CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010

[asyousay]

So are you saying Joeys Mom and brother killed him and his wife and babies?

No but I am saying their behavior is weird.

Sorry when McG told Susan not to clean because she could be wiping away evidence and she still does it then that’s weird.


The same way with Mike why would you take the computer out of the house unless you are being shady? - was sitting in the house and looking though the computer not good enough for him?


I just think it muddies the water even more and adds doubt and that’s all Chase needs here is doubt on the jury’s part.

 

[katydid23]

Cashing the backdated cheque on the 5th so soon after printing it and with cell tower activity is what closes the deal IMO

And IIRC, he went to a casino very soon afterwards too. Is that right?

 

[asyousay]

But the family couldn't know if they had a working phone or not at that time.

And the dogs, that was ultimately a big clue. But there was confusion at first, I believe. Because one of the neighbors saw they were not given food and water so they put some out. So when the first check of the family happened, they thought Joey may have asked someone to feed the dogs.

At some point it was noticed that emails weren't being answered. They should have known that was a big red flag. I agree. But by then, the family was concerned.

I don’t understand by the family didn’t know if they had working phones?

Both have mobile phones so even if one broke the odds on both breaking at the same time would be highly unusual.

At the end of the day Chase raised the alarm first from what we know and it wasn’t him that delayed things and said give it a few more days. It was the family who were casual about them not being able to reach Joey and Summer.

 

[Funky funky]

I don’t understand by the family didn’t know if they had working phones?

Both have mobile phones so even if one broke the odds on both breaking at the same time would be highly unusual.

At the end of the day Chase raised the alarm first from what we know and it wasn’t him that delayed things and said give it a few more days. It was the family who were casual about them not being able to reach Joey and Summer.

Isn’t DK claiming he raised the alarm first too?

 

[katydid23]

No but I am saying their behavior is weird.

Sorry when McG told Susan not to clean because she could be wiping away evidence and she still does it then that’s weird.


The same way with Mike why would you take the computer out of the house unless you are being shady? - was sitting in the house and looking though the computer not good enough for him?


I just think it muddies the water even more and adds doubt.

True. But to accuse them of framing Chase, that's quite an accusation.

That was stupid on both of their parts. But I dont think they believed there was a quadruple murder at that point.

 

[Texas Red]

I am hoping the prosecution has a ton of stuff up their sleeve.

Coz at the moment I can see a conspiracy to frame Chase and I hate to say that. I thought Mike and Susan were poor on the stand and now it turns out she cleaned up the crime scene and Mike took a computer out of the house when told not to. So Big questions marks there for me on why they did what they did. I hope they can be called back to the stand to explain their thinking coz it doesn’t sit right with me and I am not even on the jury.


I still think Chase did it but I’m now nowhere near as confident in his guilt as other people were acting shady.

The home computer being taken bothers me, especially, since I believe it's the source for the date and time for when the Quickbook's check to CM that was printed and deleted. It could have been accessed by Dan the hacker before it was returned and analyzed.

 

[katydid23]

I don’t understand by the family didn’t know if they had working phones?

Both have mobile phones so even if one broke the odds on both breaking at the same time would be highly unusual.

At the end of the day Chase raised the alarm first from what we know and it wasn’t him that delayed things and said give it a few more days. It was the family who were casual about them not being able to reach Joey and Summer.

But people replace and change accounts on cell phones all the time.

and yes, Chase raised the alarm first. But not until he had written himself a few nice checks. And 'raising the alarm' after doing the crime, is a nice strategy.

As for not being able to reach the family, I think there was some dysfunction and family dissension going on, so they thought it was just Joey being angry with them about the past issues between Summer and MM?

 

[katydid23]

The home computer being taken bothers me, especially, since I believe it's the source for the date and time for when the Quickbook's check to CM that was printed and deleted. It could have been accessed by Dan the hacker before it was returned and analyzed.

So that would entail Mike and Susan being involved in this big conspiracy to frame Chase. Would Joey's brother and his mother be capable of killing him and his wife and his 2 little boys?

