CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #3

[Tortoise]

And he goes to Starbucks when he's supposed to be meeting in Chick-Fil-A. I don't think you'd take a Starbucks coffee into another restaurant.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

The SA deal as far as I am aware was not the multi million pound contract. That was in the pipeline and that was a deal to install waterfalls around some company in the U.S I thought. But it’s been 8 years so I could be totally wrong.

Thanks but I'm still so confused. Lol then why would he need a passport if it was in the US.

I thought he told Susan he need $4000 and she gave it to him? Wasnt that to do with him going to SA?

I may have that wrong though.

 

[asyousay]

Thanks but I'm still so confused. Lol then why would he need a passport if it was in the US.

I thought he told Susan he need $4000 and she gave it to him? Wasnt that to do with him going to SA?

I may have that wrong though.

Yes that was the SA deal but it wasn’t part of the mega riches that Joey was in the process of getting as far as I am aware. I could be wrong though as it’s been forever. Joey was in the process of getting a contract that would of netted the company millions if it came off.


ETA - I want to say the deal was to do with shopping malls and installing water features all over the country ( I have tried to google but I can’t see anything)


Also this is why if Joey was permanently sacking Chase that could give him motivation to kill as he would of been outraged that he was being cut out of the of the up and coming deals.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Yes that was the SA deal but it wasn’t part of the mega riches that Joey was in the process of getting as far as I am aware. I could be wrong though as it’s been forever. Joey was in the process of getting a contract that would of netted the company millions if it came off.


ETA - I want to say the deal was to do with shopping malls and installing water features all over the country ( I have tried to google but I can’t see anything)


Also this is why if Joey was permanently sacking Chase that could give him motivation to kill as he would of been outraged that he was being cut out of the of the up and coming deals.

Ok. Sorry for so many questions.

I thought he sent emails supposedly from SA in June or July 2010?

Iirc he even mentions they are through with phase 1 or two and he even mentions the SA people including the Taliban.

 

[Tortoise]

I think he used the plastic storage bins from the master closet (that were holding clothes) to transport the three of them.

I like this idea. Maybe the one that contained her wedding dress.

 

[Tortoise]

There is something else that makes me think Joey didn't have his phone that afternoon.

He discovered the theft and fraud, he was bothered enough by it to drive 70 miles to confront Chase, it was the catalyst for his murder so there must have been a fallout, yet he did nothing about it that afternoon. Didn't call the bank to report it, didn't call the police to report it, didn't call his father to tell him of this shocking discovery and betrayal, didn't call Summer to discuss it with her either, didn't do a thing.

So I think 3 pm he was killed and his phone went to Fallbrook by 4.20 pm.

 

[missy1974]

Well I think there is a need for a complex theory to account for the evidence as well as how he could have done it.

We can say it's simpler that they each had their own phones, because it is simpler, but then he couldn't have been at the house before 7 pm if he was with his phone elsewhere. Logic tells us he was at the house because of the printed cheque and the truck is only captured leaving at 7.47 pm, but not arriving between 7 pm and 7.47 pm. Even if the video times are wrong it is still a piece of uninterrupted video for an hour with the truck not arriving but leaving. As well there is Mitchley's evidence that she goes to bed around 8 pm, and she would probably have remembered waking up and getting out of bed because she heard a disturbance, if it happened much later, when the police visited her close to the time it happened.

I think him calling Cathy Jarvis at around 9.30 pm is when he would have got back to wherever he put his phone, not far from wherever he had left Joey's body.

I also think it makes sense that he would borrow a truck because he knew his truck would be checked over. I have read somewhere that his brother had trucks but I can't confirm that.

See, this is where I think the prosecution saying it happened in the house might be a big barrier. We here at WS's are having to make it more complex to make the evidence fit, make all the calls fit in, the toy search, the toys in the back of the truck, etc. I sure hope the prosecution can come up with a cohesive timeline that the jury can 'believe'.

 

[mrjitty]

I think him calling Cathy Jarvis at around 9.30 pm is when he would have got back to wherever he put his phone, not far from wherever he had left Joey's body.

OK - but then who turned off Chase's phone at 5.30pm?

It can't have been Chase

 

[Tortoise]

OK - but then who turned off Chase's phone at 5.30pm?

It can't have been Chase

I think he left it with someone, maybe the same person he got the truck from. Called them to create the alibi that he was elsewhere.

 

[missy1974]

Regarding the calls to CM right after lunch. Look at the patterns of the phone calls on the 1st and 2nd with Joey/CM from this post:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/threads/mcstay-family-comprehensive-timeline.285143/#post-14733757

From McGyver's testimony, CM was there those days for a period of time when he was there. So why all those phone calls too? it seems to be a pattern. I am not convinced that Joey didn't make it home that day and something happened afterwards. These phone call patterns show more about the lack of calls the following week IMO

 

[mrjitty]

There is something else that makes me think Joey didn't have his phone that afternoon.

