Found Alive CA - Sherri Papini, 34, Redding, 2 November 2016 - #23

[natsound]

(Snipped by me for brevity)

I think this is the most important aspect about hose clamps being on wrists and ankles. They are difficult to tighten while on a stationary irrigation pipe or duct. And it takes a lot of turns to tighten just a bit. Meanwhile, the screwdriver slips and stabs the hand holding the clamp. I just don’t see how it can be done with a squirming victim.

BTW - I made the mistake of googling “hose clamps and bondage” instead of “hose clamps and pain compliance.” I think my iPad got malware after that.

How hard would it be for someone to tighten a hose clamp on his/her own ankles?

 

[Hope4More]

(Snipped by me for brevity)

I think this is the most important aspect about hose clamps being on wrists and ankles. They are difficult to tighten while on a stationary irrigation pipe or duct. And it takes a lot of turns to tighten just a bit. Meanwhile, the screwdriver slips and stabs the hand holding the clamp. I just don’t see how it can be done with a squirming victim.

BTW - I made the mistake of googling “hose clamps and bondage” instead of “hose clamps and pain compliance.” I think my iPad got malware after that.

Yet she was definitely found with hose clamps around her ankles, and LE even assigned a reason for them being there.

Who's to say she was squirming when they were put on? In many cases I've read/followed/watched in which the victim escaped her captor/torturer, she was able to do so because she trusted her instincts about when to fight back and when to simply comply, because complying intuitively seemed the right thing to do in order to survive.

 

[Hope4More]

KP said the bag she took off her head was the same bag she waved at motorists. Where's the bag?

I have a hard time believing LE wouldn't have mentioned a bag, saved by SP as evidence for DNA testing. They mentioned DNA found on her clothes and body, which makes her story suspicious, but didn't mention a bag shoved in KP's pocket, which would help corroborate her story. That's likely because there is no bag.

If Allison's account has any accuracy whatsoever, SP probably found a scrap of something on the interstate. Who knows. It's yet another detail that we can pick apart, but we need more information from LE to make sense of it, and they don't see fit to clear it up.

Why does the DNA found on her make her story suspicious? IMO, it helps confirm her story (why else would another woman's DNA be found on her body?) (the male DNA could easily have been second hand, from clothes or SP contact with furniture/household items, etc.).

 

[Cannonball3804]

Why does the DNA found on her make her story suspicious? IMO, it helps confirm her story (why else would another woman's DNA be found on her body?) (the male DNA could easily have been second hand, from clothes or SP contact with furniture/household items, etc.).

To me it doesn't confirm or contradict anything. We know she came home in clothes that she didn't leave home with. Those clothes had to come from somewhere. Whether borrowed or bought brand new, they were handled by one or more people before getting to Sherri. DNA analysis is so good these days, it's even capable of picking up DNA from the person at the garment factory.

It would have been weird for the garments to have DNA from ONLY Sherri.

 

[gitana1]

I agree - $150,000 is to most folks a very large amount of money. Plenty of tips for plenty of crimes have been called in for a whole lot less than that.

I don't agree that this case feeds a narrative about white soccer moms being randomly victimized by "nasty illegals." A large part of many folks' doubt & disbelief about her story is precisely that her narrative doesn't square with just about anyone's idea about how kidnappings or sex trafficking, etc. play out or who is targeted.

I don't think it was a coincidence either that SP was returned so speedily after the ransom offer turned into a reward and was increased. I know LE has said there was no connection, but I don't believe them, frankly. I think they were justifiably concerned and pissed about others playing cowboy/inserting themselves into an active & potentially life threatening situation. Acknowledging that the reward money may have favorably tipped that particular situation would have sent the wrong message.

Who knows,but my guess remains that her takers were rank amateurs, in way over their heads & had no clue how to extricate themselves from a personal payback of whatever sort becoming national news. A reward that size ensured folks weren't going to lose interest, and that the odds of being spotted and turned in were greatly increased.

(Just a guess & just an opinion).

Well yeah. To me it doesn't match anything. But many want to believe that narrative because they're vested in it. So even though the whole reason many of us are on the fence or questioning is because it doesn't fit such typical, real kidnapping scenarios, if someone were to orchestrate such a thing they might feel it would play into attitudes and suspicions of people in the area.

The demographics of her county and city are overwhelmingly working class to middle class white and they voted in record numbers for Trump. I think a narrative about "dusky-skinned savages" stealing "nice" white mamas would be eaten up around there, frankly.

It's a narrative that has excited the imaginations of Americans and caused panic in them since the inception of the nation- Indians pillaging and stealing white women and kids for slavery and sex. Black slaves uprising and taking revenge on their masters by murdering everyone and raping the women. The mythic white slave trade so many people talk about that has regular women and children stolen off the streets or from their homes and placed in auctions controlled by shadowy forces- often foreign. The movie Taken is a great example of that. Cute little white girl sold to creepy Arab rapist.

