Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #11

[otto]

I am 99% sure this is NOT a working farm. With only 40 acres it would be a losing proposition. It costs too much to run machinery, pay fertilizer, etc. if anything, I could see the land rented out but that's about it or maybe pasture. Besides everything was way too overgrown to be a working farm. MOO

Crops are taken off the farm. That much is obvious from google maps and google earth.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Thus my wording "IF IF IF DG was manufacturing drugs to any extent ...."

We don't even know if anything was found at the farm to indicate he is currently involved in any drug production or activity.

ETA: By "to any extent" I meant on a grand scale (I think my age is showing by the use of that term )

Totally hypothetical: I thought maybe he wasn't manufacturing, dealing or making drugs but maybe he was buying the chemicals in large amounts via P2 solutions to sell to the drug bigwigs for them to make, maybe he was a middle man. There was just that recent gang bust where of a gang member and 3 associates were arrested in Alberta and one of them arrested in Airdrie. Maybe if DG was associated to this gang, he told the cops to bargain something and they did the bust.

 

[otto]

40 acres is not a farm!!!!its an estate. Locally, we're seeing the smaller farms swallowed up and most appear to be 2500 to 3500 acres now. Who will spend a quarter of a million dollars for machinery to combine 40 acres? The land may be rented out but 40 acres is not going to generate very much income!
When they moved it was rural living ( healthy for the kids) with maybe a chicken coop and a good sized vegetable garden.

I was reading on the District of Rockyview website, and it looks like a 40 acre parcel that produces a crop is a farm, but from another perspective, it could be a big yard.

http://www.rockyview.ca/CountyServices/Assessment/AssessmentCategories.aspx

 

[kams]

If this was done (and other things mentioned), wouldn't LE have charged him with some sort of 'indignity to human remains' as well as murder charges?

They still might... This is only the beginning.

 

[Cherchri]

Sure, but I don't think we need to flatter him.

I agree - no need for flattery BUT we have speculated about his level of intellect here. He was described by LE as "brilliant" many years ago and I think we should consider what we are dealing with here. After all, he seems to have everyone stumped. I think he is likely brilliant and I suspect we are going to be horrified by just how cleverly he has kept everyone running around in circles. In the end, he forgot that many other minds would be applied to unravelling his dastardly deeds and some of those minds would very likely prove to match his intellect. Had he been more "worldly" he may have got away with this.

 

[winnnancy]

Didn't they attend the same university and have nothing to do with each other? They are convicted murderers, not the family of the murderers. Books about them probably describe their families. Perhaps someone will write a book about this case and research the families of the accused and victims more thoroughly.

That's just it. Information just becomes available.

In the case of DG there is none. It's like he came into existence upon being expelled for cheating in university. Was he a choir boy until this point? Or were there earlier signs of trouble? His family may be of interest and although they do need privacy, I'm not understanding why they'd be more entitled to that than the Likness and O'Brien families.
If we were to find that a young DG ran away constantly to a certain spot and then it turned out that this is where the bodies are....

 

[otto]

Totally hypothetical: I thought maybe he wasn't manufacturing, dealing or making drugs but maybe he was buying the chemicals in large amounts via P2 solutions to sell to the drug bigwigs for them to make, maybe he was a middle man. There was just that recent gang bust where of a gang member and 3 associates were arrested in Alberta and one of them arrested in Airdrie. Maybe if DG was associated to this gang, he told the cops to bargain something and they did the bust.

The P2 company is from recent years. The meth trafficking conviction in based on an arrest in 1992. If there was a meth lab on the property today, he would be facing related charges. He isn't, so there is no meth lab today, there is no reason to draw connections between the accused today and hell's angels motorcycle gangs. The man is accused of murder, not producing illegal drugs.

 

[otto]

DG as MH soil tested with cantest

He most likely created reports that had nothing to do with reality.

 

[bakerlady]

no kidding.

I guess you lost me then Stan. It seemed like you were implying DG should have a nicer car if he was manufacturing meth.

