CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #3

[Tortoise]

RSBM

This is why I am wondering if there was a ruling somewhere along the way about this? I know there was a hearing in December where they ruled that the ex gf could testify, her testimony will be that DK confessed to her, I don't know how much closer we can get to accusing him? And I would normally agree that they couldn't do that, but it seems that they are going to be allowed to, or come very very close. JMO

Thanks. That could get very interesting!

 

[Tortoise]

isn't DK a hostile witness, automatically? mOO

I think they'd have to get him declared hostile if it's the defense calling him.

 

[citygirl]

When you boil it down I don't believe they even need to provide documentation as to Dan's whereabouts. There hasn't been anything that connects him to the murders. Even if it was discovered that he lied he was in Hawaii. If anything, it would go against his credibility. If the jury knows he's lying about something, they (the jury) are allowed to throw out all of his testimony. Again, Dan isn't on trial. Did he skim money from the accounts? That's plausible, but for the most part those monies were approved by Mike and Susan, even though it wasn't their place to do so. IMO Dan did rip off several clients months and up to a year later. He's a shady character but not culpable.

Chase Merritt literally has his name all over these murders since day one, checks signed in blood.

I am patiently awaiting testimony from Catherine Jarvis.

 

[A lucas]

Timeline from Opening Statement:

February

Thurs 4th

11.51 am Joey calls his bank.

11.53 am Joey calls Merritt.

11.56 am Joey signs into QuickBooks for 2 minutes.

12.15 pm Joey calls his bank – he’s on the road going north at Lake Elsinore.

12.52 pm Joey calls Merritt from the Rancho Cucamonga area.

12.52 pm to 1.01 pm Merritt calls Cathy Jarvis 9 times and makes 4 other calls.

1.00 pm Cathy Jarvis calls Merritt back.

1.01 pm Joey calls Merritt.

1.01 pm to 3.03 pm Joey’s phone is connected almost constantly to internet.

3.03 pm Joey’s phone leaves Rancho Cucamonga.

3.03 pm to 3.07 pm Joey calls Merritt 7 times.

5.48 pm Joey’s phone makes a 2 minute 37 second call to Merritt's phone from Fallbrook area.

5.50 pm (after the 5.48 call) Merritt’s phone goes off for 3 hours and 40 minutes.

6.09 pm to 9.04 pm Cathy Jarvis calls Merritt 5 times, all go to Voicemail.

7.47 pm Mitchley surveillance video.

7.56 pm QB accessed on home computer and cheque raised and deleted.

8.28 pm Joey's phone calls Merritt’s cell phone but doesn’t connect, call doesn't register on Merritt's phone. Could be a pocket dial.

9.32 pm Merritt’s phone connects tower at Mira Loma (14 miles south of Rancho) calls Cathy Jarvis.

9.32 pm Merritt’s phone goes off for 10 hours.


Fri 5th

7.30 am Merritt’s phone reconnects to grid.

Unknown time 4 cheques printed and deleted, all backdated to 4th.

3.54 pm to 9.17 pm Merritt’s phone is off grid for 5 hours 20 mins.

9.18 pm Merritt’s phone goes off grid again (not specified how long for)


Sat 6th

10.46 am to 1.30 pm Merritt’s phone is near gravesites for 2 hrs 45 mins. He makes calls from there.

It's raining in Victorville. (area of gravesites)


Mon 8th

7.26 am Merritt’s phone is in Rancho Cucamonga.

7.26 am to 1.31 pm Merritt’s phone off grid for 6 hours.

1.31 pm Merritt’s phone connects in Corona area travelling north.

1.54 pm to 6.31 pm Merritt’s phone is in Rancho Cucamonga.

2.20 pm QB accessed and cheque printed backdated to 4th. He deposits this on 9th.

[unknown time] Merritt makes a 1 hour 47 minute call to QB to get a new version and cancel old.

11 pm Trooper is towed in San Ysidro.


Tues 9th

[unknown time] Merritt calls QB to get all the information in the QB account deleted.

Merritt banks the backdated cheque he raised on the 8th.

