night?

The pickup truck was spotted via surveillance the next day on 7/22 in Thermal but no word if the occupants could be seen. Was It JRT alone? Both Fang & JRT? Someone else?

It may be too late (if they haven’t already checked), but I wish an investigator could have asked gas stations, eateries and businesses to look at their security cams.

Because we do not really have a specific last seen location, nor even where she was staying, though it is a guess she stayed at JRT’s place in Morongo Valley.

Where should searchers start looking for the missing pair and the pickup truck? Julian, where JRT’s phone lady pinged? I don’t think we know where Fang’s phone last pinged.

Just my wandering thoughts, and MOO.

 

[patternsfinder]

Since there’s been no movement or progress in finding Fang (that we know of, anyway), I was rereading our posts to see if any new thoughts came to me.

So, that last video Fang shared (7/21) was determined to be in Twentynine Palms riding north on Adobe Rd, and passes the Palms Baptist Church before the video ends. There was speculation here that they may have been heading to Wonder Valley to the East.

But maybe they were just heading to a gas station to fill up? On Google Maps, I see a Fastrip gas station beyond the church on the left side of Adobe Rd, about a half mile.
Then maybe after that they went westward on Hwy 62 to JRT’s Morongo Valley mobile home to spend the night?

The pickup truck was spotted via surveillance the next day on 7/22 in Thermal but no word if the occupants could be seen. Was It JRT alone? Both Fang & JRT? Someone else?

It may be too late (if they haven’t already checked), but I wish an investigator could have asked gas stations, eateries and businesses to look at their security cams.

Because we do not really have a specific last seen location, nor even where she was staying, though it is a guess she stayed at JRT’s place in Morongo Valley.

Where should searchers start looking for the missing pair and the pickup truck? Julian, where JRT’s phone lady pinged? I don’t think we know where Fang’s phone last pinged.

Just my wandering thoughts, and MOO.

I appreciate your revisiting and rethinking. Regarding getting gas, MOO, it wouldn't make sense to drive miles off of Hwy 62 to get gas, when there are tons of gas stations right on the hwy, including right near the turn onto Adobe Rd. It would be driving extra miles only to turn back to drive those miles again to the hwy, if the plan was to then head west on the hwy to JRF's home. I was the one who originally suggested Wonder Valley, although I also wonder if it's possible he drove onto and through the base, coming out in north Joshua Tree out in the dirt road area where another base gate leads.

But! Your revisiting inspired me to look at a map of everything on Adobe Rd, and that led me to note something new (to me at least). At the edge of the block they were driving, on the left/west hand side, there is a storage unit location I didn't know about, Adobe Self Storage. It doesn't seem logical to me that someone that lives in Morongo Valley would rent storage in 29 Palms, as there are many options closer to MV. But also, logic may not be the thing that leads to any leads here, so I figured I'd share that finding.

 

[megs1477]

Something that I don’t think we have considered, is if they are actually voluntarily missing. Meaning, LE located them and they said they were just taking a break from life and off the grid intentionally. We have seen this before. LE can’t inform the family…. Just a thought, I have nothing factual to base this on.

 

[ClaireNC]

Something that I don’t think we have considered, is if they are actually voluntarily missing. Meaning, LE located them and they said they were just taking a break from life and off the grid intentionally. We have seen this before. LE can’t inform the family…. Just a thought, I have nothing factual to base this on.

Is it true that “LE can’t inform family”? We’ve seen cases where LE have said that someone was located and they are choosing to keep their whereabouts unknown. But I don’t remember any cases where LE didn’t let a family know that their loved one is at least alive.

Also, I think the fact that Ms Jin is an international visitor would make a big difference here. She doesn‘t have the same legal rights as a US citizen. IMO.

 

[slowpoke]

I appreciate your revisiting and rethinking. Regarding getting gas, MOO, it wouldn't make sense to drive miles off of Hwy 62 to get gas, when there are tons of gas stations right on the hwy, including right near the turn onto Adobe Rd. It would be driving extra miles only to turn back to drive those miles again to the hwy, if the plan was to then head west on the hwy to JRF's home. I was the one who originally suggested Wonder Valley, although I also wonder if it's possible he drove onto and through the base, coming out in north Joshua Tree out in the dirt road area where another base gate leads.

But! Your revisiting inspired me to look at a map of everything on Adobe Rd, and that led me to note something new (to me at least). At the edge of the block they were driving, on the left/west hand side, there is a storage unit location I didn't know about, Adobe Self Storage. It doesn't seem logical to me that someone that lives in Morongo Valley would rent storage in 29 Palms, as there are many options closer to MV. But also, logic may not be the thing that leads to any leads here, so I figured I'd share that finding.