 

[bakerlady]

The meth charge was from 22 years ago. It doesn't seem like there are any meth charges or associations today.

So was the identity theft and yet he was arrested last month with the same dead persons credit card. Perhaps he just improved his methods and didn't get caught.

 

[stan laurel]

Do you have any basis for this - analysis?

Spend some time in Quebec (5 years for me) and follow the news.

 

[bakerlady]

I agree - no need for flattery BUT we have speculated about his level of intellect here. He was described by LE as "brilliant" many years ago and I think we should consider what we are dealing with here. After all, he seems to have everyone stumped. I think he is likely brilliant and I suspect we are going to be horrified by just how cleverly he has kept everyone running around in circles. In the end, he forgot that many other minds would be applied to unravelling his dastardly deeds and some of those minds would very likely prove to match his intellect. Had he been more "worldly" he may have got away with this.

Interestingly enough the suspect in the Abby Hernandez case, Nate Kibby, was also described as brilliant and also nicknamed 'crazy Nate'.

 

[stan laurel]

Not necessarily... Anyone with the ability to Google can set up a meth lab. Doesn't make him part of organized crime and a larger conspiracy.

In my experience, cases that have organized crime components and many layers like some are suggesting in this case, don't have charges levelled so quickly and definitively as in this case. If it did, the Crown and LE would have waited and brought other charges.

He was at-it prior to most people having Internet or decent Internet

 

[kams]

I was reading on the District of Rockyview website, and it looks like a 40 acre parcel that produces a crop is a farm, but from another perspective, it could be a big yard.

http://www.rockyview.ca/CountyServices/Assessment/AssessmentCategories.aspx

It is my understanding that the Garlands live on the 40 acres but own other land in the vicinity. I am trying to find where I read that. I live in Airdrie, and have for nearly 30 years now. I know the area well, and there are many farmers who live on smaller parcels but own many hectares elsewhere around here. I will keep looking for the article and post it as soon I find it.

 

[otto]

So was the identity theft and yet he was arrested last month with the same dead persons credit card. Perhaps he just improved his methods and didn't get caught.

Bear with me ... I'm trying to understand ... 22 years ago he was cooking meth. Because he cooked meth, he must have been associated with a gang like the hell's angels. 22 years later, he is still cooking meth and therefore still has connections with gangs. Police have not charged him with cooking meth, but that is only because he is very clever and they have not discovered his meth lab. Through his connections with the gang, either they set him up for the murders, or the gang murdered a five year old boy and his grandparents because the accused has control of gangs and they commit murders for him. Is that the line of reasoning?

 

[Cherchri]

In 89 thru 93 it was out of work chemical engineers in Alberta who were swooned. A UBC prof spent a year in jail for cooking methamphetamine. Since the stop trade of ephedera )<sp?), the brown meth trailer batch became prominent. But even the bathtub mix pop-up crowd need connections, one doesn't just pop onto the scene/territory and start dealing.

Do we know that DG was dealing? I don't remember ever seeing a link stating that he was dealing.

 

[stan laurel]

The meth charge was from 22 years ago. It doesn't seem like there are any meth charges or associations today.

some people learn from their mistakes, others learn how to circumvent those mistakes for their next attempt.

 

[Cherchri]

So the sad, quiet, loner with no friends is hanging at campuses, mommy and me classes, and public street corners? Does he strike you as a street hustler?

Absolutely not!

 

[stan laurel]

Or maybe, it was as simple as a member of the Liknes/O'Brien/Garland family that identified it? I am certain his own sister would have been able to ID it quickly.

It has always been my experience, and that of members of my family that are in LE - That, the answer is usually the one that you can connect with the straightest line.

I actually didn't say it wasn't one of them.

Occam's razor.

 

[stan laurel]

I guess you lost me then Stan. It seemed like you were implying DG should have a nicer car if he was manufacturing meth.

you think the garland acreage/farm/big-yard only has one vehicle and it's the green f-150 work truck?