Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #14

[Krystine]

Agreed :dance: So you're of the opinion that DG is nuts (sociopath). Supposing that he is, and he is responsible for these murders, what do you think his motive was? Surely it can't be the patent issue that came to naught anyway? There must be something that motivated him to do this above and beyond that situation...I'm of the opinion it would have to have been bigger than that, or there may have been a series of incidents? Big enough for him to actually murder...when up until now, he has not been violent (that we know of). Why would he do this?

That's the million $$ question...there have been a lot of theories put forward here, from the patent dispute, to the mexican condo scam that may have involved DG's parents and sis, to being one of the investors left to pound sand after AL's bankruptcy...did I miss anything? There are so many good theories shared here.
I have given this a bit of thought, and realized one can never really get inside the head of someone else. We can project and know what we would do/think/feel...but how would you even begin to figure out what goes through the head of a multiple murderer?
I can't imagine so much rage bottled up inside, to the point that he not only takes his anger out on AL, but his wife and grandchild? If he had a grudge or other issue with AL, why not just punch him out and be done with it?
I'm with Tinkerbel, if anybody has been brainstorming lately, I would love to hear what they have come up with.

 

[Krystine]

I'm thinking not, since wouldn't LE have to cover their butts by getting the actual owners' permission?

Has anyone done a title search on the G property?

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Actually if you use the google conversion it has 2 ways to show the measurement. If you go cm to feet it comes out as 5.90551. Note: not 5 ft 9 in....but 5.9...as in 9/10's. If you use their conversion in cm to inches it comes out as 180 cm = 70.8661 inches... Which would be 5 ft 10 inches rounded up would be 5 ft 11 in. It had me scratching my head too....I thought right away...5ft 9in...then realized.....ohhhh....9/10 of 12 inches not 9/12...

Thanks and good catch! I'm terrible at anything math, that's why I get google to do the math haha! So do we think it's surely 5ft 10", is that what it seems to be?

 

[Tinkerbel1]

I'm thinking not, since wouldn't LE have to cover their butts by getting the actual owners' permission?

Maybe DG is listed as an owner...or maybe he has power of attorney rights on the land in his parents' absence?
Something else I've been thinking...who knows if they were actually camping? They may not have been but didn't want any spotlights on them.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

That's the million $$ question...there have been a lot of theories put forward here, from the patent dispute, to the mexican condo scam that may have involved DG's parents and sis, to being one of the investors left to pound sand after AL's bankruptcy...did I miss anything? There are so many good theories shared here.
I have given this a bit of thought, and realized one can never really get inside the head of someone else. We can project and know what we would do/think/feel...but how would you even begin to figure out what goes through the head of a multiple murderer?
I can't imagine so much rage bottled up inside, to the point that he not only takes his anger out on AL, but his wife and grandchild? If he had a grudge or other issue with AL, why not just punch him out and be done with it?
I'm with Tinkerbel, if anybody has been brainstorming lately, I would love to hear what they have come up with.

I'm going to throw something out here that may or may not have been discussed...if not, it might bring huge wrath down on my head...but I just gotta ask...

Do we know what type of relationship KL and DG may have had, if any? DG worked closely with AL on the patent and other projects, just wondering if perhaps DG developed a bit of a crush on KL? She is described as a very nice, friendly and personable lady....outgoing, welcoming...attractive. Maybe KL was kind in passing to DG and DG became enamored of her? Maybe the thought of losing her to the move was devastating to DG. That might inspire a LOT of anger and fear in DG, primarily at AL for taking her away...crime of passion maybe? If he couldn't have her, AL wasn't having her either. Stranger things have happened. Unfortunately, NO still remains just being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

