CA - Jonathan Gerrish, Ellen Chung, daughter, 1 & dog, suspicious death remote hiking area, Aug 2021

[Andreee]

I just realized that Savage Lundy Trail is connected to Hite Cove Trail, and is part of the loop to Cedar Lodge as I thought.

They entered from south where Hwy 49 is, drove north into the park to a gate where they parked and walked from there.

 

[everybodhi]

Heat Stroke in Dogs

It is important to remember that dogs cannot control their body temperature by sweating as humans do since they only have a relatively small number of sweat glands located in their footpads. Their primary way of regulating body temperature is by panting.

Other common causes of heat stroke include being left in a yard without access to shade or water on a hot day, being exposed to a hair dryer for an extended period of time, and excessive or vigorous exercise during hot temperatures. Excited or excessively exercised dogs are sometimes at risk even if the environmental temperature and humidity does not seem high

 

[whitelilac]

The probability of all three people and the dog dying of heat stroke simultaneously must be astronomical. Same for some fatal toxic algae event.

But anything is possible...¯\_(ツ)_/¯

They may not have died simultaneously. We don't know the timeframe. They may have become disoriented, incapacitated at different points. Heat stroke is insidious. Maybe one showed initial symptoms, eg. severe headache, cramping, fainting...the other may have tried to help, then also was affected, exacerbated by panic and confusion.
Their dog could have become hyperthermic as well.
("Because dogs primarily pant rather than sweat, they are much more sensitive to heat than humans are."
11 Symptoms of Heat Exhaustion in Dogs)
Heat Stroke: Symptoms and Treatment

 

[GrimonTV]

On her Instagram Ellen talks about leaving the world of technology back in 2018 because she had a debilitating health condition. This is maybe the reason they ended up in Mariposa. Coupled with the conditions for their hike you wonder if that was the starting point for this tradegy.

 

[CAsleuth]

Homicide no longer being considered according to this…

"Initially, yes, when we come across a family with no apparent cause of death, there's no smoking gun, there's no suicide note, there's nothing like that, we have to consider all options," Mariposa County Sheriff's spokeswoman Kristie Mitchell told Fox News on Saturday. "Now that we're five days in, no, we're no longer considering homicide as a cause of death."
California authorities relying on dog's autopsy, other forensics for answers in family's mysterious deaths

 

[swedeheart]

I've been watching Gray Hughes' discussion about the case this morning. He marks the spot they were found on Google Earth at about 1:58:00. (If you continue listening for a few minutes more, he starts where they parked at the trailhead, and follows their (most likely) route. At 2:23:00, he maps the possible trail(s) in miles. That was not a short or easy hike! It was almost 9 miles (with a baby), from the trail head to the spot their bodies were located! And they would have had to cross over (make contact with) a stream. Elevation is mapped out as well.

*Ok, apologies, everyone, but I am editing this post, as I'm watching Gray's show. I believe the above info is incorrect, and the car was parked in a different spot and not 9 miles from where they were found. I'll just have to say watch the video, bc he's figuring it out as we go along. It's very informational, though, if you want to see the area and the trail on a map. It helps me to visualize it better when I see someone else put it on a map, like Gray does. I probably should have watched the whole video first, and THEN posted. I got too excited to share.

The correct loop they made, with the corrected parked car location, is shown at 2:53:50. Still about an 8 mile hike, along the river, but not across it. 2000 ft. elevation.

The warning sign at Devil's Gulch trailhead/Hites Cove (taken from the San Francisco Chronicle article posted earlier.) Remote hiking area where Northern California family was found dead treated as a hazmat site

 

[BrownRice]

Heat Stroke in Dogs

It is important to remember that dogs cannot control their body temperature by sweating as humans do since they only have a relatively small number of sweat glands located in their footpads. Their primary way of regulating body temperature is by panting.

Other common causes of heat stroke include being left in a yard without access to shade or water on a hot day, being exposed to a hair dryer for an extended period of time, and excessive or vigorous exercise during hot temperatures. Excited or excessively exercised dogs are sometimes at risk even if the environmental temperature and humidity does not seem high

Did not know any of this. Especially the hair dryer!

 

[NSamuelle]

2 adults...a dog...and a baby. Maybe they were all sitting eating, or taking a break.

Ellen worked with the Red Cross as an instructor and was trained in first aid and “disaster preparedness.” Snake bites would not only show up on autopsy, you’d see tourniquet activity or other intervention to try to slow the absorption of poison.

I should clarify that tourniquets are controversial, but when she was trained they were still a go-to treatment. They discourage them now because they do keep poison from spreading but increase local tissue damage at the point of the bite. Pressure bandages are still encouraged so you’d at least see evidence of that.

FYI for any hikers:
- Apply a pressure immobilisation bandage:

• Wrap a broad pressure bandage around the bite as soon as possible
• Apply a firm heavy elasticised roller bandage just above the fingers or toes and work your way upwards on the limb. Wrap the bandage past the snakebite and as far up the limb as possible
• Ensure the bandage is applied firmly without hindering blood circulation

- Splint the bandaged limb
Snake Bite First Aid Tips | St John Vic

I mean, regardless, you don’t think snakebites would show up on autopsy? Pre-mortem mosquito bites show up!

