CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #11

[missy1974]

I think the bigger take away is that something drastically changed in October 2009 with regard to how much Merritt was being paid. I think it appears this is when MSM entered the picture. Fast forward to the end of January and MSM doesn’t want to deal with Merritt any longer. I don’t think the prosecution made a big enough deal of this situation. I think it is proof of Merritt’s imminent exit from the McStay business model.

That big change was going into business with MSM. From Sequieda's testimony, he didn't want to deal with Merritt anymore... but Sequieda also left shortly after that as he had another falling out with his father IIRC I wish we had heard from the Dad.

The change appears to show that Chase made less, but he would have no expenses. Just as an example, the fountain previous to Oct 2, was in August... the project was $7770... Chases $$$ was $5050 (65%). Is it reasonable to conclude that Chase made, delivered, and installed that fountain and pocketed all $5050 and had $0 for expenses, if that's exactly what Joey paid him. He may have deducted expenses like he did with MSM, but that doesn't show on the screenshot, so we don't know.

I don't know if this makes Chase and less or more guilty, but it does explain the money a bit better being able to see that column and see what MSM was paid, and the 2 added together is 65%.

ETA: I shouldn't say he had no expenses after MSM was involved... I think he could have been responsible for the electrical/plumbing and maybe even the wood for crating the projects to be shipped. But I am not 100% sure.

 

[Mica]

It's interesting looking at the Saudi Arabia money.

Chase printed himself the following cheques for this job -

Feb 2nd - $2495 - memo line: deposit sa 1001
Feb 5th - $2350 - memo line: lighting install sa (1001)
Feb 8th - $6500 - memo line: saudi arabia final

So that totals $11,345

This job was listed on the email (not included in money payable to Chase yet).

It was also the job he was asking Susan Blake and Dan for money to complete and yet he had already advanced himself the above cheques and Susan testified he said he received $17,000 when it was completed.

JMO

To those who follow daily, didn’t the defense on cross show Susan a copy of a check in the amount of 17k that was returned for insufficient funds?

 

[missy1974]

To those who follow daily, didn’t the defense on cross show Susan a copy of a check in the amount of 17k that was returned for insufficient funds?

hmmm I might have to go back and listen to her testimony, I wasn't taking good notes back then, didn't think I was going to get that hooked on this trial LOL

 

[LadyL]

I think the bigger take away is that something drastically changed in October 2009 with regard to how much Merritt was being paid. I think it appears this is when MSM entered the picture. Fast forward to the end of January and MSM doesn’t want to deal with Merritt any longer. I don’t think the prosecution made a big enough deal of this situation. I think it is proof of Merritt’s imminent exit from the McStay business model.

[bbm]

for sure! it's just so obvious

 

[Texas Red]

What is your take on the wording of the email? It could be construed (or misconstrued) to read that JM owed Merritt money. “Chase paid” is either “Chase was paid” or “Chase already paid” depending on the usage of the word paid.

The email is from JM, so, it would be from his perspective.

Chase Paid = Chase was Paid.
Chase Owed= Chase was Owed.

Otherwise, if CM had overpaid JM $15,045 it would be listed as a debit from JM’s perspective. As in the following example.

Chase Paid 173,255
Chase Owed 158,210
Overpaid <15,045>

Plus 8800 (Levine)
Plus 19000 (Provecho)
Overpaid <15,045>
Total $12,777

 

[Cricket28]

ahhhh I'm happy they are off until next week lol I have been busy working and need the time to catch up!

Are you going to be able to make it back to the trial @Cricket28 ?

I'm sure going to try Missy. I just wish we knew when some of the key witnesses, like DK or CJ, were testifying. I would definitely make arrangements to be in S. Calif for those days.

 

[MichaelCorleone]

That big change was going into business with MSM. From Sequieda's testimony, he didn't want to deal with Merritt anymore... but Sequieda also left shortly after that as he had another falling out with his father IIRC I wish we had heard from the Dad.

The change appears to show that Chase made less, but he would have no expenses. Just as an example, the fountain previous to Oct 2, was in August... the project was $7770... Chases $$$ was $5050 (65%). Is it reasonable to conclude that Chase made, delivered, and installed that fountain and pocketed all $5050 and had $0 for expenses, if that's exactly what Joey paid him. He may have deducted expenses like he did with MSM, but that doesn't show on the screenshot, so we don't know.

I don't know if this makes Chase and less or more guilty, but it does explain the money a bit better being able to see that column and see what MSM was paid, and the 2 added together is 65%.

ETA: I shouldn't say he had no expenses after MSM was involved... I think he could have been responsible for the electrical/plumbing and maybe even the wood for crating the projects to be shipped. But I am not 100% sure.

Yes, but don’t forget Joseph had told his Dad that he could buy the supplies for next to nothing and build the fountains himself. Of course this was not testimony and it also was why he decided to go into business making fountains, so it was early on. It’s just that the statement rings in the back of my head when it comes to expenses.