Did anyone notice the 'coincidence' that as soon as the acreage owners returned to their home from vacation, LE cleared out? Also, I don't recall ever reading anything about LE having a search warrant for the acreage (or for the Parkhill residence for that matter). That leads me to believe that LE (obviously) had the owners' permission to search each of those properties for however long they wanted to... but in the Garlands' case, the stipulation must have been, 'until we get home'. This leads me to wonder... had LE in fact had to obtain a search warrant, like in what seems to be most other murder investigations, how long would the judge have given? I'm wondering.. if it is an open-ended time frame, where the findings did not have to be stated up front, as in cases where LE DOES have to get a search warrant, would they have found what they stated they were looking for, and how long would it have taken? If LE is given authorization to poke and poke and poke around indefinitely (or for a couple of weeks), what would they find that they may not have found otherwise? Is it 'fair' that LE had this particular advantage in this case? It also makes me wonder.. how supportive are the elder Garlands to either side, LE and DG? On the one hand it seemed they were supportive to LE, but only to the point of.. as long as it didn't interfere with their own lives. If they had happened to NOT be on vacation during this time, what would the response have been then? Is it possible they allowed LE all of that time to go through their property because they believe in their son and believed LE would find nothing to support the charges? Does anyone happen to know whether LE ever searched inside the residence?

I imagine if permission wasn't granted to LE voluntarily by the Garland's...LE would've gotten a search warrant. There was no gain to be made by the Garlands' denying the search.

 

[stan laurel]

No other crimes in Calgary appear to be related to the triple murder in Parkhill.

A pillow case with a gun and a cell phone were found in the deep NE. NE Calgary is home to many new immigrants, and gang activity is more common in the NE than in any other part of the city. Parkhill is in the SW. The SW is more expensive and home to many established professionals. There is little to no gang activity in the SW. The population of the city is 1.2 million people. There is no reason to make a connection between a gun in the NE and a triple murder in the SW that happened two months ago. There is no "odd trend" in Calgary for people to "leave their lawn as dirt". Parkhill is near Macleod Trail, but in the middle of the night on a holiday weekend, there would be little traffic. There are noise bylaws prohibiting the use of vehicles that produce noise over 96 decibels, so loud backfiring cars and unreasonably loud motorcycles are prohibited.

If there were loud gun shots in Parkhill on a quiet holiday weekend, someone heard it and knew that it was not a normal sound.

firstly, some people seemed to have understood my comment about tying every crime and body found into the dg case as tongue in cheek. secondly, I do live in Calgary thank you very much and am aware many things about this city. thirdly, there is never little traffic on macleod, a blip here and there but it's a noisy ugly beast. fourthly, if one could bill vehicles for being loud in cowtown you could make a decent living. fifthly, there is an odd trend on leaving yards sodless. sixthly, gangs are everywhere and the new hells angels clubhouse is in the heart of the s.w.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

I'm going to throw something out here that may or may not have been discussed...if not, it might bring huge wrath down on my head...but I just gotta ask...

Do we know what type of relationship KL and DG may have had, if any? DG worked closely with AL on the patent and other projects, just wondering if perhaps DG developed a bit of a crush on KL? She is described as a very nice, friendly and personable lady....outgoing, welcoming...attractive. Maybe KL was kind in passing to DG and DG became enamored of her? Maybe the thought of losing her to the move was devastating to DG. That might inspire a LOT of anger and fear in DG, primarily at AL for taking her away...crime of passion maybe? If he couldn't have her, AL wasn't having her either. Stranger things have happened. Unfortunately, NO still remains just being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

You never know, stalker/obsessive types seem to leech onto those people that are friendly and personable and skew that niceness to think a feeling or connection is being made and reciprocated. From what we know - I could see KL being an energy someone like DG would be fascinated by and attracted to, but who knows if they even ever interacted over the years. It's a curious question, and like stan said, nothing's off the table in this case.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

firstly, some people seemed to have understood my comment about tying every crime and body found into the dg case as tongue in cheek. secondly, I do live in Calgary thank you very much and am aware many things about this city. thirdly, there is never little traffic on macleod, a blip here and there but it's a noisy ugly beast. fourthly, if one could bill vehicles for being loud in cowtown you could make a decent living. fifthly, there is an odd trend on leaving yards sodless. sixthly, gangs are everywhere and the new hells angels clubhouse is in the heart of the s.w.

