Deceased/Not Found CA - Sierra LaMar, 15, Morgan Hill, 16 March 2012 #18 *A. Garcia-Torres guilty*

[cluciano63]

Not replying to any topic, but I am in the USA right now on vacation, and boy is this hitting home even more. Just thinking about Sierra all day, and have been praying that she will be found soon. She really has become "an international daughter" to all of us. I wish her family knew that there are people all over the world who knows about this, and has been following any news, and who are praying also.

A card or note sent c/o the sheriff's office would probably reach the Lamar's...I thought about that too. JMO

 

[Ransom]

Hi there, everyone supporting and searching for Sierra. I'm new to there forums. My question is, what is "LE" an acronym for? I understand it's a branch of the law.

This has been a very interesting and publicized case. I have just read and learned about hotsteno's twitter, bit I can recall digging back a few pages and reading that someone tweeted about one of sierras schoolmates possibly being in ATG's car too, and luring her?

I also agree with a previous poster who stated they believe ATG might be a pawn. If Sierra is not in the immediate bay area I think he must have had at least one accomplice.

Also how about gang affiliation? He's from the south San Jose-North Gilroy area, sporting a RED Jetta, arrested in RED shorts. This is an area where the mexican farmers/workers have known to associate with the Norteno. (Sorry to profile, but I thought it was worth speculation)

Thanks to everyone who has posted helpful information. My best energy and wishes to Sierra and the LaMar family.

Welcome.

Here's a link that explains some of our "lingo", but LE = law enforcement
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[cluciano63]

Something on twitter about a body in a pond in South San Jose...have no idea how far away that is...

ETA: Never mind...it is a man

 

[LinasK]

BBM
None of this directed at your post, SurfieTX .. just using it as a jumping off point.

FWIW I am in no way defending him, but it does bother me that many posts here do not use the above bolded word .. allegedly or alleged. He seems to have already been convicted in this forum. Isn't he innocent until such time as he is proven guilty in a court of law?

All of the above is just my opinion and am prepared for all flame throwing!

So what? This is NOT a court of law, it's our opinion. If I believe he's guilty, and I'm not on his jury, it doesn't matter, and piggybacking on a previous post, only the mods get to decide what topics we can or can't post on/ what should be the focus- not other posters!!!

 

[deanna82437]

So what? This is NOT a court of law, it's our opinion. If I believe he's guilty, and I'm not on his jury, it doesn't matter, and piggybacking on a previous post, only the mods get to decide what topics we can or can't post on/ what should be the focus- not other posters!!!

It was simply a question.

 

[DOUBTFUL]

Just some thoughts-

The Sherriff's office can say whatever they want in a press conference. Their
Story may change or evolve depending on their understanding of the
Evidence, or they may just make mistakes. It happens. The Sherriff herself
Is not the smoothest speaker when at the podium, nothing wrong with that,
But her choppy delivery might lead to things coming out a little skewed.
I'm not accusing her of misleading anybody, I just think it is part of the
Process. Some Sherriff's are very smooth public speakers and good in front
Of a battery of cameras, I don't think it is her strong suit. It does not mean
That the Sherriff's office isn't doing a good job.

They try to walk the line between keeping the public informed and collecting
And preserving evidence. These two issues are not necessarily mutually exclusive, but when it comes to Priorities and resources, they owe the crime
Much more than they owe the public. They really don't have to tell the public
Much, if anything. They are not testifying during a press conference, they are
Informing the public, for the most part, if not asking for assistance.
They choose what to reveal and when to reveal it. It may or may not really
Stack up exactly with the facts as they come out in a court of law, for any number of reasons. They are managing a case, and a big part of that is trying
To control information, whether it is evidentiary or not.

So, to my mind, they owe us very little. I would hope they owe society their
Best effort, but I don't expect them to set everything out on the table for a
Feast of public consumption.
That said, the hubbub about where the dogs ran out of scent seems to be a
Tempest in a tea pot.

If the scent trail ended at the front door it means ........what?
If the scent trail ended at the end of the driveway, it means what ?
If the scent trail ended halfway down her street, it means what ?

By asking "it means what ?", I am asking what does it matter to understanding the dynamics of the case?
Does 50' make that big of a difference?
50 yards ?
100 yards?