People are vested in that type of narrative and similar ones. I've found that when someone makes something up or tries to create a scene, they often, even if subconsciously, play into ethnic or other tensions at play in their community. So for Susan Smith it was a black man who stole the kids she actually murdered. For the runaway bride it was a Latino man and white woman who kidnapped and raped her in the back of a van. For political worker Ashley Todd, a black Obama supporter mugged her and carved a B on her face for "Barack". For blond Breanna Talbott it was three masked black men who beat and raped her.

It's interesting.

 

[natsound]

Why does the DNA found on her make her story suspicious? IMO, it helps confirm her story (why else would another woman's DNA be found on her body?) (the male DNA could easily have been second hand, from clothes or SP contact with furniture/household items, etc.).

I feel just the opposite. SP says she was only with two women, yet DNA from one man and one woman was picked up. There would be NO reason for LE to release the information as they did, if they believed it supported SP's story.

I'm not alone in feeling this wey, either:

http://www.sacbee.com/news/local/crime/article180824671.html

"Sherri Papini said women abducted her. But male DNA was found on her clothes, investigators now say"


https://nypost.com/2017/10/25/cops-say-details-in-abducted-joggers-story-dont-add-up/

"The Shasta County Sheriff’s Office released new details about her disappearance on Wednesday — saying they found numerous inconsistencies in Papini’s account.

First, authorities found that the California mom had male DNA on her clothes when she was picked up by cops, despite her claims that she was kidnapped by two women."

 

[Bootsctr]

Tricia stated in the latest Websleuths Radio that the male DNA was found on a jacket given to Sherri by her captors. From the media thread a woman stated it looked to be a shirt over her head. A pillow case would be a handy thing to throw over someone's head, or a flour sack, or since the captors were hispanic then maybe a masa sack? :dunno:

I suppose the hose clamps could have been fastened over her clothing. It would be very painful to have them fastened to her wrists and ankles and I would think they would definitely cut into her skin. But would kidnappers care if they cut into her skin? I don't think so. It would help to keep her still probably.

Anybody else think there are some mental health issues involved in this case? Bipolar? Depression? Manic?

I feel really bad for the children.

 

[Steleheart]

Why does the DNA found on her make her story suspicious? IMO, it helps confirm her story (why else would another woman's DNA be found on her body?) (the male DNA could easily have been second hand, from clothes or SP contact with furniture/household items, etc.).

I agree. I believe it is easily explained as transfer DNA. The clothing she was found in weren't hers. She got those clothes somewhere else.

He said when she was found, Sherri Papini was wearing a dark gray sweatshirt, light gray sweatpants and had a chain around her waist with her left wrist tethered to it by a zip-tie

The DNA also didn't match any known offenders who came up in the FBI's database, Jackson said.

http://www.redding.com/story/news/l...nears-phones-been-ringing-off-hook/795090001/

Someone previously worn sweats Female inside and male outside. The inside (not gonna try to explain) female DNA easily transferred to SP's body.
It seems simple IMO and we don't know the type of DNA - hair skin, fluid, etc.
That's enough (ugh)

JMO

 

[CoolJ]

The suspicious part about the DNA is not that it was found on her and her clothes. There could be many reasonable explanations for that. The suspicious part, or the part that makes me feel there is more to it, is the fact that LE decided to release that specific information.

 

[Bootsctr]

Maybe this was discussed before and I just missed it or forgot it.

KRCR did an interview with KP during the disappearance. In the video clip, at the :13 mark while they're talking about SP having a pink running top, they show something pink and black on the ground with an evidence marker #3 beside it. What is that?

http://www.krcrtv.com/news/local/sh...issing-wife-ask-for-her-safe-return/145248010

Back in the early days of this case, somebody posted a screen shot of that exact thing you are questioning. It is a running top. There was a picture posted of a lady wearing a similar top and it matched the top found on the ground. Makes me wonder if they stripped that off of her in the vehicle after "nabbing" her?? Wouldn't want that neon pink catching someone's eye I suppose.

 

[Bootsctr]

The suspicious part about the DNA is not that it was found on her and her clothes. There could be many reasonable explanations for that. The suspicious part, or the part that makes me feel there is more to it, is the fact that LE decided to release that specific information.

I hope that means they are going to do further testing of the DNA found and put it through the system to see if it matches anyone.

 

[gitana1]

I feel just the opposite. SP says she was only with two women, yet DNA from one man and one woman was picked up. There would be NO reason for LE to release the information as they did, if they believed it supported SP's story.

I'm not alone in feeling this wey, either:

http://www.sacbee.com/news/local/crime/article180824671.html

"Sherri Papini said women abducted her. But male DNA was found on her clothes, investigators now say"


https://nypost.com/2017/10/25/cops-say-details-in-abducted-joggers-story-dont-add-up/

"The Shasta County Sheriff’s Office released new details about her disappearance on Wednesday — saying they found numerous inconsistencies in Papini’s account.

First, authorities found that the California mom had male DNA on her clothes when she was picked up by cops, despite her claims that she was kidnapped by two women."

I can't see how she would get female DNA on her actual body. But I agree- what reason would they have to release that she had male DNA on her clothes? No need to release that.