Ha! I believe you about the yards! Here in Edmonton, people are starting to install astro turf in their yards...just like on the football field. And as far as the noise goes...fireworks and firecrackers are continually being shot off here!

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Has anyone done a title search on the G property?

Don't think so unless I missed it, I don't know how….I'm assuming it's public record but maybe you have to fill in the FOI forms to get it? I'm totally out of the loop on that kinda stuff. Someone on here probably knows...

 

[stan laurel]

My friend has a father who would drive from White Rock to Ghost Lake on 1 tank of gas in a Honda CRV. It drove us crazy but he had it mastered. If anything DG would need to top up half way and refill for the return trip and possibly a top-up. In BC the gas has to be pre-purchased before pumping, this can be done with credit cards at the pump or cash to the cashier. ETA - it could also be syphoned from another vehicle or kept in a jerry can in the back....

dual tanks, common in Alberti, maybe not in Ontario. best way to vansewer from cowtown if you want to siphon your way there would be south on hwy 2 then west on highway 3.

 

[otto]

firstly, some people seemed to have understood my comment about tying every crime and body found into the dg case as tongue in cheek. secondly, I do live in Calgary thank you very much and am aware many things about this city. thirdly, there is never little traffic on macleod, a blip here and there but it's a noisy ugly beast. fourthly, if one could bill vehicles for being loud in cowtown you could make a decent living. fifthly, there is an odd trend on leaving yards sodless. sixthly, gangs are everywhere and the new hells angels clubhouse is in the heart of the s.w.

Dirt yards must be mud pits in the winter! Perhaps some parts of the city are less noisy, with better tended yards, and no gangs? Is it true that people in Parkhill would not recognize three gunshots in the middle of the night?

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

Did anyone notice the 'coincidence' that as soon as the acreage owners returned to their home from vacation, LE cleared out? Also, I don't recall ever reading anything about LE having a search warrant for the acreage (or for the Parkhill residence for that matter). That leads me to believe that LE (obviously) had the owners' permission to search each of those properties for however long they wanted to... but in the Garlands' case, the stipulation must have been, 'until we get home'. This leads me to wonder... had LE in fact had to obtain a search warrant, like in what seems to be most other murder investigations, how long would the judge have given? I'm wondering.. if it is an open-ended time frame, where the findings did not have to be stated up front, as in cases where LE DOES have to get a search warrant, would they have found what they stated they were looking for, and how long would it have taken? If LE is given authorization to poke and poke and poke around indefinitely (or for a couple of weeks), what would they find that they may not have found otherwise? Is it 'fair' that LE had this particular advantage in this case? It also makes me wonder.. how supportive are the elder Garlands to either side, LE and DG? On the one hand it seemed they were supportive to LE, but only to the point of.. as long as it didn't interfere with their own lives. If they had happened to NOT be on vacation during this time, what would the response have been then? Is it possible they allowed LE all of that time to go through their property because they believe in their son and believed LE would find nothing to support the charges? Does anyone happen to know whether LE ever searched inside the residence?

I don't think it's going too far out on a limb to assume LE had all the warrants necessary, and that it is NO COINCIDENCE that the parents returned to the property AFTER LE concluded their search.

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

http://www.newstalk770.com/2014/08/30/body-found-in-fish-creek-provincial-park/

Do we know for certain the body found is unrelated to this case? The below statement from LE does not give an approx age as was being reported by msm? What sticks out is the comment the body, believed to be male, would indicate difficulty to determine due to condition being deteriorated????

From CPS
A passerby saw what appeared to be a body stuck in some trees in the river in Fish Creek park shortly before 1:00 Saturday afternoon. The area is near Mallard Point in the community of Queensland in the SE.