Merritt contacts Susan Blake then goes to McStay house.

Merritt goes to Pala Casino for 8 hours, phone connected.

Withdraws $500 at the San Manuel Casino in Highland (25 miles east of home)

I love this timeline. It tells such a powerful story during the critical days. I wonder if his phone being off grid for hours on consecutive days was unusual for him to do and if that will help nail him. I literally never switch my phone off, I just put it on silent as I don’t ever need to hide my location. If they could show that his phone was habitually connected but just not on the key days then that’s amazing circumstantial evidence!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

for the most part i consider criminal defense attorneys to be scummy--
they twist the truth and a lot of them just plain ol' lie to the jury
not all of them, but i just have no respect for most of them-
the worst example i can think of was Jose Baez in the Anthony
case-

There is a valid reason why defense attorneys are consistently rated at the very bottom as the least liked and seen as the most untrustworthy.

These two defense attorneys are a perfect example of why defense attorneys overall are detested so much.

Just think about it.... this defense team already knows there is nothing linking DK as having any involvement in the murders yet they want to accuse him of murder when they know all of the evidence points solely to CM. To do this so recklessly without any regard for the truth they have to be morally corrupt to be capable of doing so. imo.

Representing CM to make sure he is given a fair trial is one thing but accusing someone else without concrete proof its true is an entirely different matter.

Whether DK is the most detested man ever to some that shouldn't matter. If they can claim willy nilly style..that someone else is guilty just because they say so without any proof that means more innocent people could be falsely labeled to be a murderer too.

I cant think of anything more serious for an innocent person to be labeled a murderer especially of two beautiful precious little children.

If its that easy then many more innocent people will be damaged in the future.

Who knows it may be these same two attorneys again!

The media and politicians may have given them a tiny bump up recently since they are ranked at the very bottom now.

But with attorneys like these two, and so many others just like them, I'm sure they will regain their low grade rating status soon, and may surpass their old extremely low ranking. Lol!

I really do hate it for all of the excellent defense attorneys who always abides by the rules and are highly ethical and there are many of them but its attorneys like this that makes them all look bad.

What continues to amaze though is how many in the public like these kind of defense attorneys who are there only to deceive the juries.

Their tactics of smoke and mirrors are real because that is what they are infamously known for doing.

It scares me that anyone could really fall for their orchestrated games. Thank goodness it rarely ever happens and jurors see right through them 99 percent of the time.

I would put Steve Feldman at the top of the list along with Baez. But the way these two are being so deceitful, unethical, and underhanded in this trial they no doubt will be added to my list of the worst sleazy and unethical attorneys thus far. Lol!

Imo

 

[missy1974]

Thanks. That could get very interesting!

haha Don't thank me ... I really don't know, but it does seem that they are being allowed to accuse him.

 

[missy1974]

isn't DK a hostile witness, automatically? mOO

In the L&C chat, there was speculation that he could get up there and plead the 5th.

If he does that, then I don't know how the jury would take that? It would be literally like he didn't testify.... so no harm? lol The State may want to call him and advise him.... lol

 

[missy1974]

I am patiently awaiting testimony from Catherine Jarvis.

ohhhh yes! her too! Do we know if she is still in contact with Merritt? Is she supporting him? I know I have read that his daughter has been at the trial, not sure about anyone else.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Does the prosecution's evidence not have to be provided in disclosure before the trial starts?

Yes. But I dont think they have to turnover discovery of any rebuttal witness that may be called if the defense puts on their own CIC.

They will have to turn those over only right before rebuttal if the state has witnesses that will rebut what was testified to in the defense case, if they have one,which I believe they will do.

Often in cases I have followed some of the state rebuttal witnesses can become some of the strongest witnesses for the state.

I'm sure the state is already fully prepared to rebut any defense witnesses should the defense put on their own case. I know they are hoping the star witness for the defense will be the defendant himself.

Imo

 

[KALI]

I am praying that her testimony helps convict him. I hope she blows his alibi right out of the water.
We know he was not at home watching a movie with her. We have evidence of that.