 

[MichaelCorleone]

The email is from JM, so, it would be from his perspective.

Chase Paid = Chase was Paid.
Chase Owed= Chase was Owed.

Otherwise, if CM had overpaid JM $15,045 it would be listed as a debit from JM’s perspective. As in the following example.

Chase Paid 173,255
Chase Owed 158,210
Overpaid <15,045>

Plus 8800 (Levine)
Plus 19000 (Provecho)
Overpaid <15,045>
Total $12,777

Well you’d make a lousy defense attorney. Lol.

(Totally kidding. I know how sensitive people can be around here.)

 

[Force Ten]

<modsnipped quoted post>
But Merritt has a defense team, no? A defense that is scrambling to cloud the facts and evidence. I support a balanced review of the evidence. That's what the scales Lady Justice holds represent.

When you go presenting alternate theories that are not realistic, you've lost me. There's no rush to judgement on the prosecution's part and this isn't a witch trial.

 

[Texas Red]

So was it DK slagging off Summer after the family vanished as I thought it was Chase?

The only person who has shown any inkling or hatred towards the family is Chase.

IMO

"The only person who has shown any inkling or hatred towards the family is Chase."
Are you forgetting about the direct threat that DK made towards JM?

 

[Force Ten]

IIRC, Chase also said that "Joseph was my best friend, but I wasn't Joseph's best friend." Am I remembering this right? If so, very telling, in my book, when coupled with ALL the other things said.

That last part is quite telling imo. Why even state it? It's almost as if he was thinking it and didn't mean to say it but the words just came out.

Did Chase even have any friends, or were they all just business acquaintances he ripped off? Joseph Mcstay wasn't Chase's best friend, dead presidents were.

 

[Tortoise]

To those who follow daily, didn’t the defense on cross show Susan a copy of a check in the amount of 17k that was returned for insufficient funds?

Ah that's interesting because I didn't ever hear her cross-examination and I had wondered if they didn't cross-examine her because she was Joey's mother and they didn't want to come across to the jury as insensitive. I haven't been able to find the video of it, but maybe it was only live and that's why I missed it.

 

[Cricket28]

OMG, CM denies being in the area of the grave sites a week after they were reported missing.

What else are you explaining THIS man wasn't involved with their murders at this point? Seriously ? He hasn't been able to tell the truth since they were missing. How many "red flags" do you need to see HE was involved with their murders now?

Those who think he is innocent MUST have a hard time with LE and YOUR past experience with dealing with LE. There is NO WAY SBSO is out to "get" CM for these murders, NO WAY.

The "evidence" is overwhelming at this point.

Lie after lie after lie by CM so far. It's time to realize HE was the one who killed the MS Family.

AND...on day 26 part 2, during CM's interview with Bachman (approx 8:37 mark) he doesn't seem able to recall what roads in Victorville the bodies were buried off of. Even though he admitted in the same interview to being there after the crosses were put up. Come on!

MOO

 

[Mica]

I've transcribed a few portions of the Judge's response to the defense's motion to dismiss:

She then indicates that Mr McStay, Joseph McStay had indicated to her that it was his intent or desire to phase actually both Mr Merritt and Mr Kavanaugh out of the business and other evidence indicated that indeed there was already a plan in place to buy out Mr Kavanaugh that was almost complete, but that he also intended to phase Mr Merritt out of the business and get a warehouse where he could have more welders to fabricate more waterfalls.

Tortoise, thank you for transcribing and typing out the portions from the Judge's response.

Respectfully snipped for brevity. This is something I don't understand in Susan's testimony. With regard to the BBM, the EIP website at that time states: "we own and occupy a 50,000 + sq. ft. warehouse complete with workshops and a state of the art finishing booth." That's a pretty big warehouse. Seems Joey owned a large enough warehouse for added welders and fabrications. Why need another place? JMO

indoor-wall-water-fountains.gif

 

[Texas Red]

Listening to the judge the other day, there were things that he was saying that didn't seem right, it wasn't until the end of his decision that I understood why. IMO he was only considering what the prosecution put forth. Just as an example... about the voicemails which you have transcribed in your post, we learned that VM's were deleted and that the VM's that they did find on Joey's phone were from after it was reported in the media that he was missing, so how were they to find VM's from someone that left them previous to that if they were deleted?


