CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #15

[la2cabo]

A patsy for Ramos.

That doesn't answer the question of if not Merritt, who murdered the McStays?

 

[Karinna]

If he were as shrewd and cunning as you suggest he wouldn't have a rap sheet in the first place.

Just because he has a rap sheet doesn't mean he isn't shrewd & cunning.
Shrewd means mischievous & malicious according to the dictionary. And cunning means deceptive which CM is proven to be.

 

[InspectorGadget]

I have just finished listening to Suzanna Ryan's testimony from Thursday. So Ryan does conclude that DNA consistent with Merritt's was found on the passenger side. This is the swab that Jones said was too complex to interpret (F39). They were talking about Jones saying it was a mixture of 4 people, the snip I have from his testimony says a mix of 3 like Ryan says she determined as well with the data. She was asked if it was consistent with being there and remaining there since December 2009 and she said yes (this is when Merritt says he was in the Trooper)

She was also asked if it was reasonable that the other DNA on the steering wheel could have got there by secondary transfer, she said yes... it could have been from the 4th, the 3rd, the 1st, the 31st. It was consistent with what she knew from studies, etc. Jones also said that it was possible. I'm sure the prosecution will try to get Ryan to say that it could have got there by Merritt driving the vehicle as well lol

Lot's of studies, but it seems like there are NONE dealing with transfer DNA that has been buried for any length of time. (I'm thinking a scientist needs to get on this quick LOL) My understanding is that because Jones did detect some DNA that she thought she may be able to find more using the MVac because it's a more sensitive test and covers the whole surface, she was in no way faulting Jone's for not being able to find it IMO, but rather explained the limitations of swabbing and/or the advantages of the MVac.

When Daugherty was asking her about how much she was getting paid and who she works for... well duh... she has a consulting company, Prosecutor's don't typically need consultants they have State and FBI labs and employee's to do that for them... she consults on the results of those... this to me is a no brainer, but maybe because I follow enough cases? LOL I was surprised to learn that her MVac service is mainly done for LE, and her serology/lab portion (which she just got accredited for in Aug 2018) is about 50/50 right now.

Very little cross examination so far... will see what the Prosecution comes up with on Monday! I feel like I need to go listen to Jones' testimony again, I would like to see what he said about a few of the studies that were mentioned.

Even conceding that the dna might prove that Chase drove that car, it in no way proves where, when or why he might have done so.

Much of this, including Merritt's interview, happened after the warrants were executed on the home though. Dugal walked if luminal was used in the home and he stated the warrants wouldn't allow it. That's very curious to me. This is probably why the cadaver dogs were only outside as well.

While I can't place direct blame on family members, I think particular actions and comments made to detectives steered the case to voluntary missing. Then there's the video. Then you have Mike hiring the PI to go into Mexico to find the family, etc., etc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Merritt's interview was on 17th Feb and the home was searched & photographs taken on the 19th Feb?

 

[InspectorGadget]

RSBM
BBM....That is so gross. Who does that??

Going to the probable cause.... McGyver was supposed to finish the much anticipated painting and the much anticipated flooring was scheduled to be installed.

Dugal even states in the search warrant for the house that he believed "the McStay family is the victim of foul play"
And that "some or all of the McStay family has been kidnapped or killed".

Also "in my experience financial gain often plays a role in a crime. By searching the computers and storage devices I believe that I will be able to establish the financial relationships between Joseph and Summer McStay (and) those that may have a motive to do them harm".

He obviously didn't dig deep enough.

Dugal should have had the popcorn bowls tested for their DNA. If they didn't find any...that's a sure sign of foul play.

But I think the pics of popcorn on the futon were taken by Tingley on 2/15 and Susan threw them out before Dugal served the search warrant on 2/19.

MOO

How would finding anybody's dna on the popcorn bowls have helped the investigation?

 

[InspectorGadget]

Just because he has a rap sheet doesn't mean he isn't shrewd & cunning.
Shrewd means mischievous & malicious according to the dictionary. And cunning means deceptive which CM is proven to be.

