Found Deceased CA - Kiely Rodni missing from Party Near Prosser Family Campground in Truckee #8

[customCF]

I don’t think this is disputed information. It’s widely available everywhere.

I meant it came to rest on a level surface, on its roof, as pictured in the AWP video. The diver reported the car was upside down, and those of us who watched the extraction live watched them turn it rig it side up before dragging it out wheels down, rear-first.

I am not disputing how it came out or that it was upside down; however it was not flat on its roof or else the rest of the roof would have more damage. IMO
I watched the video as well and it looked like the front nose was touching the ground/floor of the reservoir. IF the nose was touching the floor then it stands to reason the rear end of the roof was off the ground.
Take a model car and place it upside down or a picture of a car and put a flat edge across front nose and front of roof and you will see what I am trying to say.

 

[customCF]

If she scrambled to the back following any trapped air, or if she was in the trunk already, once the car flips then given the size/shape of the gap between the headrests into trunk and the car was upside down…whether her body sunk lower or floated higher within the trunk/very back area it is unlikely to go through the gap.

In theory if it was foul play and she was dead in the trunk, someone might try to secure her body in case the rear window smashes somehow when the car sinks so the body does not float up and out.

I am just curious because the CR-V was upside down and on an angle, would it not be the case that a body would move to a lower point because of gravity? Like other stuff would, the still images of the video show a bunch of stuff gathered on the front roof like the truly can.

 

[ameliak]

I don’t think this is disputed information. It’s widely available everywhere.

I meant it came to rest on a level surface, on its roof, as pictured in the AWP video. The diver reported the car was upside down, and those of us who watched the extraction live watched them turn it right-side-up before dragging it out wheels down, rear-first.

Edited for typos.

Excuse my rough drawing. I was confused when Doug from AWP said the front of the car was facing away from the shore, so I had to work it out for myself if it was possible, on a slope, with the car on it's roof. I think a previous poster (sorry, not sure who it was) was right postulating that the car was more on it's hood and front windshield with the boot/trunk sticking up, than on it's actual roof. It seems possible, with the car facing either way.

EBM to clarify that Doug said the car was facing away from the shore? I am now confusing myself! But either way looks possible.

 

[TeaTime]

Terrible accident involving a 16 year old, one car, one occupant, booze and maybe drugs.

All the chit chat and interviews by the kids and the divers are meaningless.

Mary Jo ended up in the rear window after Ted drove her into the river when he "missed" the bridge.

It is not odd that this happens.

 

[getthefax]

I am just curious because the CR-V was upside down and on an angle, would it not be the case that a body would move to a lower point because of gravity? Like other stuff would, the still images of the video show a bunch of stuff gathered on the front roof like the truly can.

I think I understand you. This is ghoulish, but the AWP video showed her blurred face/head in the rear-most small window on the side of the car.

So that little window would have been the lowest point in the cargo area of the car—perhaps the headrests/seats kept her from sinking lower. MOO.

Excuse my rough drawing. I was confused when Doug from AWP said the front of the car was facing the shore, so I had to work it out for myself if it was possible, on a slope, with the car on it's roof. I think a previous poster (sorry, not sure who it was) was right postulating that the car was more on it's hood and front windshield with the boot/trunk sticking up, than on it's actual roof. It seems possible, with the car facing forward

Thanks. Yes, this is possible—and my (MOO) scenario would actually still apply. I can go back again and look at the video and the direction of the light source, but sure—this works as a possible orientation of the car at rest
And an explanation for why she was where she was.

 

[customCF]

Excuse my rough drawing. I was confused when Doug from AWP said the front of the car was facing the shore, so I had to work it out for myself if it was possible, on a slope, with the car on it's roof. I think a previous poster (sorry, not sure who it was) was right postulating that the car was more on it's hood and front windshield with the boot/trunk sticking up, than on it's actual roof. It seems possible, with the car facing either way.