On a slightly different note: I was involved with Search and Rescue, Mountain Rescue specifically,For
A number of years.
The team Did have their own bloodhounds, and I have been involved in a number of searches
With "live human- Bloodhound" tracking teams, from our team as well as from independent dog
Teams.
I have to say that over a number of years, the results varied widely, from search to search, and dog
To dog. Some dogs are much better than others, and some handlers are as well. Even the best
Can have good days and bad.
They are a tool. Their contribution can be valuable, but it can also be contradictory and confusing.
The same dog can have two different results on two different days over the same course.
There are a lot of variables.
I don't think you'll see convictions based on contributions of tracking dogs...
I am speaking of Live Human dogs, which are mainly Bloodhounds.
Cadaver Dogs are a whole different world, and I believe their results are much easier to assess.
Just based on my experience....

 

[cluciano63]

I agree about the sheriff's public speaking skills, lol...also I am sure that at every word, she is trying to phrase something without giving away too much. JMO

 

[sayd]

Except the Sheriff stated in her PC that SIERRA was the one who tossed the bag. Had to have thrown it to land right there, incredibly, I guess since they are "saying", for what it's worth, that her scent was not found in the area of the shed.

I'm sorry; I missed that the sheriff said that. It is interesting that it didn't appear in the statement of facts.

The mystery continues....

 

[cluciano63]

I'm sorry; I missed that the sheriff said that. It is interesting that it didn't appear in the statement of facts.

The mystery continues....

That isn't what was said, in my opinion...her statement was confusing, but my belief is she was explaining that Sierra was not the one who discarded it because it held things she needed, "including medication". The statement can be found a page or so back...

 

[Ven]

Do we know if she usually carried books in her arms?
Did she have one bag that was a purse/bookbag?

Or multiple bags?

If she always carried books in her arms (a lot of students do this), then you would expect to find them on the street wherever she was attacked. It's not like the criminal is going to stop and pick up dropped books and throw them in his car, nor would she be carefully holding onto them as she's being abducted.

If she did carry books in her arms and they were found elsewhere, that would indicate she went willingly with him. Otherwise, if they were in some kind of bag or bookbag, that doesn't indicate much.

Although in a sudden attack, you would still expect some articles to be dropped and left on the ground. Not necessarily, but the probability is high.

 

[Tuliptiptoe]

Do we know if she usually carried books in her arms?
Did she have one bag that was a purse/bookbag?

Or multiple bags?

If she always carried books in her arms (a lot of students do this), then you would expect to find them on the street wherever she was attacked. It's not like the criminal is going to stop and pick up dropped books and throw them in his car, nor would she be carefully holding onto them as she's being abducted.

If she did carry books in her arms and they were found elsewhere, that would indicate she went willingly with him. Otherwise, if they were in some kind of bag or bookbag, that doesn't indicate much.

Although in a sudden attack, you would still expect some articles to be dropped and left on the ground. Not necessarily, but the probability is high.

In one interview Marlene said that Sierra would put smaller school items like pencils in the bag and carry her binder/books separately. I believe this was a NG interview, but I could be mistaken.

 

[LLLindsayy]

Do we know if she usually carried books in her arms?
Did she have one bag that was a purse/bookbag?

Or multiple bags?

If she always carried books in her arms (a lot of students do this), then you would expect to find them on the street wherever she was attacked. It's not like the criminal is going to stop and pick up dropped books and throw them in his car, nor would she be carefully holding onto them as she's being abducted.

If she did carry books in her arms and they were found elsewhere, that would indicate she went willingly with him. Otherwise, if they were in some kind of bag or bookbag, that doesn't indicate much.

Although in a sudden attack, you would still expect some articles to be dropped and left on the ground. Not necessarily, but the probability is high.

All of this makes complete sense, except BBM, if he was hoping Sierra would be written off as a runaway. She probably wouldn't have left her books laying in the street if she ran away.

 

[LittleMissContrary]

Except the Sheriff stated in her PC that SIERRA was the one who tossed the bag. Had to have thrown it to land right there, incredibly, I guess since they are "saying", for what it's worth, that her scent was not found in the area of the shed.

