Canada- 6 people dead, including suspect, after shooting in Toronto condo (Vaughan) Dec 18 2022

[Marysmith]

Selling would be like admitting the “demons” defeated him. There’s nothing logical about an irrational person who truly believes they been wronged, seems causing death was how he intended to win the battle. The condo board had filed a restraining order filed against him, unfortunately that wasn’t enough to protect them but in doing so they must’ve known he might be dangerous.

This tragedy is another example why I’ve long believed Canada should legalize involuntary mental health incarceration. This social media rantings, will not blatantly threatening, surely were another indication of his poor mental health.

This story is not really unique, it’s very similar to other incidents were an unbalanced and disgruntled idiot shoots up people at a prior workplace or government agency.

JMO

I agree. I wonder if his posts were even seen though really before this? There is

 

[MistyWaters]

I agree. I wonder if his posts were even seen though really before this? There is

It appears so, and that his aggressive behaviour was well known to the extent that the condo board attempted to protect themselves and others legally.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/francesco-villi-vaughan-shooting-what-we-know-1.6691201

“In 2018, the condominium corporation took Villi to court seeking an order to have him cease his "threatening, abusive, intimidating and harassing behaviour toward the board members, property management, workers and residents," legal documents show.

The board also wanted Villi to stop making video and audio recordings of board members and staff and stop posting those videos to his Facebook and Twitter accounts.

Villi countersued and sought damages for $1 million.

In 2019, Justice Paul Perell ordered Villi to not make video or audio recordings of the board's members, management, residents or employees. The judge also ordered Villi to remove social media posts and not make new posts about the court matter, and to only communicate with the board by email or letter.

Villi failed to comply with the court order and the condominium moved to have him held in contempt in September 2021. A judge found he breached the order by speaking to staff members in an "aggressive and sometimes threatening manner."

Villi was set to move on to the penalty phase of the contempt proceedings in April 2022, but the condominium withdrew the hearing after he complied for a few months.

But that didn't last.

Villi allegedly breached the order again soon after, court documents show. The condominium alleged Villi approached and harassed security guards. They said the building lost security guards because of his behaviour.

A number of the residents filed a joint complaint to the condominium about him…

…..Villi was slated to be in court on Monday, however his case wasn't heard due to his death.

The board was seeking to have a judge find him in contempt for violating a previous order to not contact the board, to stop threatening its members and building staff and to cease posting about them on social media.

The condominium wanted Villi gone — it sought a penalty from court to force him to sell and vacate his unit within 90 days, a factum filed in court by the condominium corporation last month said.

Villi never made it to court.

"Mr. Villi passed away yesterday. On consent of the defendants, this action and the counterclaim are permanently stayed," a court document dated Monday says...”

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Vaughan has a massive Italian community and is a hub of organized crime. Given how hard it is to get a handgun in Canada, I wonder if he may have had mob connections?

Make no mistake, this isn't a mob hit. This is clearly a very sick man who had a grudge. But it could explain how he got the gun.

I’m from Toronto and it wasn’t until I moved to Nova Scotia that I realized how easy it is to buy a gun in Canada.

I went to a nice store to pick up bread and salami and wandered to the back of the store—every type of gun you can imagine. And the clerk explained how easy it was to obtain one. (That was 2018. In 2020 the assault weapon ban was announced restricting the sale of about 1/4 of the weapons in the store.)

Selling would be like admitting the “demons” defeated him. There’s nothing logical about an irrational person who truly believes they been wronged, seems causing death was how he intended to win the battle. The condo board had filed a restraining order filed against him, unfortunately that wasn’t enough to protect them but in doing so they must’ve known he might be dangerous.

This tragedy is another example why I’ve long believed Canada should legalize involuntary mental health incarceration. This social media rantings, will not blatantly threatening, surely were another indication of his poor mental health.

This story is not really unique, it’s very similar to other incidents were an unbalanced and disgruntled idiot shoots up people at a prior workplace or government agency.