Shortly after 1:00 the Medical Examiner was called to the scene. The body, believed to be male, has since been removed from the park and taken to the Medical Examiner’s office. Autopsy results may not be released until after the long weekend.

It's probably pretty safe to assume since LE didn't close off the river and park to search for the other 2 victims, and that it hasn't been the biggest news story in the country for the last 24 hours, that it's not related to this case.

 

[otto]

I don't think it's going too far out on a limb to assume LE had all the warrants necessary, and that it is NO COINCIDENCE that the parents returned to the property AFTER LE concluded their search.

How could they return home if the property was an active crime scene? They had to wait until the search was completed. It was reported that they were staying with friends while the acreage was being searched. Have they returned to the acreage since that time?

 

[Tinkerbel1]

How could they return home if the property was an active crime scene? They had to wait until the search was completed. It was reported that they were staying with friends while the acreage was being searched. Have they returned to the acreage since that time?

I think you're both saying the same thing.

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

How could they return home if the property was an active crime scene? They had to wait until the search was completed. It was reported that they were staying with friends while the acreage was being searched. Have they returned to the acreage since that time?

Re-read it.

 

[LoriMcA]

Voila, mystery solved!

Thanks and good catch! I'm terrible at anything math, that's why I get google to do the math haha! So do we think it's surely 5ft 10", is that what it seems to be?

Well..the conversion chart/tool is solved...*had me befuddled for a bit there too!*

Whether or not he is the height they have listed....who knows...I do know cherchri said from being at the courthouse...he didn't seem that tall... My son, son-in-law & hubby are all around the 5'9 - 5'10 mark...not 'overly' tall but not short either...so I dunno...I'm 5' 1 1/2...so to me...they are ALL tall!

As to the eye colour...DG's appear brown...but if they are like my daughter's...her DL classifies them blue...but depending on mood and what she's wearing....they can be blue...blue/green...or gray....has been since she was an infant...her brother on the other hand is unmistakeably...ice blue...always...never changed. In the pictures of DG from what we can see...maybe he is a combo...like a dark hazel...maybe depending on mood & light setting/colours surrounding? Who the heck knows....could be an out & out error in eye colour on their poster. I think at this point with all the media about him....most of us would recognize DG JMOO

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

Well..the conversion chart/tool is solved...*had me befuddled for a bit there too!*

Whether or not he is the height they have listed....who knows...I do know cherchri said from being at the courthouse...he didn't seem that tall... My son, son-in-law & hubby are all around the 5'9 - 5'10 mark...not 'overly' tall but not short either...so I dunno...I'm 5' 1 1/2...so to me...they are ALL tall!

As to the eye colour...DG's appear brown...but if they are like my daughter's...her DL classifies them blue...but depending on mood and what she's wearing....they can be blue...blue/green...or gray....has been since she was an infant...her brother on the other hand is unmistakeably...ice blue...always...never changed. In the pictures of DG from what we can see...maybe he is a combo...like a dark hazel...maybe depending on mood & light setting/colours surrounding? Who the heck knows....could be an out & out error in eye colour on their poster. I think at this point with all the media about him....most of us would recognize DG

He was on CCTV in court as well, so without taking offence, how could anyone make the distinction between 5'6" and 5'10" from a monitor without some very detailed reference points?

 

[stan laurel]

Voila, mystery solved!

I'm not sure, because, I was just in my garage and found this odd little object that fit in the palm of my hand yet claimed to be 12 feet long. After examining it, my finger caught a little metal clip and then a strip of metal came out of it marking inches and centimeters. SO?,,, so I continued pulling on the metal strip until I reached 180 cm's and it too was marked in inches as 70 and 7/8ths of an inch. And no offense to Cherchri, but doesn't TV make everybody seem shorter. Other pictures like the airport would have been better if they stated the height of the Sherriff escorting him. The perp walk also has him as slouching forward but he does seem taller even at that over the blonde reporter.