Found Deceased CA - Madyson Middleton, 8, Santa Cruz, 26 July 2015 - #2 *Arrest*

[GutInstinct]

I agree that much of our discussion is esoterica. But it helps us sort it all out, if you will.

Something really awful has happened here, once again, and we are doing our best to process.

You are right, it is about this little girl and her murderer. We tend to dig deeper and analyze everything. And i am sorry that upset you.

This is just awful. Any way you look at it.

AWWW. No worries. I am not upset at all with the members on WS. I have so much respect for you guys. The info and data you find continues to blow me away. It's just that I do know a bit about mental illness - it runs in my family. And when the incident happened in Charleston and Colorado and Sandy Hook Connecticut, people who don't understand mental illness tend to blame it on guns or depression or he had problems. If they didn't have a gun, they would have used something else. They don't think like we do. It is actually incomprehensible because we can't possibly comprehend HOW or WHY someone would act the way we do. These people are sick. Off the charts sick. Demented. It is just so sad that mental healthcare is so difficult to obtain for all. ........Love u guys. Thanks,

 

[Mamamerced]

K

I just have to say this, even though it is just my opinion, but of course.......

1. If you read that gut-wrenching booking report where he was arrested for sexual assault, murder, tying her up, using an phy sical object for sexual assault, and sexual intercourse, and had a weapon of sorts and and and.....this is nothing to do with , or teen urges or no father figure. Remember Philip Chism? Did nearly the same thing and dumped her out like garbage after wheeling her dead body in a garabage can. He also used an 'object' to sexual assault.......This is the mind of a true criminal sociopath. Forget age. Forget gender. Forget race. These are the types of mental illnesses that cannot be cured. These are the type of people that arre incarcerated in prisons for the criminally insane. It was just a matter of when. There are so many people with mental illnesses (including me with depression and anxiety) so mental illness is not all the same. Just like cancer and a cold are not the same even though they are both physical illnesses. This kid is off the chart sociopath, psychopath and every other description that defines the worst of the worst that live among us.

TY for allowing me to vent. That police report/booking is also off the charts. Even the prosecutor said he cannot remember a (person of this age) ever having so many counts being placed against him. Sociopaths...Narracissts....Borderline Personality Disorder and probably a combo of all the above and more.

My heart bleeds for this little girl and her mother.....

And yes, the man with the green shirt throwing up with HIS father.

(I know you guys know most of all this already so apologies if some repeat here).

Do you think sociopaths/psychopaths are born that way or become that way due to trauma, neglect, etc.? I don't know the answer but I do suspect many are "made", especially if the abuse/neglect is a constant or near constant. Can you imagine how that could warp/rewire a mind? I am making no apologies for offenders.

 

[KinderedSpirits]

I just have to say this, even though it is just my opinion, but of course.......

1. If you read that gut-wrenching booking report where he was arrested for sexual assault, murder, tying her up, using an phy sical object for sexual assault, and sexual intercourse, and had a weapon of sorts and and and.....this is nothing to do with , or teen urges or no father figure. Remember Philip Chism? Did nearly the same thing and dumped her out like garbage after wheeling her dead body in a garabage can. He also used an 'object' to sexual assault.......This is the mind of a true criminal sociopath. Forget age. Forget gender. Forget race. These are the types of mental illnesses that cannot be cured. These are the type of people that arre incarcerated in prisons for the criminally insane. It was just a matter of when. There are so many people with mental illnesses (including me with depression and anxiety) so mental illness is not all the same. Just like cancer and a cold are not the same even though they are both physical illnesses. This kid is off the chart sociopath, psychopath and every other description that defines the worst of the worst that live among us.

TY for allowing me to vent. That police report/booking is also off the charts. Even the prosecutor said he cannot remember a (person of this age) ever having so many counts being placed against him. Sociopaths...Narracissts....Borderline Personality Disorder and probably a combo of all the above and more.