JMO

What I’ve seen suggested:
-Red flag law (A restraining order should have resulted in his losing his weapon if he had it legally).
-increase the power of LE & medical staff to issue holds. Right now if a patient is in distress but denies wishing to harm either themselves or otters …(‘others’, but I’m going to let my phone win that autocorrect)… they’re powerless.
-tougher policing/laws for illegal weapons
-zero tolerance laws when it comes to having threatening people within a community such as a condo

We have an Involuntary Psychiatric Hold law, but when the patient seems ‘stable’, it becomes next to impossible to confine them. I can think of three killers who were deemed criminally not responsible due to mental illness who were released once they were on their medications and deemed ‘safe’.

 

[MistyWaters]

As this dispute between is mentioned to have been longstanding, I wonder if the deceased victims were Condo board of directors throughout the entire time? I bet not. Purely my speculation based on lessons learned by my own personal experience is goes something like this - new owners get to know a few of their neighbours and then comes the annual condo meeting with vacancies on the board because of resignations or owners selling. So at this meeting longterm residents put names of totally naive new owners forth and low and behold, they suddenly find themselves not only nominated but elected to the board of directors without knowing anything about the toxic turmoil that exists, in this case specifically regarding FV.

IMO a hierarchy of property owners managing other property owners is a no win situation whether it be condo boards or home owner‘s associations.

My heart goes out to these innocent victims because they surely did not expect they’d be putting their lives on the line by contributing their time and energy to a cause that they believed was for the benefit of all residences.

My lesson learned was just say no. Following this horrible incident I’d guess it will lead to a mass exodus of many currently serving on condo boards. Who would want the stress and aggravation, let alone the risk?

JMO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Selling would be like admitting the “demons” defeated him. There’s nothing logical about an irrational person who truly believes they been wronged, seems causing death was how he intended to win the battle. The condo board had filed a restraining order filed against him, unfortunately that wasn’t enough to protect them but in doing so they must’ve known he might be dangerous.

This tragedy is another example why I’ve long believed Canada should legalize involuntary mental health incarceration. This social media rantings, will not blatantly threatening, surely were another indication of his poor mental health.

This story is not really unique, it’s very similar to other incidents were an unbalanced and disgruntled idiot shoots up people at a prior workplace or government agency.

JMO

Involuntary commitment wouldn't have helped in this case if it had happened in the US for a few reasons.

We protect the rights of the mentally ill unless they are at imminent risk of harming themselves or others. Delusions are not imminent risk.

Also, we don't know his psychiatric history, but unless he had one, you have to have dementia or some type of brain disease at the top of your list of causes for this type of behavior. Someone mentioned lung cancer. Did he have brain metastases? That could cause delusions and paranoia. Did he have HIV? Neurosyphillis? He needed full medical workup before mental illness could be diagnosed, assuming he didn't have a psych history.

If this behavior was due to dementia or some other medical cause, you can't involuntarily commit them in many states in the US. A psych ward is meant to be for patients to get better and be discharged. While some patients with dementia and psychosis are sometimes admitted to a geriatric psych unit, there aren't many of them and patients have to meet very strict criteria for short term stay.

 

[Warwick1991]

As this dispute between is mentioned to have been longstanding, I wonder if the deceased victims were Condo board of directors throughout the entire time? I bet not. Purely my speculation based on lessons learned by my own personal experience is goes something like this - new owners get to know a few of their neighbours and then comes the annual condo meeting with vacancies on the board because of resignations or owners selling. So at this meeting longterm residents put names of totally naive new owners forth and low and behold, they suddenly find themselves not only nominated but elected to the board of directors without knowing anything about the toxic turmoil that exists, in this case specifically regarding FV.

IMO a hierarchy of property owners managing other property owners is a no win situation whether it be condo boards or home owner‘s associations.

My heart goes out to these innocent victims because they surely did not expect they’d be putting their lives on the line by contributing their time and energy to a cause that they believed was for the benefit of all residences.