Thank you for doing that.
I am the one who talked about the CR-V sitting like that.
If the slope down into the water is similar to what the "beach" looked like when AWP found Kiely and her car; then I would guess it stands to reason that the CR-V was sitting similar to your picture with the rear of it facing the shoreline.

No matter what happens from this point forward; I personally would be surprised if a 100% accurate answer can be established at least for her parents and loved ones to know what happened to her and how exactly she died.
MOO, IMO

 

[customCF]

I think I understand you. This is ghoulish, but the AWP video showed her blurred face/head in the rear-most small window on the side of the car.

So that little window would have been the lowest point in the cargo area of the car—perhaps the headrests/seats kept her from sinking lower. MOO.


Thanks. Yes, this is possible—and my (MOO) scenario would actually still apply. I can go back again and look at the video and the direction of the light source, but sure—this works as a possible orientation of the car at rest
And an explanation for why she was where she was.

Going by ameliak's drawing. It would depend on steepness of ground going deeper into the water. IF it is similar to the shoreline in AWP's video; then I would imagine the back end of the car would still be the highest point.
IMO
I'll leave this "argument" here since we will probably never know exactly how the SUV was sitting underwater.

 

[customCF]

At this point I think most people could agree that the most important thing now is that Kiely's loved ones / parents get as best an answer to what happened as they can and that LE be held accountable for any mistakes that get brought into public view. Kiely's parents/loved ones deserve to know as close as they can exactly what happened that night/morning and have no risk of information pertinent to the investigation "hidden" or "covered up" or "lost due to a mistake"

IF or when a mistake is made LE should fess up to it and say "hey, we're only human, a mistake/mistakes were made and we could've done better"

ALL MOO of course.

 

[getthefax]

Going by ameliak's drawing. It would depend on steepness of ground going deeper into the water. IF it is similar to the shoreline in AWP's video; then I would imagine the back end of the car would still be the highest point.
IMO
I'll leave this "argument" here since we will probably never know exactly how the SUV was sitting underwater.

Thanks for hashing it through with me here.

CHP MAIT reports are extremely thorough. I am of the opinion and fully expect we will have a complete accounting of exactly what happened and how she died based on COD/tox screen, the EDR of the car, the processing of the car, phone data, video, etc. I don’t find this case that much more suspicious than other cases where cars go into water and a person drowns. Not to say it is impossible, but we haven’t seen hard evidence of foul play anywhere—> only a lot of speculation.

COD/tox screen will be very reliable after 2 weeks (there are a number of prominent cases where bodies were submerged for weeks/months and reliable reporting was done). As will dna evidence, in the event of SA (which I don’t believe happened). The trajectory of the car, seatbelt information, length of time it would have taken for the car to sink, etc… all will be addressed in the MAIT report.

I look forward to reading the full reports and poking holes in them at that time.
MOO.

 

[ameliak]

Thank you for doing that.
I am the one who talked about the CR-V sitting like that.
If the slope down into the water is similar to what the "beach" looked like when AWP found Kiely and her car; then I would guess it stands to reason that the CR-V was sitting similar to your picture with the rear of it facing the shoreline.

No matter what happens from this point forward; I personally would be surprised if a 100% accurate answer can be established at least for her parents and loved ones to know what happened to her and how exactly she died.
MOO, IMO

Thanks for confirming you were the one postulating that. The thread was quite "fluid" just now, so post numbers changed quickly.

 

[5W's]

Have been a long-time lurker. This case puzzles me. Occam’s razor tells me it was an accident, however, in light of AWP’s video (as well as statements made in subsequent F/U interviews) I continue to have a nagging feeling this case might be different. Given AWP’s experience with car retrievals, I’m perplexed as to why AWP would continue to imply foul play was involved unless they had compelling evidence (i.e. knowledge/proof car gear was in neutral IMHO). In Doug Bishop’s interview on the Duty Ron YouTube channel, he makes a point to state he “does a really good job of making sure we [AWP] have answers for LE/representatives“ regarding answers that need to be known, specifically referencing position of the gear shift. He even goes so far as to state that gear shift position is considered one of the pieces of “critical information” he trains his AWP crew to observe & report. The part described above I’m paraphrasing begins at roughly minute 32:00, however, I’m not sure if I can link it since it may not be considered an approved source?

