CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #3

[nicgumshoe]

Didn't he have the code because when he arrived for a visit he would punch the code in and enter through the garage and meet Ms Gleave inside? I'm sure I read that somewhere. So either he had it because he used it when he visited or because he might need it one day to get tools if she was out?

It does say that in the Spec story, part 2

"When he visited, Phil would push the number code on the keypad outside the automatic garage door, meet her in the garage, then chat either inside or out. That was the routine."

from: http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/594717--audrey-s-story-continues

 

[roseofsharon]

Wondering if AG had had any run-ins with any of the neighbours regarding her dogs. I know she had the invisible fence, but did she always have this fence and how long did she have Togi and Schatzen.

 

[LilyMacBloom]

I guess there is another bit of a discrepancy..

It does say that in the Spec story, part 2

"When he visited, Phil would push the number code on the keypad outside the automatic garage door, meet her in the garage, then chat either inside or out. That was the routine."

from: http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/594717--audrey-s-story-continues

 

[nicgumshoe]

I guess there is another bit of a discrepancy..

Maybe her original purpose was he use it if she was out and he needed tools to work, but then it developed into a routine of him just going in the garage when he got there. That way she could finish up whatever she might be doing and eventually meet him in there.

That could be the routine that lead to her murder. Although, you'd think the dogs would have barked and if she wasn't expecting PK, she would have looked out the window. Who knows, maybe the killer had a similar car to PK's, she saw it and thought it was him, or thought she saw him.

Or like has been said, the dogs were barking as they always did when PK arrived, she heard the garage door, thought it was him, crated the dogs and.....

It was the season to be jolly, so she may have had her guard down somewhat because of that, and because she was under the weather.

--------------------------
Of course if PK's our man, maybe she looked, saw him and went to meet him as usual.....

 

[2soccermom]

Oh brother! I posted on their site about re-posting without quoting their source and my post was deleted!!:floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

I did notice when I read their rules for the forum that they are SUPPOSED to provide a source for their information, but I guess hearsay works just as well for them, which is unfortunate. How do you spell plagerism?

Hi all --
I am new to the websleuths forum (as a member, only; I have been one of your reading "guests" -- only because I had trouble registering with my email address) but I am a member of the unsolved canada community, under the moniker "soccermom". I have found both groups to be incredibly valuable. I will also out myself to say that I wanted to send a message to LilyMacBloom that is very, very important to me, and that is precisely the reason I formally joined your group rather than continuing to read your posts as a visitor. So i think, unwittingly, I am the spark for some of this discussion.

I'd just like to say, as a new member here, I was careful to explain to websleuths admin that I am a poster on the other site (which formally seems to violate membership rules) as well as my intention to join in order to send a member a PM.

I have on a few small occasions referenced the interesting work you do here on WS -- but I have never stolen info or otherwise acted in any way that I believe could be construed as inappropriate. My question to LilyMacBloom came out of a genuine and (to me) fairly urgent query. If you look at my public posts, I did ask my UC community on Audrey's thread if anyone knew how to become a member here because I had several failed attempts in trying to message the member. Out of respect for LilyMacBloom I did not name the poster or the info; my intention was always to keep this particular info confidential.

I cannot speak for other posters on this or the UC site. But again i think it was my message that has in part sparked this resentment, and I'm sorry for this. My intention was only ever to be frank but engaged, and to try to work together on something I genuinely am concerned about. The reason we are are on these sites is to engage not only in collective mourning but to attempt to work together as a community to find resolution for the missing and the murdered.

LilyMacBloom, I sent you a second message privately before I read this thread. So i will understand that your response remains the same. I understand, but I'm not sorry I tried. I think that you all are working passionately together and I hope that there will be resolution and justice for Audrey (and others) whether that comes from LE or from amateur sleuthing....

I will continue to be a member of both communities; I have cleared that with the WS admin. And I will continue to enage with responsibility and integrity, as I know all of you do as well.

Finally, I'm not suggesting any of you mayn't have good reason for concern for how your posts get taken up or (mis)appropriated. Or vice versa. Only that I also see how the two sites are working toward genuinely common aims and that there is excellent work being done at both. And I would like to very, very gently encourage you to see that wanting to communicate about what may be crucial info may not be intended as a "territory" or turf violation but a genuine exchange.

apologies for my very long first post.

 

[2soccermom]

and apologies, too, for interrupting the discussion with a long apologeia.

 

[dotr]

Just popped back on and wanted to welcome you to WS!

 

[2soccermom]

thanks warmly, Dotr. It's nice to be welcomed :wave:

 

[Sillybilly]

Or like has been said, the dogs were barking as they always did when PK arrived, she heard the garage door, thought it was him, crated the dogs and.....

<rsbm>

PK gave the impression that the dogs were at large looking for an opportunity to "nip at his heels" when he was in the yard, and they were not caged or confined while he visited with AG on the couch.