He discovered the theft and fraud, he was bothered enough by it to drive 70 miles to confront Chase, it was the catalyst for his murder so there must have been a fallout, yet he did nothing about it that afternoon. Didn't call the bank to report it, didn't call the police to report it, didn't call his father to tell him of this shocking discovery and betrayal, didn't call Summer to discuss it with her either, didn't do a thing.

So I think 3 pm he was killed and his phone went to Fallbrook by 4.20 pm.

It looks like from the calls with the bank he only discovered the dodgy check that afternoon.

Given he was on the road, I can understand him wanting to get home to check this in more detail before talking to the Bank more on the 5th

It's also possible he just decided to sack Chase rather than report it to the police

 

[mrjitty]

I think he left it with someone, maybe the same person he got the truck from. Called them to create the alibi that he was elsewhere.

But then why was it turned off?

 

[missy1974]

But then why was it turned off?

that's a good point... if it's off, it can't ping in R.C. where it would give him an alibi. And if he left it with Cathy Jarvis... well, she's not so bright calling him 5 times and leaving a voicemail when she had the phone lol

 

[Tortoise]

It looks like from the calls with the bank he only discovered the dodgy check that afternoon.

Given he was on the road, I can understand him wanting to get home to check this in more detail before talking to the Bank more on the 5th

It's also possible he just decided to sack Chase rather than report it to the police

It was outlined in the OS - he called the bank before he got to Rancho Cucamonga:

"What he found was that on February 4th at 11.51 Joseph calls a number 949-492-8090 that is associated with Joseph’s bank in San Clemente the Union Bank in San Clemente. He doesn’t call that number all that often, he has called it in the past around the time they were buying the house they were moving in, he doesn’t call it all that often.

A few minutes later he calls the phone number associated with the defendant 374-0102 two minutes later he calls the defendant.

After that 11.56 he signs into his QuickBooks and then signs out two minutes later. At this point that February 2nd cheque has cleared the bank. After he logs out of QuickBooks and not having seen the cheque because it was deleted on the ledger again calls his bank at 12.15. That’s a different number, same bank.

While he’s doing this he’s travelling 15 northbound in the general area of Lake Elsinore.

He arrives in the Rancho Cucamonga area and his cell phone is communicating with towers in the Rancho Cucamonga area – at 12.52 there’s a call to the defendant, at 1.01 there’s another call to the defendant and at 3.03 is the last time that his phone makes contact with that tower in Rancho Cucamonga."

 

[asyousay]

OK - but then who turned off Chase's phone at 5.30pm?

It can't have been Chase

“If” Chase didn’t meet Joey for lunch then who is to say he didn’t change cars and leave his phone with (like his girlfriend or brother) and then they switched it off at a certain point?

If Chase always knew he was heading to Fallbrook to kill them then he wasn’t a idiot he would of taken steps so he didn’t get caught.

 

[mrjitty]

There is something else that makes me think Joey didn't have his phone that afternoon.

He discovered the theft and fraud, he was bothered enough by it to drive 70 miles to confront Chase, it was the catalyst for his murder so there must have been a fallout, yet he did nothing about it that afternoon. Didn't call the bank to report it, didn't call the police to report it, didn't call his father to tell him of this shocking discovery and betrayal, didn't call Summer to discuss it with her either, didn't do a thing.

So I think 3 pm he was killed and his phone went to Fallbrook by 4.20 pm.

How does this with the following note in your timeline?

5 pm and 5:47 pm - Text messages between Joseph's and Summer's cellphones.

Surely CM can't be faking all 3 phones?

If the whole point is to create cell phone power pings it would surely be risky to text Joeys phone from Summers if both phones are at the house? And why do this anyway?

 

[Tortoise]

But then why was it turned off?

He asked them to turn it off because he wouldn't be with it to answer any calls?

 

[mrjitty]

“If” Chase didn’t meet Joey for lunch then who is to say he didn’t change cars and leave his phone with (like his girlfriend or brother) and then they switched it off at a certain point?

If Chase always knew he was heading to Fallbrook to kill them then he wasn’t a idiot he would of taken steps so he didn’t get caught.

But then why was the phone turned off? And how did he get it again to call Cathy Jarvis at 9.30pm?

 

[mrjitty]

He asked them to turn it off because he wouldn't be with it to answer any calls?

But that ruins the whole point of using it to prove he was elsewhere, via inbound calls - even if they go to voice - they show Chase's phone as 60 mins drive away

By turning it off, he created the whole suspicion of "going dark"

 

[Tortoise]

How does this with the following note in your timeline?



Surely CM can't be faking all 3 phones?

If the whole point is to create cell phone power pings it would surely be risky to text Joeys phone from Summers if both phones are at the house? And why do this anyway?

If he's in the house with Joey's and Summer's phones under his control I think it's common for perps to create false trails of texts to make it appear people are still alive after they've killed them. It's not my timeline btw so I don't know the details of that note in the timeline or how many texts etc were sent.