 

[asyousay]

True. But to accuse them of framing Chase, that's quite an accusation.

That was stupid on both of their parts. But I dont think they believed there was a quadruple murder at that point.

The Defense are the ones who are blaming DK so is that wrong?

I think it’s perfectly valid to point out when behaviour is off and doesn’t add up. The Jury will be doing the same.


When we get to DK and things don’t add up I will say the same. Also I didn’t say the Susan and Mike killed Joey and Summer, I just pointed out I can see why the Defense is going with the prosecution were so INTENT on Chase that they missed a ton of other suspicious behaviour.

 

[mrjitty]

The home computer being taken bothers me, especially, since I believe it's the source for the date and time for when the Quickbook's check to CM that was printed and deleted. It could have been accessed by Dan the hacker before it was returned and analyzed.

I think the source of the info is the cloud records

So the computer doesn't change that

 

[katydid23]

The Defense are the ones who are blaming DK so is that wrong?

I think it’s perfectly valid to point out when behaviour is off and doesn’t add up. The Jury will be doing the same.


When we get to DK and things don’t add up I will say the same. Also I didn’t say the Susan and Mike killed Joey and Summer, I just pointed out I can see why the Defense is going with the prosecution were so INTENT on Chase that they missed a ton of other suspicious behaviour.

I can agree with the last sentence. It was just earlier , when you said MM and SB looked like they were intent upon framing Chase---that seemed like a big leap.

I still don't know if it was the laptop or the desk top that was taken.

I think it SUCKS that Dugal didnt take the cadaver dogs into the house. That was shortsighted and incompetent, imo.

 

[asyousay]

But people replace and change accounts on cell phones all the time.

and yes, Chase raised the alarm first. But not until he had written himself a few nice checks. And 'raising the alarm' after doing the crime, is a nice strategy.

As for not being able to reach the family, I think there was some dysfunction and family dissension going on, so they thought it was just Joey being angry with them about the past issues between Summer and MM?

Joey had a business phone he couldn’t simply change his number without losing a lot of customers. My mum has run her own business for 27 years and always had the same landline and mobile phone number because you can’t just change it on a wimp when it’s on websites and cards and whatever you use to advertise.

Yes Chase wrote cheques and cleaned the house and then raised the alarm it seems BUT he didn’t force Susan and Mike to act nonchalant.

Who rung Mike and told him to get out to Fallbrook?


All I am trying to say basically is this is no cut and dry case. A lot of stuff was obviously going on and watching this unfold it’s messy.

 

[SuziQ]

Throughout the documents at the below link, are statements of probable cause. They read like a novel.

http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kfmb/misc/mcstay_warrants.pdf

 

[katydid23]

Joey had a business phone he couldn’t simply change his number without losing a lot of customers. My mum has run her own business for 27 years and always had the same landline and mobile phone number because you can’t jusy change it on a wimp when it’s on websites and cards and whatever you use to advertise.

Yes Chase wrote cheques and cleaned the house and then raised the alarm it seems BUT he didn’t force Susan and Mike to act nonchalant.

Who rung Mike and told him to get out to Fallbrook?

I am not saying they thought he changed his business phone. Just saying they might have thought he wasn't answering his bus phone. But you asked earlier, how wouldn't they have a phone, what if kids got sick, etc. And I was saying they could have had a phone with them for emergencies, etc.

I think susan and mike acted nonchalant because of the family dysfunction. Adoption can create issues, longstanding issues with siblings and parents/adoptive vs bio, etc, that create splintering and estrangement, etc.

I think issues like that were going on for awhile---so when the family was 'out of touch' for awhile--they didnt jump to the conclusion they were murdered. JMO

Yes, Chase was the one who wanted to get the ball rolling. But I cannot say that it is because he is innocent. Maybe or maybe not. It is quite often the guilty party that sets up the bodies to be discovered.