We know from prior interviews AWP stated they indeed have more video footage they’ve threatened to release “depending on the direction LE takes the investigation” to paraphrase…MOO bold statements have been made so my default is to assume they have something/evidence to back it up until LE publicly states otherwise? MOO the gear position is critical information & could drastically impact manner of death.

<modsnip>

Maybe this has already been fully hashed out on here, but can anyone out there with former LE experience speak on the likelihood that AWP may have let LE (FBI?) preview their video content & vet it prior to release to ensure the integrity of the investigation? @OldCop?

LE most likely has a copy of that footage and AWP has maybe the original IDK, just guessing. LE has asked for any footage that will help in the investigation, so AWP has to give it to LE and cannot withhold it from them because it may be critical to the investigation. AWP has the right to say what they want as freedom of speech goes, its not hurting LE. So if AWP does feel that the investigation is missing pieces and LE is not forthcoming for whatever reason after the investigation concludes then they will release the footage they have so the public so they can judge for themselves. AWP does have a reputation at stake as they want to continue to do the work they do.

 

[CuriousObserver1]

I am just curious because the CR-V was upside down and on an angle, would it not be the case that a body would move to a lower point because of gravity? Like other stuff would, the still images of the video show a bunch of stuff gathered on the front roof like the truly can.

Once dead and in the trunk (however got there) it would move as per gravity yes, but within that space, IMO very unlikely to float through the gap between the headrests/roof - that takes a person being alive and squeezing/manoeuvring themselves through as small gaps.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

This post lands at random.

Stop the trashing of the AWP team.

Even organizations like EquuSearch are funded by donations from individuals and grants from organizations. Many rescue organizations that do not charge families must necessarily rely on donations from individuals, corporations, service clubs, grants, etc. to offset or cover operating costs. AWP equipment must be top notch to ensure safety and efficiency; there's upgrading and maintenance of watercraft and diving equipment, communication equipment, sonar technology, transportation, personal diving and safety equipment, etc.

Members may discuss the specifics of the recovery and subsequent information AWP has provided via their podcasts. Members may respectfully question the information or even disagree with it, but do so without sleuthing them and attacking / trashing them in the process. To do otherwise is petty and an embarrassment to Websleuths.

Thank you.

 

[NYanon]

Have been skimming some posts; have not given detailed thought to the mechanics of position of car or body, but have not seen this possibility mentioned (apologies if it has / is too impractical): Could KR have been toward the back of the vehicle while still alive (adjusting something; napping; using laptop; whatever), with the car accidentally entering the water (maybe it wasn't fully in park; needed parking brake engaged but it wasn't; managed to knock gearshift with foot; whatever)? Also wondering: Is there any sort of tide and/or current there, significant enough to affect a car, either directly (carrying it, or impacting buoyancy, eg) or indirectly (as by changing the sand it might be on, eg)?

 

[NoSpoonFeeding]

I cannot see a body "floating" past obstructions (seats) to get to the higher point in the rear given gravitational pull that would occur.

Where do you want the body to end up, so as not to call it suspicious?
If she can move to the back seat, she can move to the cargo area.
It can't be claimed that it's physically impossible, and there is plenty of clearance.

Calling it an accidental drowning would be much easier than proving any thing else happened IMO.

Accident reconstruction, done by CHP, is exceedingly thorough, the same amount of work is required whether there is foul play or not.
I don't think the forensic pathologist is interested in compromising the autopsy to lessen the workload of LE.

If the CR-V was actually "flat on its roof" as you claim. How was the radio antenna not broken off or damaged?