 

[Countem]

RSBM

The warning sign at Devil's Gulch trailhead/Hites Cove (taken from the San Francisco Chronicle article posted earlier.) Remote hiking area where Northern California family was found dead treated as a hazmat site

IMO and MOO, after seeing the sign, the toxic algae in combination with the heat theory is the most likely theory for the cause of death for the entire family. Even if their original water supply was safe, they may have refilled from water sources during their hike, leading all of those drinking water to get sick and succumb to the heat.

 

[happyday]

https://www.aaimedicine.org/journal-of-insurance-medicine/jim/2002/034-02-0114.pdf

“The autopsy findings of heat stroke may be minimal and are non-specific, particularly if the survival interval is short.”

Ok I found this about whether heat stroke would show up on autopsy—not necessarily. This confirms what we learned on Philip Kreycik’s thread.

So even if there were some minimal signs found that go along with heat stroke, they may not be ready to determine that for sure until toxicology comes back.

 

[silsby]

I guess I’m finding the baby situation strange. Why was she sitting next to her father? If Mom was ahead and getting help, even if she was disoriented and confused, I would expect her to have baby with her to get out. If the baby was unresponsive, then she’d have her to rush her to first responders. If the baby was responsive, then she would not leave her with a dad who has fallen ill.
I’m thinking Dad and baby must have been tired and stricken— and waiting for Mom, who was behind them, trying unsuccessfully to climb the hill to catch up.

I’m still leaning towards some kind of foul play or inadvertent ingesting of substance. I too find it strange that all succumbed of heat in the same general vicinity. Different bodies are affected by adverse things at different rates.

 

[Frolic Ruski]

Wouldn't they be vomitting in case the toxic algae was the cause of the death? Besides, it seems to be doubtful they would have died so soon and simultaneously.
Annihilation seems to be quite possible. Anyway, poor baby was their daughter, just beginning to live.
IMO

 

[silsby]

Another reason I’m leaning towards foul play is that they were in an area where cell phones were useless. They had no access to emergency services. Therefore, they ingested a substance and were doomed, tragically.

JMO

 

[happyday]

Wouldn't they be vomitting in case the toxic algae was the cause of the death? Besides, it seems to be doubtful they would have died so soon and simultaneously.
Annihilation seems to be quite possible. Anyway, poor baby was their daughter, just beginning to live.
IMO

Yeah & this warning sign posted about the area says you can SWIM in the water—just don’t mess with the algae. So swimming or wading through shouldn’t kill you.

 

[Speculaytor]

Heat Stroke in Dogs

It is important to remember that dogs cannot control their body temperature by sweating as humans do since they only have a relatively small number of sweat glands located in their footpads. Their primary way of regulating body temperature is by panting.

Other common causes of heat stroke include being left in a yard without access to shade or water on a hot day, being exposed to a hair dryer for an extended period of time, and excessive or vigorous exercise during hot temperatures. Excited or excessively exercised dogs are sometimes at risk even if the environmental temperature and humidity does not seem high

I don't want to judge this family, but I won't take my dog on a walk/hike past 75-80 degrees. He is short hair, but really has a hard time going over 2 miles if it is hotter . I cannot imagine a dog with that hair in 90-99 degree temps. Heat Stroke is the only thing that makes sense right now, they may not have all succumbed at the same time, but as people are pointing out, the police aren't talking heat stroke at all. The second is that they ingested something.

 

[NSamuelle]

Police should let the public know whether outgoing calls were attempted. That would put an end to a lot of speculation about annihilation (which I have contributed to, because we just don’t know)! Calls will show up as attempted even without service (recall the horrible Dutch girl/night photos case, where a log of outgoing calls in a jungle with no reception showed they tried to contact emergency services).

 

[LucyOso]

I am still leaning towards a situation that created cardiac arrhythmias in them all. You won't necessarily see this in an immediate autopsy. And there might not be external markers. Electrical current or toxins. If they ran their water through a filter, it doesn't mean they eliminated certain toxins. They were all found dead, but might have died in short intervals after being incapacitated as well.

 

[Officer Dibble]

Good thought, also nothing has been mentioned about cell phones, were they found with them on the trail? Had they taken pictures on the hike, tried to call out, send a text message? That might sound strange, but if one of them was in distress and the others started failing I could see trying to leave a clue even though there was no signal. But if overtaken quickly, I guess there would be no time or clarity of thinking.

We just don't know. Also the car keys. Were they with them.

 

[Officer Dibble]

Years ago I was at Mammoth going up a trail when there was a large group of people coming down in a rush. It was a Sunday and they had spent the weekend camping around one of the mountain lakes (not the Mammoth Lakes.) One of the women was carrying a limp baby girl about a year old, mother said that she was suffering from heat exhaustion (and probably altitude sickness). Father carried the two backpacks. It was 89 but because of the altitude one is closer to the sun so it feels even hotter.

I realize altitude was not a problem here.

Young ones cannot regulate their temperature like children or adults.

 

[NSamuelle]

I am still leaning towards a situation that created cardiac arrhythmias in them all. You won't necessarily see this in an immediate autopsy. And there might not be external markers. Electrical current or toxins. If they ran their water through a filter, it doesn't mean they eliminated certain toxins. They were all found dead, but might have died in short intervals after being incapacitated as well.

True, MI’s wouldn’t be obvious on physical exam, but troponin is still present post-mortem and that’s a quick blood test (they do it all the time for patients complaining of chest pain, we don’t wait 6 weeks to give them their trop values!).