Yes, the sheriff is rather insistent on this point about Sierra having been the one to toss the bag. That suggests to me that they may be trying to explain the possible scenario where there are no fingerprints belonging to Antolin on the handles or the exterior of the purse, although DNA bearing a "strong association" to Antolin's was found in her purse.

That is the only logical explanation I can come up with, but certainly not the only logical explanation.

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

It just doesn't make sense to me to be carting around a naked female. A female is really going to catch attention. I don't think it would be a deterant at all to escaping. If you feel you life is in danger you are going to try and get away naked or not. I just can't find any reason why he would have her strip and then take her to another location.

I'm more inclined to believe that where her cloths came off is the same place that the crime was committed.

I think that for some people it could be a powerful deterrent. On the other hand, though, there are anecdotes of women who run naked or almost naked away from an assaultant. (some are IMO really inspiring stories and I would love to give you refs but the " lovely spring weather" is cooking my brain.) I guess it comes down to how truly endangered you feel.

 

[cluciano63]

Yes, the sheriff is rather insistent on this point about Sierra having been the one to toss the bag. That suggests to me that they may be trying to explain the possible scenario where there are no fingerprints belonging to Antolin on the handles or the exterior of the purse, although DNA bearing a "strong association" to Antolin's was found in her purse.

That is the only logical explanation I can come up with, but certainly not the only logical explanation.

I am confused as to where the sheriff insisted Sierra tossed the bag?
I took her words to mean the opposite, JMO.

 

[Morganhillmom]

I think that for some people it could be a powerful deterrent. On the other hand, though, there are anecdotes of women who run naked or almost naked away from an assaultant. (some are IMO really inspiring stories and I would love to give you refs but the " lovely spring weather" is cooking my brain.) I guess it comes down to how truly endangered you feel.

I think that LE not only has his car fleeing the scene by her home but also all around UVAS. Her home is close to the back way to UVAS where he would have to go past more gated homes off LLagas and out by Chesbro, or he could of gone up Baily and passed IBM which is very close too and most likely has a camera. LE must know which route he took and maybe just lost him as he entered the park or close to that area. As far as her clothes I think he made her walk with him in the park promising he wouldn't hurt her if she cooperated, maybe her bag has lake water on it, she undressed, placed the clothes in the bag as she was maybe told to do. As far as being a heat of the moment crime, I think he planned it. He saw her everyday on his way to work (I read and article by his mother, maybe first statement) he knew he had time to plan, maybe had something already at the site in which to take care of her. If he was indeed the guy she tweeted about being "lucky" he was in a steel car, I imagine she flipped him off or yelled back which took it to assault to murder. He maybe smug because he knows they will never find her. Being from MH it was strange to have an assault tried several times even after the calls were made to every resdience much like in Sierras first night missing. We were all given a call to our cells warning about an attacker who struck twice at Safeway and even with all the hype, he did it again. jmo of course

 

[RachelMarie]

It is possible that Sierra did throw the bag herself. Maybe she did it on purpose so her family would know something was wrong and search for her. JMO

 

[houndstooth]

I got from that rather convoluted statement that it was NOT Sierra who discarded the items, as these were items she needed. JMO

You never hear her back it up and speak about it being AGT instead, like she misspoke about the "who", discarded the bag.

Her do-over wording is about the issue of thrown.
It appeared to me she was attempting to ward off questions about
how it was launched a considerable distance without becoming not
neatly folded in the process.

But, I don't see how it got there in the scenario they have given without scent trail or being thrown. Apparently there aren't any fingerprints on the handle or obvious places to show ATG touched the outside of the bag.
So it may be just Sierra's and Marlene's fingerprints left from handling the bag.

 

[SweetT]

I am confused as to where the sheriff insisted Sierra tossed the bag?
I took her words to mean the opposite, JMO.

Well I'm confused too. What ? Sierra was naked and tossing her bag around? I don't think she could toss that far and that is not what I thought was being conveyed either.

Just adding I also thought the purse was a velvet/suede type bag, That would be difficult to get fingerprints on I would think.

 

[houndstooth]

I'm sorry; I missed that the sheriff said that. It is interesting that it didn't appear in the statement of facts.

The mystery continues....

Well neither did the mention of the Tweets that morning.
So it's not the only thing that got skimmed over.
And there is a problem about the tweet.
Answer: just don't mention it.