My lesson learned was just say no. Following this horrible incident I’d guess it will lead to a mass exodus of many currently serving on condo boards. Who would want the stress and aggravation, let alone the risk?

JMO

I live in Florida, and we have thousands of condo associations. In fact, I live in a condo, and our association has one toxic individual who affects everyone who lives here. The organizational structure is similar to Canadian examples, with unpaid, elected board members. There are often cases of criminal assault against board members in FL, and there are frequent examples of using social media to air unfounded or irrational grievances, with abject hatred of HOA or condo association board members. Recently, a man shot and killed 2 people in his condominium in Stuart, FL, in Martin County. One of those killed was the board president, and other victim was her husband. Police: Husband and wife shot, killed over HOA dispute at condo complex Right now, I serve on my condo board, and it is simply a terrible experience... I often think something similar will happen to me, but with sky-high rent and real estate prices here in FL, it isn't easy to find another place.

HOAs and condo associations are flawed, and it's unfortunate that they are so common.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

I’m from Toronto and it wasn’t until I moved to Nova Scotia that I realized how easy it is to buy a gun in Canada.

I went to a nice store to pick up bread and salami and wandered to the back of the store—every type of gun you can imagine. And the clerk explained how easy it was to obtain one. (That was 2018. In 2020 the assault weapon ban was announced restricting the sale of about 1/4 of the weapons in the store.)


What I’ve seen suggested:
-Red flag law (A restraining order should have resulted in his losing his weapon if he had it legally).
-increase the power of LE & medical staff to issue holds. Right now if a patient is in distress but denies wishing to harm either themselves or otters …(‘others’, but I’m going to let my phone win that autocorrect)… they’re powerless.
-tougher policing/laws for illegal weapons
-zero tolerance laws when it comes to having threatening people within a community such as a condo

We have an Involuntary Psychiatric Hold law, but when the patient seems ‘stable’, it becomes next to impossible to confine them. I can think of three killers who were deemed criminally not responsible due to mental illness who were released once they were on their medications and deemed ‘safe’.

We don't know much about this guy or why he did what he did. Was he mentally ill? Maybe. Or could he have had a brain tumor or dementia or any number of other ailments that can cause delusions? Even medications can cause it.

Mental health laws are what they are because we used to do unspeakable things to the mentally ill. Mental illness is an illness and people have the right not to be imprisoned because of it. The vast majority of the mentally ill do not commit violent crime. The vast majority are more likely to be the victims rather than perpetrators of crime. Just because this guy committed this heinous act doesn't mean we should loosen restrictions in mental health law.

Loosening mental health restrictions will be fraught with abuse. For every person like this we lock up, we'll lock up about 20 completely innocent people who had the misfortune of having a mental instead of physical illness, but were never going to hurt anyone.

 

[Marysmith]

I live in Florida, and we have thousands of condo associations. In fact, I live in a condo, and our association has one toxic individual who affects everyone who lives here. The organizational structure is similar to Canadian examples, with unpaid, elected board members. There are often cases of criminal assault against board members in FL, and there are frequent examples of using social media to air unfornded or irrational grievances, with abject hatred of HOA or condo association board members. Recently, a man shot and killed 2 people in his condominium in Stuart, FL, in Martin County. One of those killed was the board president, and other victim was her husband. Police: Husband and wife shot, killed over HOA dispute at condo complex Right now, I serve on my condo board, and it is simply a terrible experience... I often think something similar will happen to me, but with sky-high rent and real estate prices here in FL, it isn't easy to find another place.

HOAs and condo associations are flawed, and it's unfortunate that they are so common.

Funnily enough I owned a condo in Florida and now own a condo in Canada. Totally hear you… it’s like work - one person can poison the whole workplace.
In Florida we had an overtly racist man as the condo board president who enjoyed the power and he was going after people for identification and stuff for no reason and here we’ve had some very difficult people attacking the board who had to raise condo fees. You can’t win… I don’t know what to say. This particular situation is just so disturbing because these people did everything right and still…

 

[cuffem]

This is terrifying news. Being a member of a condo board is a thankless position that actually consumes a lot of time and energy, and for nothing in return.