Which is why I think that the defence is trying so hard to say the McStay family was murdered on the 5th, instead of the 4th.

I am patiently awaiting testimony from Catherine Jarvis.

 

[KALI]

Sort of ot, but before getting into my current business, I was a mortgage banker for many years. I was the most ethical, honest mortgage banker ever. I watched a good many of my associates go to jail for not having the same morals and for the love of money.
I may not be rich, but I sleep well at night.

There is a valid reason why defense attorneys are consistently rated at the very bottom as the least liked and seen as the most untrustworthy.

These two defense attorneys are a perfect example of why defense attorneys overall are detested so much.

Just think about it.... this defense team already knows there is nothing linking DK as having any involvement in the murders yet they want to accuse him of murder when they know all of the evidence points solely to CM. To do this so recklessly without any regard for the truth they have to be morally corrupt to be capable of doing so. imo.

Representing CM to make sure he is given a fair trial is one thing but accusing someone else without concrete proof its true is an entirely different matter.

Whether DK is the most detested man ever to some that shouldn't matter. If they can claim willy nilly style..that someone else is guilty just because they say so without any proof that means more innocent people could be falsely labeled to be a murderer too.

I cant think of anything more serious for an innocent person to be labeled a murderer especially of two beautiful precious little children.

If its that easy then many more innocent people will be damaged in the future.

Who knows it may be these same two attorneys again!

The media and politicians may have given them a tiny bump up recently since they are ranked at the very bottom now.

But with attorneys like these two, and so many others just like them, I'm sure they will regain their low grade rating status soon, and may surpass their old extremely low ranking. Lol!

I really do hate it for all of the excellent defense attorneys who always abides by the rules and are highly ethical and there are many of them but its attorneys like this that makes them all look bad.

What continues to amaze though is how many in the public like these kind of defense attorneys who are there only to deceive the juries.

Their tactics of smoke and mirrors are real because that is what they are infamously known for doing.

It scares me that anyone could really fall for their orchestrated games. Thank goodness it rarely ever happens and jurors see right through them 99 percent of the time.

I would put Steve Feldman at the top of the list along with Baez. But the way these two are being so deceitful, unethical, and underhanded in this trial they no doubt will be added to my list of the worst sleazy and unethical attorneys thus far. Lol!

Imo

 

[minazoe]

I am so angry over their hands, where are they?
Did Chase mutilate those children's bodies?
This crime was demonic and totally devoid of humanity. This is a man who can reach levels below the deepest subterranean muck and acid far beneath hell and all creation.

who could cut off those little hands and hide them somewhere with the purse of their mother, the wallet of their father who fed them and kept them?

this is a demon who slithers through the night.

mOO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

In the L&C chat, there was speculation that he could get up there and plead the 5th.

If he does that, then I don't know how the jury would take that? It would be literally like he didn't testify.... so no harm? lol The State may want to call him and advise him.... lol

So that means no one really knows what DK will do if called to testify?

 

[minazoe]

well he sure as heJJ isn't going to get up there and say he agrees with the defense's theory that he murdered the McStays.

I am worried though about this girlfriend thing...what again are her credibillity issues?
what does she have to gain? attention? why is she bringing this story ?

I think we will have a conviction but this can bring some questions . mOO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I am so angry over their hands, where are they?
Did Chase mutilate those children's bodies?
This crime was demonic and totally devoid of humanity. This is a man who can reach levels below the deepest subterranean muck and acid far beneath hell and all creation.

who could cut off those little hands and hide them somewhere with the purse of their mother, the wallet of their father who fed them and kept them?

this is a demon who slithers through the night.

mOO

Exactly.

We will never know the depths he went to make sure each one of them suffered unimaginable pain.

In the end, I think all of us don't want to play a smoke and mirror game, but we want the truth, and the person who did these horrendous acts to be held fully responsible.

The truth although brutal points to Merritt starting on day one!

We can't ignore all of the CE facts entered thus far that shows he is the one who did all of these horrific acts against his four helpless victims.

