Deceased/Not Found CA - Sierra LaMar, 15, Morgan Hill, 16 March 2012 #11 *A. Garcia-Torres guilty*

[Inspector Gidget]

I know times have changed but when I was 15,I was going to school and working a part time job at night.We never had a computer but if we did I would have been too tired to be on it.By the way when do these kids do their homework?

 

[GrainneDhu]

I think the kids who like the music called HorrorCore, like ODDFUTURE, are more evil than some others, imo. Who likes to sing and dance to rape and murder visions?

I became a feminist in the early 70s (second wave). That didn't and doesn't stop me from loving the music of the Rolling Stones, which is rife with sexism and (in some places) downright misogyny.

I love the tunes, I love the beat, I love the hooks (okay, I love Keith Richards too <snrk>). If I think too closely about the lyrics of some of my favourite Stones songs, I get really uncomfortable... so I don't think too closely about them and just enjoy what I enjoy.

I suspect that bands like Odd Future appeal to teens like Sierra because they don't have a visceral response to rape, violence, murder. Those things just seem really edgy and daring to teens.

When I start to judge teens who listen to this stuff, I have to remind myself that despite 40+ years of feminism, I'm still listening to the Rolling Stones. I'm certainly old enough to know better... but I do it anyway.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Well, if her account was hacked, it certainly was an excellent demonstration as to how her Twitter account could have been hacked or posted by someone else on the day she disappeared, also.

Look at how quickly LE figured out who to question about that tweet. I'm certain that LE didn't just accept the last tweets and posts at face value, they checked them out carefully.

 

[Inspector Gidget]

I still am confused about her MOTHER'S REACTIONS. I would be crazy and everywhere.

Absolutely everywhere. SCREAMING.

WHY ARE HER PARENTS. not doing this????????????

My guess would be they are on some strong sedatives.I know they would have to put me on some or I would be running down the street screaming.

 

[shana]

Many thanks to the Mods/Admins for changing the wording in the opening post...at last.

 

[katydid23]

I became a feminist in the early 70s (second wave). That didn't and doesn't stop me from loving the music of the Rolling Stones, which is rife with sexism and (in some places) downright misogyny.

I love the tunes, I love the beat, I love the hooks (okay, I love Keith Richards too <snrk>). If I think too closely about the lyrics of some of my favourite Stones songs, I get really uncomfortable... so I don't think too closely about them and just enjoy what I enjoy.

I suspect that bands like Odd Future appeal to teens like Sierra because they don't have a visceral response to rape, violence, murder. Those things just seem really edgy and daring to teens.

When I start to judge teens who listen to this stuff, I have to remind myself that despite 40+ years of feminism, I'm still listening to the Rolling Stones. I'm certainly old enough to know better... but I do it anyway.

I loved the Grateful Dead. Went to many a Dead show, back in the day. And nowadays I love rap and hip hop. I really do enjoy it and listen to it even though the kids are away for school.

But OddFuture is horrorcore. WAY WAY over the line. Sympathy for the Devil, Brown Sugar, or Paint it Black are no comparison, to the violent, bloody sick and twisted images in horrorcore. imo

 

[GrainneDhu]

If someone had the ability to hack her account or had her password, would they also be able to delete any messages or pms before LE began forensics on her devices?

I wonder that partly because my DD knows friends whose boyfriends demand to know their passwords as a way to make sure the girlfriends are not 'talking to' other guys.

Deleting isn't a permanent removal of evidence. It just keeps the deleted material from showing up on screen; it's still in memory until it is overwritten.

And even after it is overwritten, it can be recovered.

The one sure way to get rid of something that has been on a computer drive at some point is to pull out the hard drive platter and take a bench grinder to it.

 

[Straitfan]

I still am confused about her MOTHER'S REACTIONS. I would be crazy and everywhere.

Absolutely everywhere. SCREAMING.

WHY ARE HER PARENTS. not doing this????????????


Some will say, "we all react different???" True but I'm not buying it, I dont know a single person who would not be frantic, screaming under such circumstance...

None of this horrible story adds up....sadly

(Sorry, the quotes are messed up)

 

[BeginnersLuck]

I still am confused about her MOTHER'S REACTIONS. I would be crazy and everywhere.

Absolutely everywhere. SCREAMING.

WHY ARE HER PARENTS. not doing this????????????

1. The parents have a tremendous amount of support from Mark Klaas and others that have experienced what they are going through.

2. When trauma happens and in this case it is prolonged trauma, adrenaline takes over and you are focused on one thing, finding Sierra. They will most likely breakdown when it is over with. They know they have to be strong now and keep going and not give up.

3. Reacting crazy would be counterproductive in accomplishing anything.

Look how strong Mark Klaas is. There is something in our makeup that takes over and keeps us going during when horrible things happen. I know when it's happened to me, I felt like a zoombie walking around, fuzzy headed and not able to speak real clearly.

 

[GrainneDhu]

What I find odd is the photos of nude women... Not just that they Are nude, but they are raunchy nude... Returned or tweeted.... Is this a new thing for teenage girls? Or is Sierra a lesbian? maybe that is why there is no boyfriend or crush (whatever words Danielle said) is because there was girlfriend? Maybe a jealous ex-girlfriend?