I don't think shrewd means malicious or mischievous. It means astute or canny.

 

[missy1974]

Even conceding that the dna might prove that Chase drove that car, it in no way proves where, when or why he might have done so.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Merritt's interview was on 17th Feb and the home was searched & photographs taken on the 19th Feb?

Except Chase said he has never driven the Trooper lol

And yes, you are correct, Chase's interview was on the 17th, the search warrant was served on the 19th of Feb.

 

[Karinna]

I don't think shrewd means malicious or mischievous. It means astute or canny.

shrewd
[ʃruːd]
ADJECTIVE

1. having or showing sharp powers of judgement; astute.
   "she was shrewd enough to guess the motive behind his gesture" ·
   astute · sharp-witted · sharp · acute · intelligent · clever · alert · canny ·
   [more]
2. archaic
   (especially of weather) piercingly cold.
   "a shrewd east wind"
   • (of a blow) severe.
     "a bayonet's shrewd thrust"
   • mischievous; malicious.

 

[InspectorGadget]

shrewd
[ʃruːd]
ADJECTIVE

1. having or showing sharp powers of judgement; astute.
   "she was shrewd enough to guess the motive behind his gesture" ·
   astute · sharp-witted · sharp · acute · intelligent · clever · alert · canny ·
   [more]
2. archaic
   (especially of weather) piercingly cold.
   "a shrewd east wind"
   • (of a blow) severe.
     "a bayonet's shrewd thrust"
   • mischievous; malicious.

Quite. Archaic.

 

[InspectorGadget]

Except Chase said he has never driven the Trooper lol

And yes, you are correct, Chase's interview was on the 17th, the search warrant was served on the 19th of Feb.

"Well, he would, wouldn't he?"

 

[Karinna]

Except Chase said he has never driven the Trooper lol

And yes, you are correct, Chase's interview was on the 17th, the search warrant was served on the 19th of Feb.

BBM, And even if he had driven JM's trooper it's not as if he would admit it to detectives. For good reason obviously. But he did admit he was in JM's vehicle as a passenger. IMO probably to cover for himself just in case anything of his would be found in Joey's vehicle.

 

[KALI]

Not that it matters, but what a small world. My sister dated Rocky Martin, for quite some time. I liked him. He was a nice guy. He had 3 beautiful little blond blue eyed girls. I did not know until this post that Joey's ex bought Rocky's jewelry store.

I have to remind myself that there were other things going on. Like CPS.
According to the search warrant for the house... Children/Sexual Behavior Documents were found.

IMO, one of the real reasons SB went into the home on Feb. 17th (wasn't it?), was to look for anything damaging to any of the McFaddens.

Wasn't there something about Summer reporting M. McFadden of abuse? I'm sure that didn't go over well. IMO MM and SB always remained much closer to Heather than they ever were to Summer.

I can see Heather and Susan ranting about how Summer has driven a huge wedge between Joey and his first born. Everything was Summer's fault (according to them). Of course this is all MOO, but I think MM and SB walked on eggshells around the McFadden's for fear of losing contact with Jonah. They seemed awfully concerned about making sure the child support for Jonah was paid. Why? Heather and M. McFadden took over her father's VERY lucrative and successful business, Rock Martin Custom Jewelry in Laguna Beach. I really don't think they were having money problems. And Joey was MISSING.

IIRC MM and SB chose to cut ties with Patrick McStay when they found out M. McFadden was on a very short list of PM's suspects.

Anyway...my point is... I don't think the family (MM and SB) were happy with Summer and was keeping their distance.

I'm sure if they could do it over.....

MOO

 

[missy1974]

BBM, And even if he had driven JM's trooper it's not as if he would admit it to detectives. For good reason obviously. But he did admit he was in JM's vehicle as a passenger. IMO probably to cover for himself just in case anything of his would be found in Joey's vehicle.