The evidence to come will continue to mount and show he solely did this and no one else.

As an aside.

Someone mentioned they are allowing him to accuse DK.

I'm not so sure that is true since the judge shut them down each, and everytime yesterday by sustaining every objection the state objected to concerning DK.

Will they keep asking improper questions about DK anyway only to be objected to by the state while knowing the objections will be sustained?

Absolutely. This is how this defense team rolls.

Imo

 

[missy1974]

So that means no one really knows what DK will do if called to testify?

I don't think so. I don't think he has spoken publicly about it either, maybe @Force Ten knows? I would hope he has retained an attorney, and evaluate whether his testimony could lead to charges. I am talking in regards to the money or EIP. There are so many questions surrounding the financials, it's possible he could incriminate himself by testifying IMO

 

[Edmo]

The jury visited the gravesites today, right? If so, today is actually considered a "cold" day today by Calif standards. Supposed to be even colder this weekend, due to the wind bringing in the cold front from up North. The High Desert has always been colder than the Inland Empire cities you drive through to get to Victorville.

The cold should help the jurors realize what harsh conditions (Cold/Rain) this poor family endured and was left out there all alone. The desolate desert, along with the "wash" area they were found in and being able to watch/hear the traffic zooming along the I-15 should paint a picture that whomever buried them there could care less about them and attempted to hide them and then left them there to simply rot.

The jurors will NEVER forget today. And that is a good thing for the Prosecution, IMO.

 

[missy1974]

Ok, so I went back to the old threads, to see what was ruled on back in December. I can't find the actual ruling, but I did find a post by Mica showing there was a motion filed on December 18th to Reconsider ruling on admissibility of third-party culpability evidence. It doesn't say who filed the motion, but I'm going to guess it was the State asking the judge to reconsider his ruling allowing it, and because we are seeing the SODDI (DK) defense, and they are allowing the ex gf to testify.

Here is the post: https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...16-and-forward-2.372382/page-23#post-14647724

I went into January postings on that thread and didn't find any clarification on what the outcome of the hearing was.

 

[Edmo]

Ok, so I went back to the old threads, to see what was ruled on back in December. I can't find the actual ruling, but I did find a post by Mica showing there was a motion filed on December 18th to Reconsider ruling on admissibility of third-party culpability evidence. It doesn't say who filed the motion, but I'm going to guess it was the State asking the judge to reconsider his ruling allowing it, and because we are seeing the SODDI (DK) defense, and they are allowing the ex gf to testify.

Here is the post: https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...16-and-forward-2.372382/page-23#post-14647724

I went into January postings on that thread and didn't find any clarification on what the outcome of the hearing was.

IIRC, someone from the L&C "experts" said that the Defense was NOT allowed to accuse a 3rd party of the murders in the trial, due to the Judge's ruling?

 

[Edmo]

Another observation about the missing hand(s)/partial missing fingers etc: If in fact it had been raining the day they were buried, the dirtbiker testified it was in a "wash" area, between two hills. The first pictures we were shown the graves had compression/holes near the center of both gravesites. I could see where he buried them, then the rain began flowing/pooling (water always flows to the lowest point due to gravity) in the center of the graves. The washing away of the sand could *possibly* expose their hands/arms, due to being stiff from rigor mortis? Their hands would reasonably be positioned in the center area of the gravesites, IMO. Depending on exactly how they were placed on-top of one another?

Factor in the smell, exposed arms/hands (Rain washed sand away) and I could see how wildlife could have easily began to feed on their remains. A Coyote/Bobcat would have no problem pulling/dragging/snapping the remains out of the grave(s), IMO.

If the hands had been "cut-off," I believe the Coroner would HAVE testified to that fact. There would have been "toolmarks" on/near the wrists, IMO. I don't think she testified to that?

To me, ***IF*** he had cut-off their hands, why would he leave fingers on Summer/JM's behind? I believe the children's hands were the ones that were completely missing. Take into account the Anthropologist also testified that children "tasted" better to animals, due to their higher level of cartilage etc. Just quoting what she said, sorry if it is graphic.