 

[SuziQ]

I don't know why we can't entertain the idea that CM used the service road behind the back fence to load the bodies and have additional access to the house from the back. He had scaled that fence before and had run up the mountain, so he knew the area.

I suggest that he murders the family in a surprise visit, leaves at the 7:47 mark and parks the truck behind the fence. He then knocks out a couple of slats, returns to the house through the back, accesses QB on Joey's computer. loads the bodies, replaces the slats and continues his mission.

I would also pose the question: If CM's truck was in the driveway and the Trooper wasn't in the driveway, where was it? Neighbors say the family always parked in the driveway to the garage.

This is the info that I seek, that led me on my search of documents. I recall there was a theory promoted, or evidence discovered by LE, that this is exactly what CM did. Back to reading.

 

[Texas Red]

No but I am saying their behavior is weird.

Sorry when McG told Susan not to clean because she could be wiping away evidence and she still does it then that’s weird.


The same way with Mike why would you take the computer out of the house unless you are being shady? - was sitting in the house and looking though the computer not good enough for him?


I just think it muddies the water even more and adds doubt and that’s all Chase needs here is doubt on the jury’s part.

It also may have been an attempt to hide some other activity the family was involved in but not connected to the murders. A hypothetical example being the house was actually a grow house, after all it does looks like one, the fountain waterfall business was just a front used to launder the illicit revenue, and the computer had the QB’s ledger for the business.

 

[katydid23]

The Defense are the ones who are blaming DK so is that wrong?

I think it’s perfectly valid to point out when behaviour is off and doesn’t add up. The Jury will be doing the same.


When we get to DK and things don’t add up I will say the same. Also I didn’t say the Susan and Mike killed Joey and Summer, I just pointed out I can see why the Defense is going with the prosecution were so INTENT on Chase that they missed a ton of other suspicious behaviour.

I could easily see DK trying to frame Chase. But I dont think MM or SB were trying to frame him. I think SB was being a mother-in-law, and cleaning up the mess in the house, because that's what they do. I dont think she thought it was a crime scene. If she had seen blood platter and an obvious struggle, she wouldn't have done so.

I really believe that she thought the family left impulsively, maybe angry or burnt out, and they would be back.

 

[katydid23]

It also may have been an attempt to hide some other activity the family was involved in but not connected to the murders. A hypothetical example being the house was actually a grow house, after all it does looks like one, the fountain waterfall business was just a front used to launder the illicit revenue, and the computer had the QB’s ledger for the business.

Except for the fact that they did actually BUILD commercial fountains and bought all of the materials needed and paid welders and vendors and shippers to make and send the finished products.

 

[Texas Red]

So that would entail Mike and Susan being involved in this big conspiracy to frame Chase. Would Joey's brother and his mother be capable of killing him and his wife and his 2 little boys?

Removing the home computer and scrubbing the crime scene doesn’t necessarily mean they were involved in the murders. For an example please, read my previous post.

 

[asyousay]

I could easily see DK trying to frame Chase. But I dont think MM or SB were trying to frame him. I think SB was being a mother-in-law, and cleaning up the mess in the house, because that's what they do. I dont think she thought it was a crime scene. If she had seen blood platter and an obvious struggle, she wouldn't have done so.

I really believe that she thought the family left impulsively, maybe angry or burnt out, and they would be back.

But that’s why I point out the weird behavior and I know you don’t agree with me so last post I promise


They was in the middle of decorating, Summer was planning a birthday party for one of the boys (it’s been awhile but I am sure I read that somewhere) and they had a new home + the dogs. To just up and vanish without a word to anyone seems strange and makes zero sense.

Also leaving the house in a disarray and all the food going off as well on the counter.

When I go away I make sure all the stuff that can go off is either binned or eaten. I don’t leave food out to rot. My dog also go to a dog sitters as well because who just leaves a dog in the garden for a weekend or a week!!

Summer also had plans to have McG over to finish painting. There was zero signs they was just going to go on holiday for the sake of it. Summer was also planning to visit a friend or family who had a new baby as well?!!