He says he was a passenger, no DNA is found and it's said that he was lying because his DNA wasn't there.

An expert says she thinks the DNA found on the passenger side is consistent with Merritt's DNA (and also Joey's and another partial profile), and now she's wrong and he's still lying.

Not only is he lying, he had the foresight to know that his lawyer's would hire a consultant that would look at the State experts, Jones' data, bench notes and all, and interpret it as showing Joey's DNA and Merritt's DNA on that collective swab from the passenger side.

JMO and all that.

 

[Karinna]

He says he was a passenger, no DNA is found and it's said that he was lying because his DNA wasn't there.

An expert says she thinks the DNA found on the passenger side is consistent with Merritt's DNA (and also Joey's and another partial profile), and now she's wrong and he's still lying.

Not only is he lying, he had the foresight to know that his lawyer's would hire a consultant that would look at the State experts, Jones' data, bench notes and all, and interpret it as showing Joey's DNA and Merritt's DNA on that collective swab from the passenger side.

JMO and all that.

I wonder has it ever occurred that he was passenger and driver at different intervals? I think that could be a possibility as well IMO.

 

[Karinna]

Wasn't there the theory that he shook JM's hand and JM transferred the DNA to the steering wheel etc.?

 

[Karinna]

But IMO if we take away any DNA evidence there is still other very incriminating evidence that points to Merritt.
The DNA is a bit sketchy because of the fact of the said relationship with Merritt and the McStay family, when he was at the home of the McStays a fair bit, and helping the McStay family move into their Fallbrook home, putting up a shed for them etc. So it wouldn't of been unusual for CM's DNA to be present in that house.

 

[Force Ten]

Except Chase said he has never driven the Trooper lol

And yes, you are correct, Chase's interview was on the 17th, the search warrant was served on the 19th of Feb.

I'll admit, I don't know the actual date of the interview, but is that date correct? Seems odd to me that they would interview him before searching the home, before they really knew if they left willingly or not.

 

[mrjitty]

Much of this, including Merritt's interview, happened after the warrants were executed on the home though. Dugal walked if luminal was used in the home and he stated the warrants wouldn't allow it. That's very curious to me. This is probably why the cadaver dogs were only outside as well.

IIRC in Dugal's testimony, they didn't have a warrant when the dogs were on site. He testified that they were not allowed inside. He first got entry for the welfare check?

While i understand Dugal's difficulty in getting a warrant, I think he didn't make like easy for himself

Something I find strange in this case, is why, where Joey's mum was in lawful possession of the house, she couldn't just invite Dugal in for a walkaround?

IIRC someone has said before that only the owner or presumably a tenant can consent, but I don't know the law in the US

 

[Karinna]

I'll admit, I don't know the actual date of the interview, but is that date correct? Seems odd to me that they would interview him before searching the home, before they really knew if they left willingly or not.

From Opening statements before the SW's
RSBM
CHARLES MERRITT’S INTERVIEW WITH SDSD


https://www.websleuths.com/forums/threads/opening-statements.413276/

 

[Force Ten]

From Opening statements
RSBM
FEBRUARY 19TH – SEARCH WARRANT
Two days later on February 19th, SDSD secures a search warrant at the Avocado Vista residence.
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/threads/opening-statements.413276/

Thanks. I'm referring to the date of the interview with Chase.

 

[Force Ten]

IIRC in Dugal's testimony, they didn't have a warrant when the dogs were on site. He testified that they were not allowed inside. He first got entry for the welfare check?

While i understand Dugal's difficulty in getting a warrant, I think he didn't make like easy for himself

Something I find strange in this case, is why, where Joey's mum was in lawful possession of the house, she couldn't just invite Dugal in for a walkaround?

IIRC someone has said before that only the owner or presumably a tenant can consent, but I don't know the law in the US

To amend my own post (damn auto correct), Dugal said he didn't have authority to use luminal, the warrants wouldn't allow it.