I notice right next to the Fastrip gas station is a Fans Sports Bar & Grill. On Fridays and Saturdays, it seems they’re open until midnight. Maybe another possible intended destination.

The Self Storage place you noticed gave me another idea. What if JRT has a Camper RV stored there and they were heading there to hook it up to his truck so they could take an extended trip somewhere. But, I don’t know—are those places accessible at all hours?

Just doing some outside the box thinking.

 

[Laughing]

I notice right next to the Fastrip gas station is a Fans Sports Bar & Grill. On Fridays and Saturdays, it seems they’re open until midnight. Maybe another possible intended destination.

The Self Storage place you noticed gave me another idea. What if JRT has a Camper RV stored there and they were heading there to hook it up to his truck so they could take an extended trip somewhere. But, I don’t know—are those places accessible at all hours?

Just doing some outside the box thinking.

But, is Fans Sports Bar & Grill the bar that closed because of the heat? Or was that another bar?

 

[slowpoke]

But, is Fans Sports Bar & Grill the bar that closed because of the heat? Or was that another bar?

I don’t recall discussing this eatery before. Maybe you mean the Wonder Valley place, called The Palms?

Do we know the time of day JRT’s pickup truck was caught on surveillance video in Thermal on 7/22? I was just remembering the truck was not towing anything at that time, nor was there any visible cargo in the (bed of the) truck.

MOO

 

[megs1477]

I don’t recall discussing this eatery before. Maybe you mean the Wonder Valley place, called The Palms?

Do we know the time of day JRT’s pickup truck was caught on surveillance video in Thermal on 7/22? I was just remembering the truck was not towing anything at that time, nor was there any visible cargo in the (bed of the) truck.

MOO

The source of the Thermal location is the family. Nothing official has been released other than the photo of the truck.

 

[patternsfinder]

I don’t recall discussing this eatery before. Maybe you mean the Wonder Valley place, called The Palms?

Do we know the time of day JRT’s pickup truck was caught on surveillance video in Thermal on 7/22? I was just remembering the truck was not towing anything at that time, nor was there any visible cargo in the (bed of the) truck.

MOO

I just checked and Fans looks like it would have been open on July 21st. The Palms was also open that night, but the bartender at The Palms has shared he didn't see Fang that night.

Re Thermal, and also the photo of the truck, I wonder how LE would know/have found either detail. I understand the only LE cited item is the photo. But how did LE get it? Did they track his phone location for the final days his phone was pinging and then reached out for cameras? If so, I wonder how many days back in time they did that for, and whether they only found that one truck photo, or if they have other info? The fact of the truck photo does make it seem like more of an investigation had to have occured than has been shared in detail publicly.

 

[slowpoke]

I just checked and Fans looks like it would have been open on July 21st. The Palms was also open that night, but the bartender at The Palms has shared he didn't see Fang that night.

Re Thermal, and also the photo of the truck, I wonder how LE would know/have found either detail. I understand the only LE cited item is the photo. But how did LE get it? Did they track his phone location for the final days his phone was pinging and then reached out for cameras? If so, I wonder how many days back in time they did that for, and whether they only found that one truck photo, or if they have other info? The fact of the truck photo does make it seem like more of an investigation had to have occured than has been shared in detail publicly.

This is howI think it works: There are Automated License Plate Readers placed in various locations throughout cities, like on a traffic light or over freeways. The machines regularly snap photos, “read“ the plates, and store the info in a database. LE then can input a specific license plate number and see if it pops up. I believe this may be how JRT’s pickup truck was captured by the cam in Thermal, CA on 7/22. MOO

Automated License Plate Readers - CA

 

[patternsfinder]

This is howI think it works: There are Automated License Plate Readers placed in various locations throughout cities, like on a traffic light or over freeways. The machines regularly snap photos, “read“ the plates, and store the info in a database. LE then can input a specific license plate number and see if it pops up. I believe this may be how JRT’s pickup truck was captured by the cam in Thermal, CA on 7/22. MOO

Automated License Plate Readers - CA

Thanks for this info! I found the below list, from the link you shared, interesting, as far as this case. A few times in that doc it specifies that for missing person cases, this technology is used for those cases related to children and the elderly. I guess it's possible they found a workaround to that requirement. But, perhaps there's another reason on the list that applies that allowed for the technology to be used here. Or maybe I'm reading too much into the specificity of mentioning which missing persons cases are included.

The lawful purposes required for users (LE) to access the system are
1. Locate Stolen, Wanted, or Suspect Vehicles.
2. Locate Suspect(s) of Criminal Investigation or Arrest Warrant.
3. Locate Witnesses or Victims of Violent Crime.
4. Locate Missing Children and Elderly individuals (Amber / Silver Alerts).
5. Protect the Public during Special Events / Situational Awareness.
6. Protect Critical Infrastructure.