My heart bleeds for this little girl and her mother.....

And yes, the man with the green shirt throwing up with HIS father.

(I know you guys know most of all this already so apologies if some repeat here).

Not to mention that he did all that, and placed her body in the bin within an hour time frame. I find it very hard to believe that precious little Maddy was his first victim. I have been so sick over this!

 

[bessie]

This answers a question that was raised earlier. I don't know if it's been posted yet.

"His mother, who has been raising him alone, is a home health care attendant, and she left the apartment building soon after Mr. Gonzalez was taken in custody, neighbors said..."

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/30/u...h-murder-in-killing-of-madyson-middleton.html

 

[human]

With respect, I dated a young man who was 18 when I was 15, with the blessing of both of our families.

We had sex when I was 16, and it was completely consensual, although legally he could have been arrested and charged as a SO. We were together for 4 years until he was killed in a jet crash. He was a USAF F-16 pilot, just out of USAFA.

Point is, there are shades of gray in the whole SO thing. He was not a deviant, not a pedophile yet, legally, he would have been registered as both.

Like I said, we need to revisit the criteria.

Seriously, a lot of the objections are total BS. What state says public urination is a sex crime?

Ever since I can remember and that is at least 50 years there has been the term, " Jail bait." Girl under 18 although I think the age of consent is younger in some states.

It seems that a guy who gets busted is because the parents do not approve. Otherwise, I do not see these older guys getting busted. I saw it when teaching and wondered why these 30 year old guys had not been busted for having sex and a child with a 16 year old.

In the state I was from, we are notified only of Level Three sex offenders- those most likely to reoffend.

They should be locked up forever, but they aren't. Their victims get a life sentence, though

 

[SCHMAE]

K

Do you think sociopaths/psychopaths are born that way or become that way due to trauma, neglect, etc.? I don't know the answer but I do suspect many are "made", especially if the abuse/neglect is a constant or near constant. Can you imagine how that could wrap/rewire a mind? I am making no apologies for offenders.

I am 100% believe in NURTURE as opposed to nature. I have several kooky people ( including me ) on both sides of my family tree and yet I do not believe it's in my dna. I believe it is environmental and learned behavior most often brought on by trauma or abuse .

 

[EllieBee]

Not to mention that he did all that, and placed her body in the bin within an hour time frame. I find it very hard to believe that precious little Maddy was his first victim. I have been so sick over this!

I agree. Even if the victim was an animal, or the victim was human, but he did not kill them....my (often wrong; disclaimer) tells be this was not his first assault.

He did too "good" of a job for this to be his dry run. Forgive me if I sound flippant. It's how I deal.

 

[sfbaynancydrew]

I found this older cached instagram of his:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...wkwardadrian/photos+&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

 

[EllieBee]

I am 100% believe in NURTURE as opposed to nature. I have several kooky people ( including me ) on both sides of my family tree and yet I do not believe it's in my dna. I believe it is environmental and learned behavior most often brought on by trauma or abuse .

I agree for the most part, but there are many killers/rapists who has a loving, nurturing home.

I agree mostly NURTURE. But Nature plays a factor, too.

By all appearances, AJG's mom is a lovely, caring mother. And she is his parent, and off-topic. I can't see where she did anything wrong.

 

[bluesneakers]

[snip]
Their victims get a life sentence, though

Well said.

 

[mrsobrien]

Did we ever figure out if the last IG post, the video, was posted before or after the attack?

 

[EllieBee]

AWWW. No worries. I am not upset at all with the members on WS. I have so much respect for you guys. The info and data you find continues to blow me away. It's just that I do know a bit about mental illness - it runs in my family. And when the incident happened in Charleston and Colorado and Sandy Hook Connecticut, people who don't understand mental illness tend to blame it on guns or depression or he had problems. If they didn't have a gun, they would have used something else. They don't think like we do. It is actually incomprehensible because we can't possibly comprehend HOW or WHY someone would act the way we do. These people are sick. Off the charts sick. Demented. It is just so sad that mental healthcare is so difficult to obtain for all. ........Love u guys. Thanks,

I wish we could all meet up for some Texas BBQ and a couple of Shiner Bocks. Even you vegetarians and non-imbibers.