 

[Steleheart]

The suspicious part about the DNA is not that it was found on her and her clothes. There could be many reasonable explanations for that. The suspicious part, or the part that makes me feel there is more to it, is the fact that LE decided to release that specific information.

I thought it was simply to eliminate KP. I wonder if they tested CG. I also felt thet the reason for mentioning the Michigan Man was to eliminate him as well knowing that "armchair detectives" who run rampant on SM along with news paparazzi would eventually begin stalking, harassing and speculating about him.

JMO

 

[Steleheart]

I can't see how she would get female DNA on her actual body. But I agree- what reason would they have to release that she had male DNA on her clothes? No need to release that.

The simplest would be touch DNA, choking, struggling, hair dropped , saliva... no? They changed her clothes from the jogging outfit she was seen in before she disappeared.

The Sheriff’s Office has had multiple eye witness reports from neighbors that know Papini and she was seen in the area of Sunrise Drive on Wednesday in the mid to late-morning or early afternoon wearing a pink jogging top while she was on a jog or walk.

http://www.krcrtv.com/news/local/sh...ssing-shasta-co-woman-sherri-papini/142731721

 

[Steleheart]

Maybe this was discussed before and I just missed it or forgot it.

KRCR did an interview with KP during the disappearance. In the video clip, at the :13 mark while they're talking about SP having a pink running top, they show something pink and black on the ground with an evidence marker #3 beside it. What is that?

http://www.krcrtv.com/news/local/sh...issing-wife-ask-for-her-safe-return/145248010

Eh, I have the pic but lost the link but the pic shows the source in it - a screen grab..
Yes we don't know anything about it but it has an evidence marker next to it. we have seen the suit but we don't know what she wore under it. A shirt, Bra top like the picture, etc. It looked like a pink sports bra folded inside out with a black lining IIRC.

I'll look for it.

ETA: still have it in my attachments from way back then.

 

[Bootsctr]

Eh, I have the pic but lost the link but the pic shows the source in it - a screen grab..
Yes we don't know anything about it but it has an evidence marker next to it. we have seen the suit but we don't know what she wore under it. A shirt, Bra to like the picture, etc. It looked like a pink sports bra inside out with a black lining IIRC.

I'll look for it.

Thanks Steleheart! I thought you posted the picture originally. :tyou:

 

[Steleheart]

Thanks Steleheart! I thought you posted the picture originally. :tyou:

I put it in my post. What a memory! Not me, You! :loveyou:

 

[Hope4More]

Well yeah. To me it doesn't match anything. But many want to believe that narrative because they're vested in it. So even though the whole reason many of us are on the fence or questioning is because it doesn't fit such typical, real kidnapping scenarios, if someone were to orchestrate such a thing they might feel it would play into attitudes and suspicions of people in the area.

The demographics of her county and city are overwhelmingly working class to middle class white and they voted in record numbers for Trump. I think a narrative about "dusky-skinned savages" stealing "nice" white mamas would be eaten up around there, frankly.

It's a narrative that has excited the imaginations of Americans and caused panic in them since the inception of the nation- Indians pillaging and stealing white women and kids for slavery and sex. Black slaves uprising and taking revenge on their masters by murdering everyone and raping the women. The mythic white slave trade so many people talk about that has regular women and children stolen off the streets or from their homes and placed in auctions controlled by shadowy forces- often foreign. The movie Taken is a great example of that. Cute little white girl sold to creepy Arab rapist.

People are vested in that type of narrative and similar ones. I've found that when someone makes something up or tries to create a scene, they often, even if subconsciously, play into ethnic or other tensions at play in their community. So for Susan Smith it was a black man who stole the kids she actually murdered. For the runaway bride it was a Latino man and white woman who kidnapped and raped her in the back of a van. For political worker Ashley Todd, a black Obama supporter mugged her and carved a B on her face for "Barack". For blond Breanna Talbott it was three masked black men who beat and raped her.

It's interesting.

I hear you loud & clear, and know that what you say about an ugly history & present tendencies is 100% accurate, sadly.

But...(for devil's advocate loving me I always have buts, lol) the fact of that reality doesn't mean that SP naming Latinas is a lie, or that the whole thing was a lie. It would be appalling beyond measure though IF (not saying I think this is so) SP ginned up a story of evil Latina kidnappers rather than to fess up to who actually targeted & harmed her.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

I can't see how she would get female DNA on her actual body. But I agree- what reason would they have to release that she had male DNA on her clothes? No need to release that.

Agree. If it were just a tiny sample consistent with touch DNA, I don't think they would have mentioned it. IMO, the amount of DNA must have been large enough to be significant and consistent with personal contact.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

I hear you loud & clear, and know that what you say about an ugly history & present tendencies is 100% accurate, sadly.

But...(for devil's advocate loving me I always have buts, lol) the fact of that reality doesn't mean that SP naming Latinas is a lie, or that the whole thing was a lie. It would be appalling beyond measure though IF (not saying I think this is so) SP ginned up a story of evil Latina kidnappers rather than to fess up to who actually targeted & harmed her.

BBM

Like the story in the blog post? [emoji848]


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