CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #14

[citygirl]

I think the time off could be good or bad, there is just no way to know right now. Sometimes information overload is not good, but information at a snails pace can be risky that they could forget the little things, and sometimes the little things are the important things.

It will be interesting to hear from the jury after the trial and hear what their thoughts are about the time off, etc. Maybe it's just not that big of a deal to them, maybe they like it? They get to go to work on these days off (if they have jobs) I think, so it might be welcomed.

Did we ever learn the make up of the jury?

 

[Force Ten]

I definitely agree! I don't understand how the documentary being filmed could be of any interest. They would have to edit out all of the nonsense and dark days. Even after doing that it's my belief that neither team has delivered any "film worthy" moments since the close of OS. Does anyone else wonder if they (either or both sides) are continuing to drag this out until the end of April (and Smith's retirement) when there will be a mistrial declared. jmho

Is he officially retiring after this? I was wondering if there was a mistrial, would they have a different judge in the second trial? Would the jurors exceeding their time be grounds for an automatic mistrial?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

This trial is costing way less than "millions" I'm sure, but a lot of money nonetheless.

I want to know how much of an eroding effect the days off are having on the jurors. They may be at a point where they either don't care for the prosecution and/or defense argument. Or perhaps it's making them more eager to pay attention.

The case in itself is engrossing. I hope more than half the jurors at the very least feel that way and stay attentive enough to have valid discernment to deliberate.

If we ever learn the full amount this pre trial, and trial has cost the taxpayers, I think it will be way more than you may think.

Any defense attorney he has used has been being paid all along for years way before trial commenced.

I think the defense part could easily be 1 to 2 million including paying for experts as well.

1 to 2 million or more is the typical average for a DP case since it takes so long to come to trial, and much longer than other murder cases. Some have been 4 million.

This is CA though so it could be even more. No one knows better how to pad/inflate expenses than criminal defense attorneys. Imo.

Imo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I think the time off could be good or bad, there is just no way to know right now. Sometimes information overload is not good, but information at a snails pace can be risky that they could forget the little things, and sometimes the little things are the important things.

It will be interesting to hear from the jury after the trial and hear what their thoughts are about the time off, etc. Maybe it's just not that big of a deal to them, maybe they like it? They get to go to work on these days off (if they have jobs) I think, so it might be welcomed.

It sure wouldn't be welcoming to me if I was a part of this jury.

Imo most want to complete the task they have been asked to do so they can return to their normal lives, and duties on a regular basis.

I highly doubt they like being in suspended limbo.

IIRC,, even when Cricket attended court quite awhile back now they saw the jury roll their eyes, and groan even back then, because they were made to wait outside once again doing nothing.

Imo, this is no fun, and games for them. They would much rather have their lives return to normalcy, rather than constantly waiting for something to happen, that never seems to come to pass.

Imo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Is he officially retiring after this? I was wondering if there was a mistrial, would they have a different judge in the second trial? Would the jurors exceeding their time be grounds for an automatic mistrial?

Imo, no. He would only declare a mistrial if be was left with a jury of 12 And didnt have one or two alerternate left, in case something happened to one or two during the deliberations.

I have seen where jurors have been booted from deliberations for jury misconduct before. One was even the Foreman on a case.

The longer it takes the bigger the risk of a mistrial.

Could this be the defense strategy perhaps????

They are pushing the envelope though for some of the jurors to start jumping ship. If they have good cause he cant force them to stay.

I think even ADA MR is beginning to worry about it taking so long.

 

[travelbug]

Is he officially retiring after this? I was wondering if there was a mistrial, would they have a different judge in the second trial? Would the jurors exceeding their time be grounds for an automatic mistrial?

I believe there was a comment made at the beginning of the trial that this would be his final trial prior to retiring. I'm not familiar with the legal tenets that may apply to this case. However, a mistrial can be called for procedural errors. We know that time is running out for some of the subpeonas. My thought is more along the lines of possible new evidence that brings into question the jurisdiction of SBC, or time delays that bring into question the ability of Judge Smith and/or the jurors to continue hearing the trial to conclusion. I'm just spitballing here because there just seems to be something "off" about the manner in which this trial is being conducted. imho

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I'm going to stick my neck out, which I normally don't do. Lol

I think the DNA of others found from the gravesites will be garbage in....garbage out, and wont move the needle one way or the other.

I also think once direct is over of each defense expert, the state is fully prepared to refute it during cross examinations. I really wish MR would do all crosses.

I've seen many of these so called high powered experts (many were nationally known) that were going to save the defendant, and they did not.

Many were actually exposed as nothing more than hired guns, who if paid enough money, would swear under oath the moon is made of cheese. Lol!

As an aside: The only ones who benefits from a mistrial is the defendant, and team.

I really do seriously wonder if that is exactly what the defense wants to happen?

It's far better than CM going off to prison if convicted, and it also gives his DT the opportunity to gouge the taxpayers out of even more $$$$$$$.

Jmo though.

 

[citygirl]

Imo, no. He would only declare a mistrial if be was left with a jury of 12 And didnt have one or two alerternate left, in case something happened to one or two during the deliberations.

I have seen where jurors have been booted from deliberations for jury misconduct before. One was even the Foreman on a case.

The longer it takes the bigger the risk of a mistrial.

Could this be the defense strategy perhaps????

They are pushing the envelope though for some of the jurors to start jumping ship. If they have good cause he cant force them to stay.

I think even ADA MR is beginning to worry about it taking so long.

Me too. I recall the judge saying something about 10 jurors left?We will work around it. Maybe because they have 6 alternates ?

 

[citygirl]

Is he officially retiring after this? I was wondering if there was a mistrial, would they have a different judge in the second trial? Would the jurors exceeding their time be grounds for an automatic mistrial?