I think it would be a beautiful gathering. I really love my fellow WS'ers.

 

[Mamamerced]

I am 100% believe in NURTURE as opposed to nature. I have several kooky people ( including me ) on both sides of my family tree and yet I do not believe it's in my dna. I believe it is environmental and learned behavior most often brought on by trauma or abuse .

Well then, there are at least two of us who believe that if we want answers to how a person becomes a sadistic abuser and/or murderer, no matter the age, we need to scrutinize the family dynamic and its satellites.

 

[SCHMAE]

I agree for the most part, but there are many killers/rapists who has a loving, nurturing home.

I agree mostly NURTURE. But Nature plays a factor, too.

By all appearances, AJG's mom is a lovely, caring mother. And she is his parent, and off-topic. I can't see where she did anything wrong.

I'm not implying his mother did anything to him. It takes a village to raise a child goes both ways. If everyone in that ' village' is not on board with protection and safety of the children, the outcome can be bad. And yes, I'll give you a bit of the nature bit. I think some people are more PRONE to this or that behavior ( good or bad ) because of nature but the catalyst that makes them act out is the environment. Moo absolutely!

 

[SCHMAE]

Well then, there are at least two of us who believe that if we want answers to how a person becomes a sadistic abuser and/or murderer, no matter the age, we need to scrutinize the family dynamic and its satellites.

BBM this is an AMAZING term and I plan to use it . I have never heard it before. It is the ' village ' in my last post but you said it better. TYSM

 

[SCHMAE]

I wish we could all meet up for some Texas BBQ and a couple of Shiner Bocks. Even you vegetarians and non-imbibers.

I think it would be a beautiful gathering. I really love my fellow WS'ers.

OT I'm in. Where do we sign up ? Is there a basement ' gatherings' thread?

 

[Kaliste]

Did we ever figure out if the last IG post, the video, was posted before or after the attack?

No. Either before or after, it's chilling seeing a close up of his hands (the ones he either just used or was about to) that were used to strangle Maddy. I was poking around his IG account last night and just felt sick. I wish my mind wouldn't go this places.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SCHMAE]

I do not have a link for this because I researched it a few years ago but there are some factors that put a little new twist on nature vs. nurture for anyone so inclined. Google seasons and pregnancies. I was blown away. Different times of year and in different climates fetuses are more or less prone to this or that disorder when born. That is not dna or environment but it is ' nature' in a way. Fascinating read for folks who are bored or like this kind of information .

 

[EllieBee]

This answers a question that was raised earlier. I don't know if it's been posted yet.

"His mother, who has been raising him alone, is a home health care attendant, and she left the apartment building soon after Mr. Gonzalez was taken in custody, neighbors said..."

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/30/u...h-murder-in-killing-of-madyson-middleton.html

I think there are many single moms who do an amazing job raising their kiddos.

Also, according to her marital status/surname, she is remarried, but I suppose still considered a single mom? Stepdad was, I believe one of the people caught on video at the time of the arrest.

Please delete if that is not allowed per TOS. I don't have links. Part is my opinion and part is my recollection after having been awake since 2 am.

 

[verbonica]

I am 100% believe in NURTURE as opposed to nature. I have several kooky people ( including me ) on both sides of my family tree and yet I do not believe it's in my dna. I believe it is environmental and learned behavior most often brought on by trauma or abuse .

You do know that no two people's DNA is the same, right? Even identical twins have tiny differences.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/identical-twins-genes-are-not-identical/

Science still hasn't totally determined how all of the genetic coding works.

But, sure, nurture has an effect also.