I have a friend who is currently serving as a board member and they are having issues with one of the unit owners (lawyers now involved). He was already thinking about resigning his position but this awful incident has cemented his decision.

Terrible tragedy for the victims and their loved ones. It is always extra sad around the holidays.

Thank you for saying this. I am on an HOA Board for a few years and it is a thankless position and all you hear is negative while owners/tenants can be abusive. It takes a lot of work to keep a community safe and livable. We live here also and care about what goes on. People do not understand there are reasons to have rules and not always do whatever you want.

In my opinion only that this man was suffering from some mental illness and not from a dictatorship HOA Board.

 

[realanastasia]

Vaughan condo shooting: Three victims were on condo board

Police said the gunman, who lived in the building, killed five people in three separate units.

www.bbc.com

 

[Lexiintoronto]

We don't know much about this guy or why he did what he did. Was he mentally ill? Maybe. Or could he have had a brain tumor or dementia or any number of other ailments that can cause delusions? Even medications can cause it.

Mental health laws are what they are because we used to do unspeakable things to the mentally ill. Mental illness is an illness and people have the right not to be imprisoned because of it. The vast majority of the mentally ill do not commit violent crime. The vast majority are more likely to be the victims rather than perpetrators of crime. Just because this guy committed this heinous act doesn't mean we should loosen restrictions in mental health law.

Loosening mental health restrictions will be fraught with abuse. For every person like this we lock up, we'll lock up about 20 completely innocent people who had the misfortune of having a mental instead of physical illness, but were never going to hurt anyone.

I don’t know his medical diagnosis, and I’m not advocating for a return to past warehousing of people with mental health challenges. I agree with you.

I was just pointing out some limitations that healthcare workers in Canada face when met with a person who may present as a threat to themselves or others.

I believe, based on his reported behaviour:
-he should have lost his privilege to own a firearm, if in fact he owned it legally
-he should have quickly lost his privilege to live in that condo
-if his threats and behaviour weren’t criminal, at least there should have been some civil remedy for the people he threatened for years

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

I don’t know his medical diagnosis, and I’m not advocating for a return to past warehousing of people with mental health challenges. I agree with you.

I was just pointing out some limitations that healthcare workers in Canada face when met with a person who may present as a threat to themselves or others.

I believe, based on his reported behaviour:
-he should have lost his privilege to own a firearm, if in fact he owned it legally
-he should have quickly lost his privilege to live in that condo
-if his threats and behaviour weren’t criminal, at least there should have been some civil remedy for the people he threatened for years

I agree with that. There should be consequences to threats and/or threatening behavior.

 

[branmuffin]

This is so sad. No one every imagines that they would be targeted for death for being a condo board member. It seems to me that this issue has been going on for years and during that time is was obvious his rants and diatribes were more than just ordinary responses to condo issues.

It said in one news item that he lived on the first floor. In Canada the first floor is the ground floor. In UK the first floor is the second floor. It's unusual to have residential units on the ground floor of a large condo or apartment building, especially a luxury one like this.

I guess it is possible he does hear some vibrations from the electrical room below his unit but I doubt it caused the health issues he had.

I don't know where he got the gun. He's lived in the building for about ten years so he's lived in Canada for a while. I wonder if he has any family here.

Those poor people. They were sitting ducks living in the same building. It is a thankless job being on a condo board. My husband just ended his two year 'sentence'.

 

[dotr]

Thank goodness there is some light to this dark story, one lucky lady.

Wife of transit union chief John Di Nino survives Vaughan massacre

There was one survivor after Sunday night’s shooting spree in Vaughan that left five victims and the shooter dead.

torontosun.com

''There was one survivor after Sunday night’s shooting spree in Vaughan that left five victims and the shooter dead.
Doreen Di Nino, 66, was identified Monday by her husband’s office as the person taken to hospital after police and paramedics arrived at the scene of carnage on Jane St.
She is the wife of Amalgamated Transit Union (ATU) Canada’s president, John Di Nino.''