I could swear he was brought out of retirement or semi-retirement to oversee this trial? I posted earlier on that that was why he was in no rush. He is doing what he loves.

 

[citygirl]

Man,I must be losing it! Did I dream this?

 

[katydid23]

But if the Prosecution has already rested they cannot present more DNA evidence - can they?

Yes , in Rebuttal case they can add evidence that rrbutsvthe defense case

 

[katydid23]

Anything is possible, but IMO I don't believe that. There are a ton of theories or possibilities, but if we are using the State's timeline, there are time constraints as well. IMO using their time frame, this had to be done pretty quickly. So laying down tarps, leaving them in the house for any period of time and coming back, etc. just doesn't work for me, there is always something that just doesn't fit. It would also be odd to me that he or anyone would worry about throwing plastic away somewhere else, yet throw the sledgehammer in the graves, but all is JMO.

I have followed a lot of murder cases. I have never seen one where everything fits. There is always loose ends somewhere.

I don’t think we have enough of a solid timeline to say he couldn’t have taken a few extra moments to throw down a tarp

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I have followed a lot of murder cases. I have never seen one where everything fits. There is always loose ends somewhere.

I don’t think we have enough of a solid timeline to say he couldn’t have taken a few extra moments to throw down a tarp

Exactly, Katy!

That is the problem, and its not just with this case just like you have said .

In every case I've followed questions were always left unanswered. This one will be no exception.

No matter how he was able to do the murders the evidence imo, shows he did, I think the CE from the graves supports it happened inside of their home.

It is what it is, and we have to go by what the evidence supports as the most likely location of the murders.

The jury will do the same, imo.

Jmo

 

[Force Ten]

I definitely agree! I don't understand how the documentary being filmed could be of any interest. They would have to edit out all of the nonsense and dark days. Even after doing that it's my belief that neither team has delivered any "film worthy" moments since the close of OS. Does anyone else wonder if they (either or both sides) are continuing to drag this out until the end of April (and Smith's retirement) when there will be a mistrial declared. jmho

Well we know that the Doc crew interviewed Chase. I would assume they have done the same with some of the lawyers and detectives. I did hear a rumor that Netflix may be involved with it. I'm remaining optimistic, but with what Netflix has churned out, it may be a pro-defense doc in the end. It will be interesting to see what they leave out, like in the Avery doc.

Can you imagine a 'Free Chase' movement?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Man,I must be losing it! Did I dream this?

I did read that early on too.

 

[citygirl]

I did read that early on too.

Thank you!!!! Wish I could find the link.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Well we know that the Doc crew interviewed Chase. I would assume they have done the same with some of the lawyers and detectives. I did hear a rumor that Netflix may be involved with it. I'm remaining optimistic, but with what Netflix has churned out, it may be a pro-defense doc in the end. It will be interesting to see what they leave out, like in the Avery doc.

Can you imagine a 'Free Chase' movement?

If its put out by the same Avery producers, I'll have to pass.

I couldn't stand another one sided skewed story.

 

[UndiscoveredTruth]

Man,I must be losing it! Did I dream this?

I remember reading in one of the many articles, that the judge is "semi-retired" too. So no, you're not losing it lol! If he's semi-retired, it's most likely one of the reasons this case is taking so long to get through. It's a part-time job for him (judge). That's the way I'm looking at it anyway. MOO

 

[citygirl]

I remember reading in one of the many articles, that the judge is "semi-retired" too. So no, you're not losing it lol! If he's semi-retired, it's most likely one of the reasons this case is taking so long to get through. It's a part-time job for him (judge). That's the way I'm looking at it anyway. MOO

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

 

[Karinna]

Exactly.

What makes it so different than every single case I've followed (way too many probably lol) is not only the short days, but the amount of complete dark days where absolutely no testimony is even given.

It's even strange for a CA trial, and that is really saying something! Lol

In all other trials the judges have run trials like a fine oiled machine, with every day productive.

The most delay I have ever seen is when maybe one witness was on the list to testify on a certain day, and something happened where they wouldn't be able to make it that DAY.

So the judge would either adjourn early or tell the attorneys to put on another witness.

They do this for very good reasons. It not only keeps the testimony fresh in the minds of the jury, but it's also cost effective the less time is wasted. But most importantly is the judges were alwayd very mindful of the juries own time. They get paid little to nothing for doing their civic duties, and judges know they have their own lives to take care of as well.

I can understand if a juror has told the judge they must be off for an important reason, but all the down time by not having witnesses available for days or weeks on end, that is what is the most bizarre about this case.

How can ALL of the defense witnesses not be available to testify? ALL of them? Seriously? Something stinks to high heaven about that excuse for it makes no logical sense.

If this death penalty case had been tried in most any other state it would have been done, and over with in 4 to 6 weeks tops, and that would inconclude the sentencing phase if convicted.

Those cases are packed with witnesses nonstop every day of trial without any lull though. Both sides, and the judge are fully prepared to keep the trial fluid until the very end. That's the big difference than this farce of a trial.

So if most all others trials are done much quicker, and much more efficiently, why does these attorneys, and judge have such a big problem with doing what is done over, and over again, efficiently in hundreds of other trials or thousands each year?

Imo

Yes agree this DP Trial has been very different. But who's fault is it really? How long has this case taken to get to Trial? If i recall a lot of the stalling/delaying had to do with the one that has been charged with the murders even before the trial. We were also told at the start of this trial it would take months to finalize, and people were very surprised at that, because as we know a DP case doesn't take months of trial days. But now we see why that is, and it's really a part time trial. Maybe it's a new standard for CA?
I also think if the DT aren't ready with witnesses they can't make their witnesses take the stand if they can't be there on a certain day.
I still blame CM for the length of time this has taken to even get to trial, all IMO.