 

[dulcinea]

Something that I don’t think we have considered, is if they are actually voluntarily missing. Meaning, LE located them and they said they were just taking a break from life and off the grid intentionally. We have seen this before. LE can’t inform the family…. Just a thought, I have nothing factual to base this on.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but don't they have missing posters on a site or two? Even if LE doesn't alert the family, they would at least have the posters taken down, right?

 

[megs1477]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but don't they have missing posters on a site or two? Even if LE doesn't alert the family, they would at least have the posters taken down, right?

I don’t think I’ve seen them remove posters, except in some cases for minors. They usually will update the post and say they have been located safe. That does not always happen though. I don’t discount anything until I see proof either way.

 

[10ofRods]

Is it true that “LE can’t inform family”? We’ve seen cases where LE have said that someone was located and they are choosing to keep their whereabouts unknown. But I don’t remember any cases where LE didn’t let a family know that their loved one is at least alive.

Also, I think the fact that Ms Jin is an international visitor would make a big difference here. She doesn‘t have the same legal rights as a US citizen. IMO.

In what way does she not have the same legal rights as a US Citizen? Which rights does she not have?

She's unlikely to be hired - but she has the right to apply for a work visa and to apply for a job, etc. She can't get welfare benefits - but those are not rights, to begin with. She has the right to remain silent if arrested, just as everyone on US soil has.

This idea that we only give our own citizens rights is quite new to me, are there really incidents of foreign visitors being locked up without due process? But we have freedom of movement, of speech, of the press, of non-self incrimination - and so do foreign visitors. There are many non-citizens who have lived, worked and been afforded every legal right that a US citizen - while in the US. It's one reason people do come here, not seeking citizenship, just residency. To work and live in America - where anyone (including foreigners) can file a lawsuit. I work among many legal non-citizens. They are not denied their rights by LE or by the courts.

IMO.

 

[AnyNameIWish]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but don't they have missing posters on a site or two? Even if LE doesn't alert the family, they would at least have the posters taken down, right?

I don't recall any physical posters being printed / shared / posted in person by anyone in the area or anywhere for that matter.

There were suggestions made (reach out to churches, community groups, Chinese student groups in nearby areas) but nothing actually ever happened. It made local news in the palm springs area (channel 3) but that's about it.

 

[dulcinea]

I don't recall any physical posters being printed / shared / posted in person by anyone in the area or anywhere for that matter.

There were suggestions made (reach our to churches, community groups, Chinese student groups in nearby areas) but nothing actually ever happened. It made local news in the palm springs area (channel 3) but that's about it.

I didn't mean literally put up in public, but rather posted on missing persons websites.

 

[slowpoke]

I didn't mean literally put up in public, but rather posted on missing persons websites.

Their postings are still there on the Morongo Basin Sheriff‘s Station FB Page, fwiw:
Fang Jin, missing
John Fitzpatrick, missing

 

[AnyNameIWish]

@dulcinea thank you for clarifying. 'Site' I understood it as 'physical location' and not 'website'.

Yes, there's one flyer under the missing persons database but not one just dedicated to her disappearance (which also would have been a good idea.) Glad to see it on FB but unfortunately it's been over a month now- interest online is waning (or so it seems to me) and it's shocking that the Chinese Embassy doesn't seem to be weighing in or helping one bit!

 

[10ofRods]

@dulcinea thank you for clarifying. 'Site' I understood it as 'physical location' and not 'website'.

Yes, there's one flyer under the missing persons database but not one just dedicated to her disappearance (which also would have been a good idea.) Glad to see it on FB but unfortunately it's been over a month now- interest online is waning (or so it seems to me) and it's shocking that the Chinese Embassy doesn't seem to be weighing in or helping one bit!

How is this an international law issue? Ambassadors do not usually weigh in on the voluntarily missing cases of their citizens who are on proper visas.

Someone would have to contact them, convince them it was an INVOLUNTARILY missing person. Ambassadors do not usually try to challenge local customs, laws or ordinances.

It is entirely up to the local jurisdiction (San Bernardino County, the other counties - and the State of California) to deal with this - and SBCSO is dealing with this as they deal with the other 3000 missing people in their county.

I don't even think that some kind of press release by a foreign embassy would get any press/MSM coverage here in California. Of course interest is waning, because either this pair has encountered dire and tragic circumstances together, or one of them has, or they are off having a great time traveling around North America. No one knows.

The people I think are the most remiss are the friends and family of JRF, because they know the ropes here (and hold the key to getting more investigation).

IMO.