I still think a female was involved ...

It's not new, that's for sure. Check out Cosmopolitan or a number of other magazines clearly aimed at young women. Full of provocative pictures of women. Not as graphic as the ones on Sierra's Tumblr account... well, I take that back, some of the ads are equally as graphic!

However, my point is that those magazines are read almost exclusively by young het women. That's their target demographic.

So Sierra's Tumblr doesn't give me evidence that she's straight, bi or gay.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Amen. And her Twitter and Tumblir accounts should have been turned to private after she was abducted. My gosh, the whole world can read these! I thought I was broad minded, but this stuff blew me away. What would an older conservative reader from, say, the Mid-west (as compared to California) think? Doesn't leave a very good impression IMHO. Whether or not she was just trying to be cool, this is what she projected. Poor kid needed boundaries.

I'm a life long midwesterner. Born and bred. For whatever it is worth, my overwhelming impression is that Sierra was a naive, relatively innocent girl who was putting up an edgy front.

I wonder if there wasn't an element of "pick your battles" going on there. If a parent clamps down on every single thing a teen does, then the home turns into a constant war zone. So, most parents prioritise what is absolutely necessary to control and what can be allowed albeit with a clothespin clamped to the parental nose.

 

[LadyNorCal]

I still am confused about her MOTHER'S REACTIONS. I would be crazy and everywhere.

Absolutely everywhere. SCREAMING.

WHY ARE HER PARENTS. not doing this????????????

My guess would be they are on some strong sedatives.I know they would have to put me on some or I would be running down the street screaming.

Can you imagine the load she's under? She probably hasn't slept. She is probably emotionally trying to control herself in public. She is probably so distraught, and so cried out, that she cannot show emotion.

She is organizing, trying to be strong for her other daughter.

 

[revampz]

I loved the Grateful Dead. Went to many a Dead show, back in the day. And nowadays I love rap and hip hop. I really do enjoy it and listen to it even though the kids are away for school.

But OddFuture is horrorcore. WAY WAY over the line. Sympathy for the Devil, Brown Sugar, or Paint it Black are no comparison, to the violent, bloody sick and twisted images in horrorcore. imo

I have not really followed this case but have the bear bones of it....I have just read the lyrics from this Oddfuture.

I too think this is way way over the line. I am quite an open person with a bit of an attitude like "whatever floats your boat".........

One of my dreams is to study sociology and I am so interested in social changes especially amongst teens.

I have to say how worried I am about society and its future, it seems like so many of the youngs one are angry or bitter or basically do not have any social standards or morals. We have crossed the line as to what is allowed to be viewed on computers, tv shows and especially music.....

If you have watched shows like I Claudius or Caligua it seems we are descending back into that type of moral decay.

 

[LadyNorCal]

I thought of something I haven't seen anyone ask about (although it may have been asked...I read almost all the posts, but skimmed some).

This is an upper-crust neighborhood. Even middle-class citiens often keep cameras going. What about the neighbors? The houses along the route where Sierra was abducted...don't any of them have cameras?

Is anyone aware as to whether LE has looked into this or not?

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Here is a video I haven't seen posted yet about her twitter being hacked and the fund raiser dinner they had earlier.

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/vi...twitter-account-of-missing-teen-sierra-lamar/

 

[GrainneDhu]

I still am confused about her MOTHER'S REACTIONS. I would be crazy and everywhere.

Absolutely everywhere. SCREAMING.

WHY ARE HER PARENTS. not doing this????????????

Check out the links forum or one of askfornina's excellent timeline posts. Sierra's mother and father have been all over the media. Her mother has even appeared on Nancy Grace more than once (an ordeal I wouldn't wish on anyone).

They've been at the search centre. They've appeared at vigils and other events.

They've handed out fliers, including approaching drivers in their cars at stop signs near the house, hoping that regular commuters may have seen something.

They've brought in KlaasKids, which has coordinated massive volunteer searches.

What more do you suggest they do?

Yes, Marlene said that she recently returned to work. I imagine that's a matter of necessity; she's got a daughter in college and it won't do Sierra one bit of good if her mother is homeless due to not being able to pay the rent.

This country is, in many ways, indifferent to the plight of the victims of violent crime. For instance, after everything little Shasta Groene went through, I was horrified but not surprised to learn that she went through a period of homelessness after her father was diagnosed with cancer and at another period, was forced to live in a house backing onto the interstate, which was hugely triggering for her.

In this country, just having a victim advocate in the court system is a major step and not every state even has them yet.

Compare this to how Elisabeth Fritzl has been treated in Austria: her physical and psychological needs and those of her children have been paid for by the state as a matter of course. And she hasn't been forced to sell her story to the media in order to get these needs met.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I loved the Grateful Dead. Went to many a Dead show, back in the day. And nowadays I love rap and hip hop. I really do enjoy it and listen to it even though the kids are away for school.