''It seems likely that any bullets that struck Doreen Di Nino were meant for her husband.
Police have not released victim names yet, but said Monday that three men and two women died in the shooting.''

 

[Marysmith]

This is so sad. No one every imagines that they would be targeted for death for being a condo board member. It seems to me that this issue has been going on for years and during that time is was obvious his rants and diatribes were more than just ordinary responses to condo issues.

It said in one news item that he lived on the first floor. In Canada the first floor is the ground floor. In UK the first floor is the second floor. It's unusual to have residential units on the ground floor of a large condo or apartment building, especially a luxury one like this.

I guess it is possible he does hear some vibrations from the electrical room below his unit but I doubt it caused the health issues he had.

I don't know where he got the gun. He's lived in the building for about ten years so he's lived in Canada for a while. I wonder if he has any family here.

Those poor people. They were sitting ducks living in the same building. It is a thankless job being on a condo board. My husband just ended his two year 'sentence'.

They were sitting ducks, you are right. They were just doing what needed to be done.
My father was the president of one year’s ago and he said it was hell - people calling and emailing and coming to his door at all hours - and then no one else would take the position… I will never go on the board because of his situation but am thankful that others do.

 

[mickey2942]

Chilling details of condo resident, 73, who 'killed five board members in feud'

A RESIDENT from a condo building has allegedly shot and killed three men and two women belonging to the apartment board after a five-year feud with management. Francesco Villi, 73, is the primary s…

www.the-sun.com

What is oddly crazy about this, is that he looks very similar to the actor who played Jimmy's brother, in "Better Call Saul", who was also crazy and believed that electro magnetic power was affecting his brain.

 

[Erutan]

Canadian man, 73, killed 3 men and 2 women with 'semi-auto handgun'

Police have confirmed that an angry condo resident shot dead three men and two women during his rampage - after a five-year feud with the apartment board.

www.dailymail.co.uk

"... But in 2019 Villi launched his own application, claiming that issues from an electrical room beneath his unit were causing him to have severe breathing issues after he was diagnosed with ‘chronic lung disease’."

Whatever "issues" the killer, FV, was having with the condo board or the electrical generator under his unit .... the moment he decided to murder people, I lost sympathy for him !
He could have sold his condo and moved elsewhere.

And from reading here and elsewhere, he'd been bullying and terrorizing others in the building for some time.
He was not wronged or unfairly treated, and it appears they'd tried to work with him towards a resolution ?

Rest in peace to the true victims, whom I believe didn't do anything to warrant such violence !
My condolences to their shattered loved ones.
M00.

 

[loveisthemovement]

Can someone help me understand what the condo board was supposed to address regarding the construction of the building and its electrical room? I am not clear on the scope of condo boards....

 

[Tealgrove]

As the back story of FV’s issues come to light I am not surprised how this ended.

Tragic for sure.

Preventable? I’m not so sure.

Mental illness, personality disorders, are so incredibly difficult to deal with. I can’t imagine being a resident in that condo.

If he legally had guns, the guns should have been taken by LE as he was proving to be a dangerous man with the threats and harassment. He had a restraining order in place at one time and then he escalated again. I wonder why he was never arrested for uttering threats etc?

A former acquaintance of mine had his guns removed for uttering threats.

MOO

 

[dotr]

Chilling details of condo resident, 73, who 'killed five board members in feud'

A RESIDENT from a condo building has allegedly shot and killed three men and two women belonging to the apartment board after a five-year feud with management. Francesco Villi, 73, is the primary s…

www.the-sun.com

What is oddly crazy about this, is that he looks very similar to the actor who played Jimmy's brother, in "Better Call Saul", who was also crazy and believed that electro magnetic power was affecting his brain.

Oh my, you are right! imo.