I have to say when i first read the part about PK visiting with AG "on the couch", my first thought was that when I have company, if they sit on the couch, I sit in an armchair ... if they sit in the armchair, I sit on the couch (well, of course ... otherwise that would be absurd. LOL)

WELCOME 2SOCCERMOM !!

 

[nicgumshoe]

<rsbm>

PK gave the impression that the dogs were at large looking for an opportunity to "nip at his heels" when he was in the yard, and they were not caged or confined while he visited with AG on the couch.

I have to say when i first read the part about PK visiting with AG "on the couch", my first thought was that when I have company, if they sit on the couch, I sit in an armchair ... if they sit in the armchair, I sit on the couch (well, of course ... otherwise that would be absurd. LOL)

WELCOME 2SOCCERMOM !!

WELCOME 2SOCCERMOM too!

It sounds like they were often loose. Though in Part 2 of the Wells story it says,

"As close a friend as Phil was, of all the times he was in the house, she never served him coffee or watched TV with him. They would always chat on the same couch, just outside the kitchen. She would either shut Togi and Schatze in a large kennel crate she kept in the house, or urge them to be nice to Phil."

from: http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/594717--audrey-s-story-continues

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

WELCOME to 2soccermom!

I've just got all caught up reading our posts and here's my thinking - I don't rule out any male. Especially males who are 'young and close'.:twocents:

As for a female killer of AG - nah, not a chance!! (Unless the male who killed AG had some sort of accomplice/someone he later confided in/etc.)

 

[nicgumshoe]

WELCOME to 2soccermom!

I've just got all caught up reading our posts and here's my thinking - I don't rule out any male. Especially males who are 'young and close'.:twocents:

As for a female killer of AG - nah, not a chance!! (Unless the male who killed AG had some sort of accomplice/someone he later confided in/etc.)

I'm thinking If the killer is responsible for AG, SV and SL he possibly doesn't live close to AG. Or maybe he moved from the Orangeville area to a new job in AG's area.

I guess it depends on the scenario. My thoughts:

a) AG knew and let her killer in: (lives close)

b) The killer knew AG and stalked her: (may not live close)

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Quoted from nicgumshoe:

Of course if PK's our man, maybe she looked, saw him and went to meet him as usual.....


:cupcake::websleuther::cake::cupcake::websleuther:

I wonder if PK is sick of 'cakes' this Xmas!!

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

I'm thinking If the killer is responsible for AG, SV and SL he possibly doesn't live close to AG. Or maybe he moved from the Orangeville area to a new job in AG's area.

I guess it depends on the scenario. My thoughts:

a) AG knew and let her killer in: (lives close) I'm going with THIS scenario!!

b) The killer knew AG and stalked her: (may not live close)

Comment inside of the quote!:twocents:

 

[LilyMacBloom]

:woohoo:

Welcome to the group soccermom I look forward to your opinions and sleuthing.

 

[roseofsharon]

<rsbm>

PK gave the impression that the dogs were at large looking for an opportunity to "nip at his heels" when he was in the yard, and they were not caged or confined while he visited with AG on the couch.

I have to say when i first read the part about PK visiting with AG "on the couch", my first thought was that when I have company, if they sit on the couch, I sit in an armchair ... if they sit in the armchair, I sit on the couch (well, of course ... otherwise that would be absurd. LOL)

WELCOME 2SOCCERMOM !!

For sure Sillybilly -- I even do this with the people who are the closest to me -- I think most people appreciate that personal space.

 

[dotr]

I wonder if someone had been lurking outside the garage waiting for an opportunity to get inside the house once AG and the dogs left by car.Maybe he slipped in to get a peek at some of AG's papers in her purse or to snoop out details of her will (choosing this particular time after noticing that AG was sick...sending funereal type song..)and not liking what he saw, flew into a rage ...

 

[dotr]

No "diss' to any senior ladies out there, but some of the supposedly little old lady types around here (mostly mutton dressed as lamb) if given the chance to sit side by side on a couch with a comely young man , would certainly result in a serious "cougar' attack!

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Here's something else I was wondering - just how sick was AG? Was it simply the seasonal thing we all seem to get living in this changeable climate (fever, sniffles, body aches, etc.) or was it something I'd call serious?

I know influenza is very serious - did AG have that? Or something else?

Now, if AG had something very serious/potentially deadly - who would know about it? Who would she tell - LV possibly. Her doctor, obviously. Her pharmacist might know by the meds prescribed. But then again, PK said she didn't take prescription meds.

Too many unanswered questions.......:twocents:

 

[nicgumshoe]

No "diss' to any senior ladies out there, but some of the supposedly little old lady types around here (mostly mutton dressed as lamb) if given the chance to sit side by side on a couch with a comely young man , would certainly result in a serious "cougar' attack!

Yikes! I'm having visions of parlor guitars and serenading.

I guess that would be one case where you wouldn't wanna know your chops.