But OddFuture is horrorcore. WAY WAY over the line. Sympathy for the Devil, Brown Sugar, or Paint it Black are no comparison, to the violent, bloody sick and twisted images in horrorcore. imo

And that's pretty much what many people said about the Rolling Stones in the 1960s. Remember Keith Richards saying "there is no publicity too bad for the Rolling Stones"?

The Rolling Stones moved the line way out there. Their music is no longer considered edgy because other bands who want to be edgy have moved the line further and further out there.

Gotta keep moving that line or the adults won't have anything to freak out about. Isn't freaking out the adults practically the job description for teens?

I guarantee you that in another 25 years, many of the teens who are Odd Future fans now will be all horrified at what their teens are listening to in 2037.

To tie all this in with Sierra, that's how I see her tweets and Tumblr accounts: trying to push the edge and seem much more shocking than she really was in the rest of her life.

 

[sorrell skye]

I became a feminist in the early 70s (second wave). That didn't and doesn't stop me from loving the music of the Rolling Stones, which is rife with sexism and (in some places) downright misogyny.

I love the tunes, I love the beat, I love the hooks (okay, I love Keith Richards too <snrk>). If I think too closely about the lyrics of some of my favourite Stones songs, I get really uncomfortable... so I don't think too closely about them and just enjoy what I enjoy.

I suspect that bands like Odd Future appeal to teens like Sierra because they don't have a visceral response to rape, violence, murder. Those things just seem really edgy and daring to teens.

When I start to judge teens who listen to this stuff, I have to remind myself that despite 40+ years of feminism, I'm still listening to the Rolling Stones. I'm certainly old enough to know better... but I do it anyway.

I disagree about the idea that song lyrics that celebrate rape, violence & murder are innocuous, and that those who listen to these song lyrics are unaffected by them. Teens are highly influenced by the music they listen to, IMO.

According to this website, about 44 percent of all sexual assault victims are under age 18.

http://www.teenviolencestatistics.com/content/rape-statistics.html

As far as I'm concerned, it's high time and then some to educate our young women & our young men on the facts of sexual assault. Dumbing them down will not serve them well, and pretending that something is innocent (song lyrics that celebrate rape, violence, murder) when it's clearly not, will only serve to perpetuate sexual assaults against women, especially young women who haven't yet gained the life experience necessary to discern the subtle signs of predatory behavior.

Everyone should have a visceral response to rape, violence, and murder. Teens included. I refuse to accept the idea that rape & murder are "edgy", simply because they're rapped in popular song lyrics.

Rape and murder are heinous crimes. If we accept the idea that it's edgy (i.e. artistic) to celebrate these heinous crimes in song lyrics, how can we reconcile that idea with the awful reality of rape and murder?

The two are not mutually exclusive, no matter how avant-garde we might believe ourselves to be.

ETA: I'm not only a rape survivor (as a teen), but a gang-bang rape survivor. It will never be acceptable to me for anyone to celebrate rape under any guise. Song lyrics & artistic license be damned. Rape is rape. There is nothing edgy about it. My experience altered my entire life - in some ways for the better, in some ways for the worse.

 

[cluciano63]

And that's pretty much what many people said about the Rolling Stones in the 1960s. Remember Keith Richards saying "there is no publicity too bad for the Rolling Stones"?

The Rolling Stones moved the line way out there. Their music is no longer considered edgy because other bands who want to be edgy have moved the line further and further out there.

Gotta keep moving that line or the adults won't have anything to freak out about. Isn't freaking out the adults practically the job description for teens?

I guarantee you that in another 25 years, many of the teens who are Odd Future fans now will be all horrified at what their teens are listening to in 2037.

To tie all this in with Sierra, that's how I see her tweets and Tumblr accounts: trying to push the edge and seem much more shocking than she really was in the rest of her life.

The difference is now they are telling the whole word how edgy and sharp they are...not just putting it on for their friends at school. The dangers of the internet have been an issue for almost 2 decades now and still don't seem to sink in, or be stressed enough for parents re: their kids. How many cases have we seen this year alone on WS where a girl is missing and the first info states that she may be with a man she met online? And there are probably many more we don't hear about. Not saying this is what happened with Sierra, but she was sure making herself a target. I am not picking on her at all, as I read all the back on her twitter and she seems underneath it all to be a sweetheart and often sad, but the surface is what the creeps see who are looking for girls, victims, whatever...JMO

 

[LittleMissContrary]

My one observation regarding the hacked tweet was regarding the punctuation. I have not noticed Sierra or any of her friends using any punctuation, and the lyric as it is written is not punctuated. Its that damn comma in the middle of the sentence. It makes me think it was written by someone outside of her social group, and likely an older person.

I can't help but wonder if there is some possible significance to this choice of comment. It was not simply retweeted from her original tweet at the end of December, it was newly written. That means that someone took the time to go all the way back to December and find that quote. Maybe it was an inside joke of some kind that Sierra used with friends. I have known of song lyrics that morphed into a common saying among friends. I went back to the beginning of the tweets on her account, but it took a very long time because of the limited amount of page in view as you slowly scroll back through the history.

I have to wonder if this person, even if they have nothing to do with her disappearance is trying to hint at something.
If the police are unable to determine who hacked the account and posted that tweet, then I am going to be very nervous.