Here is the judge explaining the standard that the court considers in regards to a 1118.1 hearing:


Now certainly all of that information that I've just gone over was subject to considerable cross-examination and I have no doubt that Mr. McGee and Mr. Maline could give their closing argument on that information and could probably take a better part of a day and with a different argument, a different analysis, different inferences, and different conclusions drawn. But that really is not the standard for the court to look at with regard to an 1118.1 motion to dismiss, the standard on the 1118.1 motion is not that all other analysis or conclusions can be eliminated but rather the standard is if the jury were to accept and of course I'm not going through every exhibit, I'm not going through every item of evidence and every point of prosecution may argue that supports a verdict of guilty, I'm only considering what the court considers primary or major factors, there are a lot of other potential issues that the prosecution may (?) support, but I'm not considering those in the 1118.1 motion. So, as I was saying, the standard it's not that can the court eliminate all of those of our analysis or conclusions but rather the standard on the 1118.1 motion to dismiss is if the jury were to accept the prosecution's evidence and arguments and analysis and conclusions and conclude that that is sufficient proof guilt beyond a reasonable doubt and therefore return a verdict of guilty and thereby at least by inference was rejecting the defense evidence, the defense arguments, and the defense analysis, would that decision by the jury be supported by substantial evidence. The points that I just went through, in the courts view, do support or would support such a finding by the jury So the Court finds that if the jury accepted the prosecution's evidence, arguments, and conclusions and returned a verdict of guilty that there is substantial evidence to support such a finding, for those reasons the motion to dismiss the (?) section 1118.1 is denied.


can be heard at 1:00 of this video:

Thank you for again keeping the record straight.

 

[katydid23]

Evidence? Especially regarding Joey and jealousy.

It is basic common sense. Look at Chase's circumstances at the time. Desperate financial straits, huge debts, pending lawsuits and tax liens, dwindling payroll checks, future looks bleak.

Joey has 90k in the bank, nice new home, owns a lucrative business, has a loving family and future looks bright.

You don't think Chase would feel jealous?

 

[Mony Mony]

No clue LOL I was wondering that myself..

Could it be that they changed the 65% minus MSM or expenses to 15%? It would be inline with what he was getting paid anyway after they were in partnership with MSM? it doesn't explain the "savings" part of that... how confusing! LOL

I am still wondering when Joey's fiscal year end was, and I have not heard or been able to find that.

I think I now understand the MSM issue with wanting to know how much Joey was getting paid for the fountains. They wanted to know how much Chase was getting paid, because if they were doing some of his work, they wanted to be paid for it. Joey tells them it's none of your business, just bill what you do and I will pay you... So if they billed what they did, even part of Chase's job, they did get paid for it and it would have come from Chase's "cut" anyway, and that was probably Joey's thinking, because it really was none of their business how much Joey was making. JMO

Joey does not strike me as someone that would keep a fiscal year. IMO/MOO, Joey just went by calendar year.

 

[QueenBofOB]

But it had to be parked there on the Monday, according to the security company that towed the vehicle. They testified early in the trial.

Yeah. Like I said, he could've dropped it off the day before and went to TJ to bet on the Superbowl. I already mentioned that I parked there numerous times and never had anyone confront me. In my opinion, the security patrol was very lax. (I doubt that the owners would want to admit to the general public, in the event more people decided to use their lot, instead of paying for parking).

 

[oceanblueeyes]

[bbm]

for sure! it's just so obvious

Yes, it's quite obvious CMs life was in a downward spiral as fast has someone who's parachute didn't open with the hard ground just feet away from impact.

It's still unbelievable to me that CM was paid a lot of money by Joey, but didn't have a dime to his name to show for any of it.

What did he have to show for all he was paid, except bouncing checks he knew he had no way to cover. Talk about a deadbeat loser!

He was on his way too crashing, and burning. Some people will do extreme things in order to get money, even from a dead man they have killed.

The motive for financial greed has lead to many innocent victims being murdered.

Unfortunately it's TRUE, and money can often be the root of all evil bringing out the worst. This same motive has lead to many dead victims. Prisons are filled with those who murdered because of greed, and financial gain.

It is such an evil motive it is listed as one of the elements why these kind of cases are death penalty qualified cases in every state who has the DP. It's that bad of a motive.....as it should be.

This one is even worse than most because he murdered not only Joey, but his wife, who CM knew Joey loved dearly, and the worst of all he murdered two tiny little boys that belonged to the very man he said was HIS best friend. Joey was probably his only friend.

No doubt about it, Joey was the best friend this creep ever had. CM also wasnt Joey's best friend just like he said which speaks volumes. Among all of his lies he lets the truth slip out every now, and then.

This is tragically why this case is the perfect example of the ultimate betrayal for Joey, and his entire family.

This is how CM decided to repay his best friend for all of his kindness, and to Joey's family who CM knew meant everything to Joey.

Imo

 

[Mica]

Ah that's interesting because I didn't ever hear her cross-examination and I had wondered if they didn't cross-examine her because she was Joey's mother and they didn't want to come across to the jury as insensitive. I haven't been able to find the video of it, but maybe it was only live and that's why I missed it.

Tortoise, I'll look for the audio, too. I'm almost certain it was Susan that I recall on cross with an insufficient check. If I find it, I'll post.