I'm claiming I saw the video, it was certainly upside down and on its roof. Are you doubting AWP's video and description?
I can't picture a hard landing on a lake bottom for a sinking car. I don't see a mystery about the antenna not being broken. Are you questioning that the vehicle was ever on its roof?
I guess a crane could have placed the car upside down in the lake.

 

[Sundog]

I cannot see a body "floating" past obstructions (seats) to get to the higher point in the rear given gravitational pull that would occur.

I agree that it is unlikely, IMO, that a body would be able to naturally float past obstructions (seats, head rests, etc.) to get to the rear/cargo space in the vehicle. So it is likely that she was alive when she sought out air in the cargo space as the vehicle sank and before it turned over.

It is also unlikely that a body would be able to naturally float past obstructions to move to the middle or front of the vehicle over the two weeks that the vehicle was submerged. Same obstructions, so I think she was likely confined to the cargo area once she sought refuge there.

 

[Sundog]

Have been skimming some posts; have not given detailed thought to the mechanics of position of car or body, but have not seen this possibility mentioned (apologies if it has / is too impractical): Could KR have been toward the back of the vehicle while still alive (adjusting something; napping; using laptop; whatever), with the car accidentally entering the water (maybe it wasn't fully in park; needed parking brake engaged but it wasn't; managed to knock gearshift with foot; whatever)? Also wondering: Is there any sort of tide and/or current there, significant enough to affect a car, either directly (carrying it, or impacting buoyancy, eg) or indirectly (as by changing the sand it might be on, eg)?

Unless the back seats were folded down, there wouldn't have been enough space for anyone to nap, use laptop, etc. The cargo area isn't large enough for that, unless the back seats are folded down. The width and length of the cargo space alone isn't enough to lie down, and the height of the space isn't enough for sitting in there, you would have to be crouched down if the back seats were up and you were in the cargo space.

 

[JRW]

BBM
If the CR-V was actually "flat on its roof" as you claim. How was the radio antenna not broken off or damaged? They are only plastic.
Curious as to why you feel like that. picture for roof picture. If a 3500 pound SUV was flat on its roof; how did the roof bars not bend either. Look at leading edge of hood and front edge of roof. Looks like a fairly straight line to me.

BBM
If the CR-V was actually "flat on its roof" as you claim. How was the radio antenna not broken off or damaged? They are only plastic.
Curious as to why you feel like that. picture for roof picture. If a 3500 pound SUV was flat on its roof; how did the roof bars not bend either. Look at leading edge of hood and front edge of roof. Looks like a fairly straight line to me.
View attachment 364994

I think most radio antennas are metal..and they are actually quit flwxable...yes they can snap but not a definite that they will

 

[JRW]

I agree that it is unlikely, IMO, that a body would be able to naturally float past obstructions (seats, head rests, etc.) to get to the rear/cargo space in the vehicle. So it is likely that she was alive when she sought out air in the cargo space as the vehicle sank and before it turned over.

It is also unlikely that a body would be able to naturally float past obstructions to move to the middle or front of the vehicle over the two weeks that the vehicle was submerged. Same obstructions, so I think she was likely confined to the cargo area once she sought refuge there.

Also over the 2 weeks in the water the body would have to float under the seats if the car was upside down...I don't know that there was enough current in this lake or movement to move the body around enough to push it under the seats towards the back.. especially if wearing a Hoodie I feel it may have gotten caught on something and kept her from floating back....just an opinion

 

[RedHaus]

I don’t know the answer to that, but the car’s onboard EDR device should function as a black box and will tell the investigators a great deal about what was happening with the car when it went into the water, if the power was on/engine was running.

Hypothetically, does anyone know if an onboard EDR records data if the engine is not running at the time of an incident?

For instance if KR's car was put in neutral gear and pushed or somehow unaided drifted down a slope?

All speculation but I am very curious.

ET: neutralize the hypothetical scenario so either accident or foul play.